Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations What the HECK does it take to get a pond?

Hi, all. I've read here off and on for over a year hoping to join. Here is our situation...

A year ago (June or July 2006) we called the local NRCS pond guy because we wanted to build a pond. We had met him a few years ago when he came to tour the home we were building, as he and his wife were preparing to build.

NRCS guy scheduled a time to come but doesn't show. Came a week or so later unannounced to look our site over. Shot elevations, put out flags, then talked to us about clearing trees. (We wanted the wood so we told him we'd do it.) He recommended a contractor and told us they normally build ponds November-January, so we told him we'd call him when we finished clearing trees.

Because we had to wait until we got out of the burn ban to get rid of all brush, it was early December when DH called him. He (NRCS guy) made an appointment to come out, didn't show (again) and didn't call, didn't answer or return DHs phone calls. A few weeks later, he shows up unannounced and again does elevations and flags. Said he'd follow up a week later with our drawings. We never heard from him.

Fast forward a few months to spring 2007. DH called NRCS guy again (several times) and left messages but he wouldn't return our calls. ?? Finally, out of frustration, DH just called the pond contractor and asked him to come out. He did and was surprised the NRCS guy hadn't called us back and/or given us drawings. Pond digger said he was really busy but promised us a "hole" by July 4 and said he'd get with NRCS guy to see what was going on with the lack of communication.

A few months later (about 6-8 weeks ago), DH called pond digger to be sure we were still on the calendar and we supposedly were. Now that we're down to a week from July 4 and we haven't heard from the pond digger, I suppose DH will call him and see when - IF EVER - we will get a pond. DH will NOT call the NRCS guy again, as he is peeved by the guy's failure to do his job.

(As an aside, we have a friend who works at NRCS with the guy who won't return our calls. Friend has mentioned to this guy several times that we're waiting on our drawings, waiting on a phone call, waiting on our pond, etc. These casual mentions by our friend have fallen on deaf ears. *sigh*)

MY QUESTION IS THIS: Is there a magic word or secret password that we don't know about? *grin* What the HECK does it take to get a pond?

Okie, I am sorry to hear of your troubles. You are bringing up a subject that has been discussed several time on this site.I have heard that you get better results by contacting the NRCS Regional office or the state office and escalating the issue. I my own personal opinion the NRCS is one of the biggest waste of our tax dollars. I know some other folks have had good experiences with them. My own personal experience was less than good. I think they should shut the the whole department down.

Here is the trend on my experience.
http://www.pondboss.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=000184#000000

Thanks, Tim. I read your thread - good info! I didn't realize this was a regular topic here, so I must have missed those posts. :rolleyes:

There are a ton of people with dozers we could call (heck, my uncle owns a local oilfield construction business), but we have a lot of upstream acres where our runoff will come from so we really wanted it designed right. *sigh*

We thought we were doing the right thing contacting NRCS. I think we actually did the right thing - it just hasn't worked out so well. I've told DH in the past that we should go "up the ladder" a notch, but we haven't as yet. Maybe I'll bring it up again if/when it ever quits raining! *grin* Speaking of rain, we have a pond now even though we have no hole... Luckily, we are high above the site.

The NRCS is like every other place. Some really great people and some duds. You're dealing with a dud. I would have absolutely no problem going up the ladder. Where in Oklahoma are you?

Hi Dave. We are in NW Oklahoma - just south of Enid a few miles.

I'm sure you are right about good and not-so-good folks in every industry. I remember reading horror stories here 1-2 years ago about people who just "picked a spot and dug a pond" with disappointing results. The person who pointed me to PondBoss back then suggested we get with the NRCS.

Oh - and we had water over our spillway last night. We don't officially have a spillway, but we had water running over it!

Okie, I think, after considrering everything, that I would probably go without the NRCS guy. I believe that I would get some Topo maps of the area and try to calculate my own watershed. Maybe find a Geologist to help. Then, I would find a dozer guy that knows how to shoot levels and grades; or maybe just hire an Engineer.

If you go over the guys head, he will, at best, be an unwilling participant.

Okie, if both the resources yer trying to get help from continue to ignore you, you can sort of do what i did. as a disclaimer, i dont highly recommend this approach to anyone without some knowledge of dirt, heavy equipment, and some modicum of people skills....but FWIW:

get a couple of bob lusk's books (i.e. read and learn about pond construction), and be yer own GC (general contractor). this way you can hire back hoe moe or dozer dan and make sure they do what you want and do it right.

i mention the people skills part, cause back hoe moe and dozer dan usually have no pond experience and think the things you ask them to do are ludicrous...so it can take some effort to get those folks to understand, get enthused, and go the extra mile for you.

if i had the money to hire it all out, i probably would have to save my time, but the experience of doing it myself (of course with two other VERY capable friends) was an unforgettable project of a lifetime.

DD1 raises great points about shooting elevations......dont hire moe or dan unless they can do this proficiently.

good luck.

Laser levels are wonderful and can be rented, although they ain't cheap.

I'm with Dave; he's a dud. You now have practical experience with him; use what you've learned and move on.
Yeah, I'm one of the guys that has great experiences with the NRCS...and continue to do so. Strangely, tho, I didn't use them for the engineering or construction of our pond. Our NRCS guy did provide some quickie calc's of the drainage...they matched what my contractor and I already figgered. My NRCS guy did take some GPS readings of our pondsite clearing and laid them on a aerial strip map...very cool, but not necessary for actual pond construction. Quite frankly, our NRCS guy told us right from the beginning that he was gonna be mostly backseat unless we were planning on a wetland type pond. That's the stuff they are now mostly interested in and have the time/money appropriated to develop. Make no mistake, our NRCS agent is top shelf; never mislead me nor made empty promises. He is a key player in our WHIP development and has done nothing less than deliver. He just wasn't equipped to get involved in our pond project.
So, what next? Yep, either DIY like DIED (and numerous other enterprising self-made pondmeisters on this forum) or pay somebody that DOES have the expertise. I paid; I have ZERO regrets. Easy to say, tho, cuz we had local help and did the research to find the local pond wizard. Oh yeah, another thing. He was the most expensive. He told us so right up front. His credentials carried him to breaking ground and his performance carried us to an unbelieveable pond product. (in case you haven't bumped into it, here's the first PB forum thread that I created that is pretty close to where you are (or will be) right now.
To me, you're next step is the most important and difficult...finding the contractor to build your dream. If ya nail it, you'll always look back at the lousy NRCS service ya got and smile at the bullet you dodged.