Pond Boss Forums MANAGING AN EXISTING POND Evaluating and adjusting fish populations Bass Keep Going Missing

Hi y'all im on a new account couldn't get into my old one. I have a 1.25 acre pond in glen rose tx and have put a couple rounds of adult bass into the pond over the last three years.

Long story short catch rates are still very low and on top of that the overall population of adult bass seems extremely low. I can count on two hands the bass I have located about the 1lb size in the pond over the last 6 months. Our electro survey last year also yielded disappointing results.

The couple bass I have are very healthy and over weight which seems to confirm the appearance of low numbers of bass.
Having now brought in hundreds of fingerlings and adults over the last 3 years I can't figure out where these fish have gone.
It appears I've lost quite a few in the process or they somehow are escaping my vision and lures consistantly over the months and years.

quite an unusual problem but one that I'd rather have than an pond overrun with bass.

For background my pond is very clear and I can see and fish about 80% all over the surface area of the pond so I get a very good idea of what's swimming around on a given day.

Thoughts, solutions anything anyone has got is welcome.

How much visibility (24/7/365) do you have over the pond. Could some avian or mammalian predators be removing large fish? Osprey, Eagles, Cormorants, Otters? (Heck, I don't know how far South Glen Rose is - Gators???)

What else did the electro survey show?

For example, if you have a ton of crappie, they spawn earlier than the bass and bluegill. If the crappie fry and then fingerlings eat all of the forage sources for that size range, then there is very little left for the newly-spawned bass and/or bluegill.

Also, remember that bass are cannibals. If there is very little forage available in the pond, then the large bass will eat all of the small bass.

Do you have stocking rates/dates/sizes of the Bass are they LMB or SMB?

To expand on Rods question regarding the survey, were there BG? What size ranges?

you can see a good 5-7 feet deep but that's just a guesstimate. Considered the otter possibility but haven't ever seen any proof of it. No dead fish, bones, tracks, etc. I'm not on the property every day so it's possible one is escaping me. I'd say a bird of some sort is more likely. But again no evidence at all on the shorelines.

we never brought in crappie thank goodness but it is possible there's a giant or two snacking on our young adults. we brought up 3 bass last year in the survey that were 3+ pounds and were the initial stockers. So maybe they're 5+ plus now... and going to town on our 1'bers? idk thoughts???

-100 fingerling tiger bass stocked 3 years ago along with 3000 bluegill.

(haven't seen or caught one of these initial stockers since 2023, last recorded in 2023 were a few at 3lbs+)

-85 northern bass feed trained (1-2lbs) stocked this summer along with 1000 bluegill.

(only caught and seen maybe 10-15 of these northerns all summer and fall)


that's all the stocking history to date. it was a brand new pond we built. bluegill population is still booming and has various size classes. The few bass we have caught are above weight and healthy.

Not an expert in pond management but I have over 50 years in fishing experience. So I'll defer to the experts to advise you on pond management.

From my fishing experience. Clear water and a bounty of bait fish makes catching Bass a challenge.

From my PB forum experience Florida strain Bass are known to be very selective when feeding, Northern' s tend to be more aggressive.

Tiger Bass are a cross but from what I've read are also aggressive.

Are you using artificial baits or live bait with light line?

From my very limited experience in pond management. Given the information you have provided. Unless the fish you have stocked were not stocked properly and died upon stocking, I can't imagine that they are not present and avoiding being caught.

Have you or others harvested any or have you been exclusively been practicing catch and release?

Thanks for the additional info.

Can you easily catch BG with a small hook and a bit of worm? If there is a good population of BG, then there should be forage for the bass.

The bass stocking numbers sound fine - in my non-expert opinion. Did you stock any fathead minnows or similar forage before you stocked the 100 fingerling tiger bass? Those fingerling bass probably could not eat much BG forage in their very first year.

