Pond Boss Forums STOCKING A NEW POND Types of fish to choose Recommendations for Saugeye stocking

Hey all, per Mr. Lusk, I've been given permission to start this thread on Saugeye for sale and more importantly, what they should be used for and the variables that affect the outcome.
First off, let me explain that the research available has been from within state-agencies that raise this hybrid and the stockings conducted by me in the private sector have been modeled after state stocking methods and the results have been fairly uniform to expectations.
Saugeye originally were produced as an aggressive option to walleye, particular in areas WAE recruitment was historically low at best. In these cases, it didn't seem to matter what the stocking rates were-or the size of Walleye stocked.
The one thing these impoundments had in common was warmer water in mid summer, slightly less visibility and lower dissolved O2 profiles which also followed a total acreage size of less than 300 acres.
Along these lines, stocking of SAE began and many things changed that were somewhat unpredicted.
One item that became apparent fairly quickly was year-end zero recruitment. It took quite a few years of data to determine if this was widely variable, and as it has turned out, SAE fry stocking vs WAE stocking produces on average, about 11 times better return and nobody has an answer-specifically-why that is.
A secondary change that was noted was panfish species started increasing in size-dramatically-and more and more research continued on this and the pattern followed suit in 99% of the locations studied.
This was about the point a lot of heads came together and determined SAE are not shad dependent such as what is normally present in healthy WAE populations achieving good growth rates. There are other pelagic forage species that WAE do well on in more northern impoundments, but those species don't reproduce well-if at all-in smaller impoundments. The SAE were obviously keying in on sunfish species more common to littoral zone locations.
At this point, research began on concentrating stockings where BG, GSF, BCP, WCP and such species were uncontrolled and stunted in most conditions. This is about the time period I became involved with this program and have been able to observe for 18 years exactly how these impoundments were changing with my own eyes. The most recent program began 5 years ago in a 2 acre pond where BG blew up in a manner we started extracting fyke nets with 1000's of BG out of every net on a single night set. This pond was stocked with FHM, GSH, BG and later that fall, SMB of 10-12" and CC of varying sizes.
In 2022, we stocked 50 SAE of 5" size to get started. By fall of 2023 these had achieved 15" and the decision was made to put 100 more in at a smaller 4-5" size to work on the next year class of BG.
Spring 2024, original SAE were 19-20" and had thinned down BG numbers and allowed some good growth of remaining fish (BG).
At the size limit of 18", some of the original stockers were being harvested so the addition of 100 intermediates would be cropping from the bottom-up (most effective control of a species). No additional stockings in 2024. In 2025, 3,000 fry will be stocked following previously conducted research that shows 2-3% survival year end 2025 should be expected.
In the summer of this past year, good numbers of larger BG were being caught alongside good numbers of very nicely sized SMB.
This is 1 of 100's of impoundments that have continued to show very similar results using the same stocking principles.
I want to add that NE and other states are transitioning to SAE in many historically WAE impoundments based in large part to these findings.
Another point of interest is the SAE will do well outside of the normal range of WAE-especially in warmer, more turbid waters.
As far as what that range is... that's uncharted territory. We have some data on decent recruitment in northern TX, and due to this, we are anticipating acceptable numbers being possible across the northern-most parts of TX thru the northen half of AR, the northern 1/3 of MS, northern tier of GA across the western parts of NC and on up from there. I'm sure there are parts in the western U.S. where they will do fine but state approval could be tougher, but I will sure make the calls if requests come out of those western locations.
Reasons to stock or NOT to stock :
SAE are not for everyone, like anything we do here, 1 change affects many other areas in most cases.
Where I find SAE fit best are where LMB may not be desirable or are not getting the job done controlling certain panfish species.
Factors to consider are goals for your fishery, are you wanting WAE and they don't grow as they should, are BG or Crappie out of hand, or do you just want a fish that looks and tastes like a WAE but your small pond is not appropriate for Walleye-most are not and WAE tend to grow much slower in a pond of less than 35-50 acres. In most cases studied, SAE by end of year 2 were 25-30% larger than WAE in the same impoundment.
If your pond is pretty well balanced I would not recommend upsetting the basket by stocking SAE.
SAE can be utilized similar to HSB in low numbers as a bonus fish.
SAE are much more aggressive than WAE, typical of hybrid vigor in other species we see also.
SAE will frequent extremely shallow water at night after achieving a certain growth point. Early in life as fry, they primarily live in a pelagic manner where plankton densities are most abundant, and with their earlier hatch time, they are big enough that species such as B&WCP that also move to these areas shortly after hatch, become targets of the SAE.
Each case really requires an evaluation to understand what is expected and recommendations can vary slightly from one pond/lake to another.
There are cases where fingerlings are appropriate but in most cases, Fry are stocked at a rate specific to the condition of the ponds and have proven to return nearly identical numbers at 1 yr.
Stockings of fry for existing fisheries are from 1,000/ac to 1,500/ac and will be shipped via Fedex overnight services, day 3 post hatch to be stocked on day 4.
We are taking orders for fry NOW and I will be fertilizing "X" number of eggs based on our stocking needs and the number that we receive requests for. Shipping should begin around 4/10/25 until we are done hatching requested numbers. The entire process can only be stretched so far due to timing requirements, which may possibly be 10-12 days of total hatching.
As most understand, we have to get cleared to ship into most states and this requires some paperwork. All fish will be shipped with parent stock health certs and a copy of your states approval documents which most want pre-shipment approval 14 days prior to, so this leaves us about 60-70 days to accept orders for fry.
Intermediates of 4-6" will be available in limited numbers and are not required in most cases. Again, the fry stockings are from 22 years of collection data on different stocking rates and those numbers have proven adequate to achieve a fishable population or as predators without adding tremendous transportation fees.
I welcome any questions on the forum about this process and expectations you may have.
If you wish to discuss via phone, my number is listed in my business link below.
You can also contact TJ Hudson or myself via email.

