Pond Boss Magazine
https://www.pondboss.com/images/userfiles/image/20130301193901_6_150by50orangewhyshouldsubscribejpeg.jpg
Advertisment
Newest Members
TriadDawg, space30cowboys, Mark from VA, GeoKuntz, fethiye
18,406 Registered Users
Forum Statistics
Forums36
Topics40,826
Posts556,102
Members18,407
Most Online3,612
Jan 10th, 2023
Top Posters
esshup 28,275
ewest 21,448
Cecil Baird1 20,043
Bill Cody 15,065
Who's Online Now
3 members (anthropic, Tinylake, jpsdad), 427 guests, and 183 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69
A
azteca Offline OP
OP Offline
A
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69
Hello.

Mutualism relationship between Smallmouth bass and Crayfish, does it promote the spawning of Smallmouth bass.

Do all Crayfish attack Smallmouth bass nests, like in this picture.

https://www.academia.edu/30029742/I...us_implications_for_bass_nesting_success
A+

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 21,448
Likes: 257
E
Moderator
Hall of Fame 2014
Lunker
Offline
Moderator
Hall of Fame 2014
Lunker
E
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 21,448
Likes: 257
"The invasive rusty crayfish (Orconectes rusticus) and smallmouth bass (Micropterus dolomieu) engage in reciprocal predation during the bass spawning season;. "


It is invasive and more aggressive than most craws. All craws will eat an egg if available and SMB and LMB love craws as a high energy food source.

The effect of craws (density) is a bigger factor on BG and smaller nesting fish who can't eat the craws.


INVASIVE CRAYFISH ORCONECTES RUSTICUS (DECAPODA,CAMBARIDAE) IS A MORE EFFECTIVE PREDATOR OF SUBSTRATENESTING FISH EGGS THAN NATIVE CRAYFISH (O. VIRILIS )

BYJOSHUA W. MORSE, A. K. BALDRIDG and L. W. SARGENT


Oberlin College Department of Biology, Science Center 119 Woodland Street,Oberlin, OH 44047, U.S.A.



Department of Biological Sciences, University of Notre Dame, Galvin Life Sciences Center,Notre Dame, IN 46556,U.S.A.

ABSTRACT Non-indigenous crayfish pose substantial threats to native species, community structure, and ecosystem function in invaded lakes across the globe. The well-documented range expansion of the rusty crayfish Orconectes rusticus is an ideal system to study potential relationships between the attributes that contribute to invasive success, and the ways in which non-indigenous species alterinvaded systems. In Michigan and northern Wisconsin (U.S.A.) lakes whereO. rusticus is replacing its native congener O. virilis it is thought that O. rusticus invasion may account for decreased fishabundance. However, not all of the potential mechanisms that could drive this process have been explored. We examined the hypothesis that O.rusticus are better benthic egg predators than O.virilis,and tested the prediction that O. rusticus would consume substrate bound fish eggs at a higher rate than its native congener. Support for this hypothesis would suggest that O. rusticus may be able to access a high-energy food source better than O. virilis, and exert predation pressures that could limit the abundance of fish species which might otherwise limit crayfish populations through top-down control. In laboratory experiments, we determined that O. rusticus exhibit a positive correlation between feeding rate and carapace length not displayed by O. virilis and that larger O. rusticus feed at a higher rate than their native congener. We also found that O. rusticus in laboratory feeding trials engaged in longer feeding events than crayfish foraging in situ in a substrate-spawning fish nest, a factor which could give O. rusticus an advantage in resource competition with its native congener O. virilis. Collectively, these findings support the hypothesis that O. rusticus is a better predator of substrate bound fish eggs than O. virilis, and suggest that direct predation by crayfish may influence fish reproduction in lakes where O. rusticus replaces O. virilis

Last edited by Bill Cody; 01/27/22 07:53 PM. Reason: word spacing corrections















1 member likes this: azteca
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69
A
azteca Offline OP
OP Offline
A
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69
Hello.

Thank you, I have Orconectes virilis, so I should not worry too much.
A+

Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69
A
azteca Offline OP
OP Offline
A
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69
Hello.

I find that the interaction between the Smallmouth bass and Crayfish is very strong.

