Pond Boss Forums POND CONSTRUCTION Creating habitat Rock piles as structure / cover

My new 1/4 acre pond is about 1/2 full, 6.5' deep on its way to 12-13'. I spent a few days lugging boulders/rocks from all over the property to build two nice rock piles. I followed instructions from different previous posts: in the shallow area, lots of larger rocks, ~6' x 6', 4-5' high. Lots of nooks and crannies for the GSH/FHM to hide in. I plan to add some nice extended brushy section a little ways away in med. depth water. I'd like to know how far away the brushy section should be from the rock piles, and also, what should I be considering for cover for the bass to ambush the little guys......striving for balance where it's not too easy for the bass, but not too difficult.

See pictures below (hopefully no one says Wrong! get rid of them and start over from scratch!) Any feedback suggestions appreciated.

https://photobucket.com/share/093ca0c2-6c98-41eb-907a-0b7802ac9314

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Yup, cant see.

I don't have photo bucket so can't see either.
As for the rock or brush structure placement, there's no such thing as bad structure, some may just be slightly better then others.
That being said, one always looks for structure to find the best fishing and in so doing, I've been amazed at some small structure that seems insignificant may hold a ton of fish all the time and some beautiful looking structure that you would swear should hold a ton of fish, doesn't, just one of them things that keeps us from thinking we got this all figured out.
Or at least that's what I have found.
I remember one time we were fishing in a pond with medium amount of structure, we found a little willow sapling on a rock lined dam, didn't amount to the top 1/3 of say a Christmas tree, and we pulled about 40 really nice BC off that darn thing during a spawn, filled a cooler.

Okay, I'm confused. This forum doesn't allow a simple "insert" so you can just post a photo. So I signed up for Photobucket as I heard it was good. I posted the link to three images, but apparently no one can see the images.
Help?? Can anyone explain how to post the pics?

Update: tried again. Let me know if you can see the pics.

https://photobucket.com/share/093ca0c2-6c98-41eb-907a-0b7802ac9314

Oh I don't doubt your pics are probably posting, I just dont have a photo bucket account to open them, I think I could if I signed up for an account.

I opened an Imgur account so I put photos up with it, and with the right code the photo actually shows on the page.

Please explain how to post pics, if there's a simpler way! Honesty, I have no idea why it should be difficult....other forums I go to it's simple. There've been a bunch of times here where I would really like to post a pic, which would make my issue very clear to other members. I'd like to be able to do this, obviously. It says to insert a link, but I don't have any images posted elsewhere on the web.

Here's BJ's pictures.
Nice work BJ!!
I'll send you a Private Message how I post them tomorrow.

I totally agree. Amen. Amen. It is why I don't post pics here. As an example go back several years ago and look at those "scarred up" - defaced Photo-Bucket pictures that were very often used back then. IMO all those old pics are basically worthless today.

Rock Piles - IMO it would be more beneficial if those piles were at least 3 times longer and maybe a few of them start a foot shallower down to current depth in the pics. IMO Each of those current sizes of rock piles will not support very many crayfish. Depth placement is pretty good. One has to remember rock piles are primarily for small fish habitat as feeding areas (colonizing invertebrates) and refuge spaces. For better rocky habitat one whole shoreline should have a continuous rock pile although the height of the pile would not need to be as tall as those in the picture. IMO Two to three rock layers of height would be adequate.
Adding tree top brush between the current rock piles would improve the habitat complexity.

Learninboutfish- Thank you ! I would really appreciate that. I'd love it if I could even avoid the monthly charge, but it's pretty minimal, so if Photobucket is the best method, I can live with it. It's just I don't really need it for anything else...I really only need it for this site. Don't need any of their organization/album/etc. features.

Hey Bill, please clarify: "maybe a few of them start a foot shallower down to current depth in the pics." Are you saying "shallow" in terms of closer to shore as it slopes up? For the one on the right (shallower location) it's already within a few feet of shore......I can do that, but it's already going to be pretty shallow....if you mean extend another 3' in the other direction, that's easy....(well...."easy", even though I'm doing it 100% by hand, so it's a slow process...) For the one on the left, with the steep slope up to the bank, are you saying extend THAT practically up to the bank?