TJ- tj@hudlandmgmt.com
Kenny- kenny@aquaticspecialties.info

Saugeye do quite well near here in Buckeye Lake, a large, shallow (average depth might be 6') 200 year old BOW originally built to supply water for the Ohio-Erie Canal system. The lake gets a ton of pleasure boaters and water skiers in the Summer, when the churned-up water looks like a dirty Latte.

Snipe,

Thanks for this long post. Also, thanks for this project!

There is one segment that I don't understand at all:

"One item that became apparent fairly quickly was year-end zero recruitment. It took quite a few years of data to determine if this was widely variable, and as it has turned out, SAE fry stocking vs WAE stocking produces on average, about 11 times better return and nobody has an answer-specifically-why that is."

Does the "zero recruitment" refer to stockings of walleye fry? Meaning there were many times in Kansas that walleye fry were stocked and subsequent sampling found zero older fish?

Otherwise, if stocking walleye fingerlings (or slightly larger) and getting zero recruitment to larger fish, that sounds to me like there are a lot of factors making walleye a very poor choice for stocking in this region.

Your saugeye project sounds very beneficial to me in many circumstances. Even more so, if the closest alternative is a truly terrible choice.

Just to add, Indiana has given the green light for SAE stocking. I will have the state required paperwork to Snipe within 30 days.

Great post Snipe! You and I talked several times last year about getting Saugeye in my pond, but we never made it happen. You thought it would help the crappie fishery. I'm glad to see you moving forward with this as I think it'll be a great thing for a lot of BOW.

Man I wish we could get those here in Canada!

That's one thing I've never looked into but we have been "over-doing" health inspections to cover great lakes regions and I guess I could inquire. Pretty sure I know what the answer will be but I'll look into it.

Rod, what that should read is "year-end, year zero recruitment" as-in first fall prior to being 1 year old. The bottom line is they recruit much better than year zero WAE, again, we don't know why.
As for zero recruitment of WAE, yes, in fall net samples following spring fry stockings, fry have not proven to enhance the population much if any. It was "assumed" SAE fry stockings would show similar results but not the pattern that emerged.
As for your comment on getting very low recruitment from intermediate fish size stocking of WAE, yes, obviously they are not going to prosper there and as to why, some factors can be determined as a cause, other factors we may never know.

FWIW a supplier here looked into getting SMB fry from Canada. The amount of paperwork required was so much/so bad that he gave up.

"Road trip!!!" (-Animal House, 1978)

We're taking your brother's car.

Guys, need to clear a few things up on stocking strategies..
For the first stocking, recommendations are 1500/ac. For annual stockings thereafter 1000-1200/ac will give a good representation of year class recruits. If stocking biannually, the rate would be 1200-1500/ac. By the end of yr 2, an assessment needs to be made on progress for the SAE AND the forage structure, rates can then be adjusted to best suit the conditions.
I've received quite a few emails regarding follow-up stockings in which case we can address that in each situation.