Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations Experienced Pond Meisters vs. Rookies

It seems that there are differnt types of Pond Meisters? IE. Serious "mad scientists" vs. "weekend warriors"... etc.

Should the advice given to these different types of Pond Meisters vary depending on the experience level of the person seeking help?

IE, What may be an option for someone with 25 years experience, may not apply to someone who is trying stock a pond for the first time? For example: Should a rookie try fertilization right off the bat or just stick with the basics until more experience is gained?

A good question.

I think level of effort also comes into play. A rookie who will research (here & elsewhere) a bunch, is willing and capable to spend time & money on the pond, access experts for help you can't do yourself (electro-shock, chemical application, etc.) when needed can handle a lot more complicated fishery than a rookie who can't do all this. (I guess I'm describing a "Mad Scientist j.g.")

By and large, I think the advice we give here IS tailored to the level of the recipient. We frequently ask for more info to help us determine the correct level.

The MAY be problems if someone takes the wrong level of advice out of context (?). But how can you protect everyone from making mistakes?

Theo and Gator :

Good points. In addition to those concerns we have to think about the other readers out their who have who knows how much experience and where they are from. What you correctly tell someone who posts a question in Tex. may be wrong for a reader with the same type of problem in Penn. It is a daunting task and one I have been cautious about for some time. ewest

Gator,

This is an interesting topic. One for which there is no perfect answer or solution. I have seen many posts recommending a certain approach because it is "tried and true". The thinking is that if you stick to the conventional, you can never go wrong. That is not the case at all. In fact, the conventional can be disastrous.

You mentioned fertilizer. The very worst advice I have ever experienced on this board deals with fertilizer. Conventional thinking, at least three or so years ago, was that you fertilize to get rid of weeds…. weed problem? No problem just fertilize and they will go away… In fact, many still believe that is the way to go.... and in fact may work for someone somewhere.

As a newbie, several years ago, I read that advice on this Forum. I thought that the rationale does not jive with my common sense (fertilize to get rid of weeds?), but if these guys, who are the experts, say it works, I'll try it. The single worst mistake I have made, even worse than stocking pure Florida strain LMB. Three years later and I still have not recovered.

My solution is to only write about what I have personally experienced, regardless of whether it fits someone’s norm or not. It is important that readers see many (all) sides to any given question, so that they can make up their own minds on what is best for them. I believe that readers, even new ones, who get to see all sides of an issue are better off for it, not worse off.

Another relevant more recent example is the case of Pat’s situation. I was widely criticized for stating my beliefs that LMB can indeed become conditioned, especially with high fishing pressure. In Pat’s case, he fishes two to three times a WEEK.

Some said, I should not tell Pat that LMB can become conditioned because it would negatively affect him. I do not agree. I believe a poster is far better off seeing all sides to an issue than being sheltered from views, which may not necessarily be positive. I believe and subscribe to the Fox news view…”we report, you decide.”

I report only my experiences…it’s up to the reader to weigh that against others experiences and decide what is best for them. I would dearly love for someone to have warned me about Florida bass 4 or 5 years ago. Maybe I would have proceeded anyway, but I certainly would like for all the evidence to be on the table. Not telling someone about things which you see and experience simply because it may not be positive is not doing a service, in my opinion. Similarly, restricting posts to only that which others say is the norm, does not add value. Value is in diversity of views and experiences, not dogma.

ML, I believe you make a strong point. With the great wealth of knowledge here I believe it is good to see both ends of the stick. Tried and true and not so. A visiter can see all that has been done by the pros and the mad scientist. The only thing that sometimes is missing is the mad scientist results which you brought up in an earlier thread. I believe we should be careful not to be persuasive in our ventures until there is a positive result.

I experiment with and study ponds daily now. I have only posted a few experiments here as to not mislead anyone visiting us. I am not a pro and this is not how I make a living. I do however manage a small number of ponds (free) for a learning base. Who is to say person A who has spent weeks and months studying a specific situation is not as knowledgeable as person B who is labeled a "pro"? That is why we have great debates here from time to time. Sometimes that bottom line has a ripple in it that was not noticed till person A brought it to light. Many of us devote much time to this forum to make it great for the occasional visiters. A debate is great for them to see the do and not to do and make their own decision. For someone to come here for advise to try to manage their own pond they have to make their own first step. Make decisions. This forum is what got me started a few years back and I thank you all for the good, the bad and the ugly.

BTW,

I borrowed the term "mad scientist" from a post I read last week - I like the phrase, but cant recall the person who posted it. We should all strive to be "mad scientists" to the degree that we try new things and test the old.

Perhaps Experienced Pond Meister vs. Inexperienced Pond Meister is more accurate for what I am describing here. To put it another way, what are pond basics vs. advanced pond issues - IE what pond management techniques (if any) require experience?

Gator

AaronhomeIN,

I, for one, would love to read about your experiments...please do not let that fear keep info away from the rest of us. Heck, put a big "mad scientist" sign in your signature.

I did that for that very reason...but man I'd love to read about any experiments..that's food for the mind.

This is an interesting thread. I always start advising based on what the caller/client knows, where he is and what his goals are.
One of my favorite stories, though, was an interview back in the 70's with legendary UCLA basketball coach John Wooden. The reporter asked, "What is the first thing you teach your freshmen athletes?" Without hesitation, Coach Wooden responded, "I teach them the proper way to put on their socks." His logic was simple, yet wise. "If they don't wear their socks correctly, their feet bother them. If their feet bother them, they can't play the game."
So, no matter who I talk with about pond management, I always try to feed them the most basic information, even if the situation seems totally complicated. All management begins with habitat. Then, food chain. Then, genetics. Then, management of dynamics primarily via proper harvest. Do those things in order, management works. If you have habitat for walleye, and try to grow channel catfish...it probably won't work. If you have habitat for largemouth bass and want smallmouth...it probably won't work. Always start there, whether it's water, plants, crustaceans or fish. Don't leave any of those "big four" out of your thought process, or your odds of success drop.

As a newbie, several years ago, I read that advice on this Forum. I thought that the rationale does not jive with my common sense (fertilize to get rid of weeds?), but if these guys, who are the experts, say it works, I'll try it. The single worst mistake I have made, even worse than stocking pure Florida strain LMB. Three years later and I still have not recovered.

Okay, considering I just put 50 Fl strain lmb in my pond, I would be curious why that was the worst mistake you have ever made?

Tom,

That's an excellent question, probably worth posting as a new topic.