My intention for the rock piles here is for "small fish habitat" as you mention. A place to hang out safely before they inevitably get gobbled up. I can definitely do the "tree top brush" between....but if you're suggesting maybe that I could make the two piles instead be ONE CONTINUOUS pile, extending up to the shoreline, I could do that. Do I read that right? And of course what simplifies that process would be that they would only need to be a couple layers high. Please clarify, and I'll put this in motion!

Crayfish: I had originally thought of adding crayfish, since I had visions of my own personal supply of them for when I feel like whipping up some delicious Louisiana Crayfish Etouffee- but I was advised right here on the forum, that for me it would wind up being nothing more than quickly-depleted "expensive bass food." After that I gave up the idea. However, since my HSB will be stocked in late October at 5-7", and presumably it'll take awhile for them to get big enough for the crayfish to become easy prey....maybe that gives the crayfish enough time to develop a large enough population to withstand the pressure.....? But also, I have a pond liner....so if crayfish would try to burrow down into that, it's a big problem.....please advise.

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Interesting.....so you're saying ONE 40' "pier/dock" extending ~40' out? Bear in mind my pond is only 1/4 acre (see pics below that Bill kindly posted)....40' out is essentially halfway across the pond. If it's only a couple feet deep; that is, much lower than the height of my rock piles now - it is definitely doable, though it would be a project doing it by hand. Please clarify, and thanks for the good info.

I'm no professional by no means except when it comes to eating fish, I am a professional at that, but its been my experience that your crayfish and smaller fry fish are going to stay in pretty shallow water along the shoreline.
If you do have some really good cover further out they will congregate there as long as it is shallow enough.

That is some great looking structure you have going there! good looking pond.

Obviously if the rock bar was extended out 40 ft out would be great, but that would be a pretty big project involving a ton of work and money, if it was me I would concentrate on more rock in shallower areas, to benefit your small fry.

When your rock is more then 6 ft deep it will hold fewer small fish and therefore will not be as big a benefit to you. return on investment, if you will.


That's just my opinion tho. Good Luck and lots of great fishing!

..... just one of them things that keeps us from thinking we got this all figured out.

Yep....I'm a big baseball fan, and there's a famous former genius baseball GM named Theo Epstein: led the Cubs to their 1st world series win in about 100 years. Then he went to Boston and did the same. In his office in Boston where he'd meet w/ all his young genius analysts, to remind everyone about humility, he had a big sign prominently posted: "WE DON'T KNOW S**t"

BJ - Love the rock piles. Looks like you have a great start on them.

As to the posting of pics....when using he "Use Full Editor" button there is an attachment manager you can post pics on and that will put a small pic at the bottom of the post. If you run your cursor over the files being uploaded there will be an option to "embed" the photo which will put it in the post where your cursor is located like you are typing. I don't use photobucket, just post them from my desktop or laptop PC.

Hope it helps!

Your timeline on this is backwards. Theo won the 2004 and 2007 World Series as the Boston GM then 2016 World Series as the Cubs GM.

I'm embarrassed! Just wrote that thinking about the point I was making. You are entirely correct, I KNOW THIS, and it's especially egregious because as a lifetime Dodger fan (since 1962), I remember- painfully- how the Cubs eliminated us in the 2016 NLCS on their way to their first WS championship.

Back to Rocky Habitat.
"""maybe a few of them start a foot shallower down to current depth in the pics."
Are you saying "shallow" in terms of closer to shore as it slopes up? For the one on the right (shallower location) it's already within a few feet of shore.

Always remember shallow water is a type of refuge and security of small fish especially when other habitat is lacking. Bigger predators cannot get into the shallowest 1"-2" deep water. This is why minnows often hang out in the beach areas.

IMO ponds for fisheries cannot have to many rocks. I love rocky habitat. Rocks and logs are natural good shoreline habitat in many lakes. Thus I like to see rock piles extend from 3ft to 6ft deep up the shore to the waters edge. Although some pond owners might not like this type of pattern. When using rocky habitat, I like to see one entire shoreline have rocks. This makes lots hard surface structural areas for invertebrate colonization. One pond that I am helping with is impressive and extreme. It has all of the entire shoreline lined with rip-rap down to 6 - 7ft deep he used 6"-12" and 12"-18" rocks. Plus he created two impressive corner areas that have 30-40 ft long areas with 24"-30" big rocks down to 8 ft deep. Smallmouth love this rocky shoreline. Lots of rocks mean lots of habitat that helps produce lots of natural foods and refugia for small fish.