Hopefully, some experts above my pay grade will drop into your thread.

exclusive catch and release so far. not opposed to culling but just haven't got there yet. I've mainly fished artificials

yeah I've tried using some live gills and throwing them out but to no avail so far

So, is this a correct LMB stocking summary?:

100 fingerling LMB
85 1-2 lb. LMB

So, approx. (185) LMB stocked in a 1.25 acre pond?

If you didn't have some kind of inherent mortality or predation by other factors, I would expect you'd see quite a few LMB.

I don't know if you said if you were feeding or not, but that does tend to congregate fish to where you may see more LMB.

yep that's correct. that's my point. the 85 adult bass we brought in were feed trained. I only see 5 or 6 that come to eat at the feeder. theres a good 70-80 of those not accounted for

and again those 100 fingerlings initially mentioned should be in the 2-5 pound range now and haven't seen any of those in over a year

Thanks.

Yes, something is wrong for sure, in my opinion. Feed trained LMB, I believe, eat feed even if they have enough natural forage to not need it.

Give it time.

Stocking 85 adult LMB is like stocking a bunch (850) 2 in. LMB. Do you see any yoy LMB (LMB spawning)? What is the size structure of the BG?

I recall you may have said you don't live at the property.

Has anyone suggested a few game cameras to see what may be going on at the pond?

If it was birds, or otters, would you still have a thriving bluegill population?

I like the game camera idea!

Eagles & ospreys carry off their victims from my pond, back to their nest or away from the pond to a more secluded area.

Otters have not left much after their meal to show that they were there, except for the TGC that was about 25# to big to eat everything & to big to carry off.

I watched a great blue heron spend more than a half hour trying to get a 9" CNBG positioned so he could swallow it.
He finally did! He looked very proud of himself.

Might there be a two footed predator?

Always possible. I’ve that difficulty, a long time ago, and solved it in an uncomfortable manner.

Try a seine survey.

I would try to rule out predators of the two legged, ten toed, variety. Part of the problem could be there.

Another possibility could be that you have a LMB population in balance with the available foods. It would not be possible to have 100 LMB at 3 lbs each in a 1 1/4 Acre pond earning a sustainable living on in situ produced forage. As fish grow, competition for food creates a mortality headwind where survivors tend to be the fish that ate at the expense of their peers. There will ultimately be balance between the biomass of LMB and the foods that support and grow them. Mortality is the penalty for not competing for a limited source of food and this allows for continued growth of survivors. At your location, around 5.70 lbs of consumed forage is needed to maintain 1 lb of LMB biomass. You mentioned that your catch rates are low. Can you provide specific details on times spent fishing and how many were caught? Also, the sizes of your LMB are important. The larger they are, the fewer of them that you have (and vice versa).

The feed trained 85 averaged 1.5 lbs (just averaging the 1 to 2 lbs at stocking) and that estimates to ~125 lbs just for the feed trained LMB. Was this rate of stocking recommended to you? 125 lbs of LMB in your climate can be supported on yearly consumption of ~368 lbs of high-quality feed. If all survive, they cannot grow on that yearly ration. But if say 25% of them die each year, the survivors will fill the biomass that 368 lb ration will support. IOWs 368 lbs of consumed feed will grow 64 LMB to fill the 125 lbs the feed will carry where they will average 1.95 lbs (growing 33% in weight). So a good question is how much are they fed annually and how much of that feed is being consumed directly by LMB?

Something to keep in mind about feed trained LMB. Winter can be tough time for them. In the six months from October 1st to March 31st, in an average climate year at a DFW location, LMB need around 1 lbs of feed for each pound of body weight. LMB are less active during this period and feed may not be consumed as readily as in summer. When feeding is curtailed during the cool months, feed trained LMB would have to compete with the other LMB for live fish prey. This creates headwinds for both the feed trained LMB and those that are not.

I am not sure what your expectations are in terms of the survival of your stocked LMB but you may have higher expectations than what is possible in a 1.25 acre pond taking into account forage and feed consumption. So it can be difficult to distinguish between what is mortality due to unwanted predators and what is normal mortality given the food consumption limitations. Whatever it is, you will want to pin it down before stocking more fish.

Any flathead catfish in the pond?