One thing you might try is pile your rocks onto some pallets as one to two layers or rocks held up off the bottom by the pallet/s. This would have a similar configuration of your current rocks piled on the narrow building blocks in your pictures. Small fish could get underneath the rock pile until the pallets rot and decompose - what maybe in 10 -15 years and then sludge/muck fills in underneath the pallets. Brush rows as various sizes of trees or tree tops on each end of long rocky areas would be beneficial.

Pond liner and crayfish. This is an unknown to me. To be on the safe side I think I would not stock crays if I had a pond liner. Some crayfish species might try and dig into the liner while other species would not try to dig through it. If you have a stream within around 0.5 mile of the pond, I think you would get some rainy night natural migration of crays into the pond from the stream. With good rocky and tree top habitats you should be able to get a decent fishery without crayfish.

Okay.....so no crayfish.

I like the idea of the pallets, and since I have a few just laying around, I'll put them to this use.

Based on your suggestions, I'm thinking the following modifications: I can't really use the "entire shoreline" but I can at the very least greatly expand/extend the rock pile on the left (the close-up pic).

I'll place the pallets in front of the pile on the left, covering them w/rocks, cannibalizing most of the other rock pile (seems like I should leave maybe part of it there, since basically you and others are saying "you can't have too many rocks," etc.) Then keep adding more rocks as far as I can, which realistically will result in the pile being about 10' long, and wider than it is now.

Yes? I'm anxious to get started!

NOTE: I've tried 50 different ways to orient the image properly and it refuses. Always displays the same incorrect orientation....I'm lost. So I just left it as is and you'll have to turn your head sideways....grrrrr......

Okay for enlarging your rocky areas. Be creative - the more expansive it is the more habitat that is created that in turn increases productivity.

I like what local municipal water supply reservoirs do by adding city waste concrete from construction projects to line the shorelines. Concrete pieces extend from above the surface down the entire slope to the flat bottom area. This creates lot of habitat. Fish like to patrol the rocky shore areas and where concrete pieces meet the flat bottom. Concrete lined shores also stop wind and wave erosion of the shorelines.

Great. I'm going to go out and get started NOW. Funny you mention concrete- I was just going to ask about whether there was anything wrong with using a bunch of concrete, since I have a ready supply from a big pile of blocks, etc. near a local site. Picked up a bunch today. Won't be able to line a shore with it....not near enough....would be complicated....but I can sure use it to provide depth/mass to the extension of the rock pile. It will really come in handy. Plus I like the idea of the cinder block-style ones, as I can see the little guys hiding in there (talking the smaller openings; obviously 6" openings aren't too much protection.)

Nice work on the rock piles!

I like rock piles but my primary interest is about 10 ft cedars close to the shorelines. It covers a lot of growing fish and larger fish orient on them.

On that smaller rock pile, consider lifting it on top of cinder blocks and spread out the size or area that it covers or on top of several pallets. Almost every manufacturer or small company has many pallets for free. Just as for permission for getting them. Tree tops could be laid horizontal on the bottoms of the rocks to hold the brush down to keep the brush in place from floating lose in the pond. IMO you want the rock piles to sort of serve as weed beds or large dense structures as refugia areas and not to serve as small fish attractor structures. Small structures actually concentrate predators who eat many of the fish that come close to it for protection. Refugia are large expansive areas such as lake weed beds that provide protection for thousands & thousands of small fish.

If you are using FHM I would lay those flat pieces of concrete on top of one layer of rocks spread out among 5 -10+ pallets so the concrete pieces have lots of various types of elevated angled pieces; some even vertical. Lots of jagged pieces angling upwards; a city of upward angling irregularities. Be creative.

Search this topic in In-Fisherman website:
Habitat and the Importance of Structure By Dr. Hal Schramm
April 15, 2021

I like that idea of the layout you suggest, Bill, as well as what some others here have mentioned, such as cedars, etc. Makes sense and simple to do: I have lots of trees/logs/etc. available in my wooded acreage. Plenty of cedars! Ready supply of pallets at my local Ace Hardware. Question: someone I know with lots of construction experience cautioned me on using "too much" concrete....says chemical composition varies, and it's good to know what I'm using; that you can determine this by checking online. That would be easy for the ones I got from Ace: damaged in some way so they can't sell; they're happy to donate them to me. But I've got a bunch of grabbed from a construction of some kind and I don't know anything about their origin/composition. Any thoughts?