Smallmouth Bass actually excrete a chemical through their skin, which mimics the smell of a crayfish. This smell will make crayfish come out of their hiding spots to protect their territory thinking it's another crayfish and the bass just waits there and gobbles up the unsuspecting crustacean.

http://underwaterfishphotos.blogspot.com/2019/02/why-do-smallmouth-bass-catch-and.html

A+

2 members like this: esshup, anthropic
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 3,132
Likes: 565
F
Lunker
Offline
Lunker
F
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 3,132
Likes: 565
Great video, azteca!

Judging by all of your recent posts and links on Pond Boss, I am going to guess that it is a wee bit chilly in Quebec this week?

Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69
A
azteca Offline OP
OP Offline
A
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69
Hello.

We've been freezing at -25-30c for almost a month.

Quickly the spring.
A+

Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 15,065
Likes: 449
B
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Lunker
Offline
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Lunker
B
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 15,065
Likes: 449
azteca - are you thinking of using smallmouth (SMB) in your ponds as a predator which is why you are doing the SMB-crayfish literature searching?


aka Pond Doctor & Dr. Perca Read Pond Boss Magazine -
America's Journal of Pond Management
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,851
Likes: 294
A
Online Content
A
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,851
Likes: 294
Originally Posted by azteca
Hello.

I find that the interaction between the Smallmouth bass and Crayfish is very strong.

Smallmouth Bass actually excrete a chemical through their skin, which mimics the smell of a crayfish. This smell will make crayfish come out of their hiding spots to protect their territory thinking it's another crayfish and the bass just waits there and gobbles up the unsuspecting crustacean.

http://underwaterfishphotos.blogspot.com/2019/02/why-do-smallmouth-bass-catch-and.html

A+

I read the very interesting post about how smallmouth decide whether or not to eat a particular crawfish (we don't call them crayfish in Louisiana), but I didn't see anything there about a chemical excretion. Do you know where that info came from? Fascinating stuff!


7ac 2015 CNBG RES FHM 2016 TP FLMB 2017 NLMB GSH L 2018 TP & 70 HSB PK 2019 TP RBT 2020 TFS TP 25 HSB 250 F1,L,RBT -206 2021 TFS TP GSH L,-312 2022 GSH TP CR TFS RBT -234, 2023 BG TP TFS NLMB, -160




Joined: May 2009
Posts: 5,714
Likes: 281
R
RAH Offline
Lunker
Offline
Lunker
R
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 5,714
Likes: 281
A friend came ice fishing yesterday in my YP/SMB pond, and he brought some tech (depth finder/fish locator/camera). He only caught one decent SMB (14-15") and then a few 6-8" fish, but all were really fat. He also only caught one larger (6-7") YP and several smaller ones, and again they were very fat. Surprisingly, his tackle allowed him to hook a couple dozen 3-5" golden shiners which appear to be feeding everyone else. The water was murky, but it was apparent that here was little plant life even though prior to adding papershell crayfish, the curly-leaf pondweed was getting out of hand. Don't see much pondweed anymore. I think the murkiness is plankton rather than suspended solids. Update: His son caught a couple larger YP on Saturday.
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Last edited by RAH; 01/30/22 04:24 AM.
3 members like this: H20fwler, azteca, FishinRod
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69
A
azteca Offline OP
OP Offline
A
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69

1 member likes this: RAH
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 21,448
Likes: 257
E
Moderator
Hall of Fame 2014
Lunker
Offline
Moderator
Hall of Fame 2014
Lunker
E
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 21,448
Likes: 257
Originally Posted by azteca
Hello.

I find that the interaction between the Smallmouth bass and Crayfish is very strong.

Smallmouth Bass actually excrete a chemical through their skin, which mimics the smell of a crayfish. This smell will make crayfish come out of their hiding spots to protect their territory thinking it's another crayfish and the bass just waits there and gobbles up the unsuspecting crustacean.

Chemical warfare !

Sent you an email last week.
















Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69
A
azteca Offline OP
OP Offline
A
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69
Hello.

Yes Mr Cody.

I can't wait to play with them, like with my Yellow-perch,and make video
A+

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,984
Likes: 266
D
Moderator
Lunker
Offline
Moderator
Lunker
D
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,984
Likes: 266
Azteca, fascinating links. Thanks for posting.


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69
A
azteca Offline OP
OP Offline
A
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69
Hello.

To catch Crayfish.

It would be interesting to see the difference between a trap that was used to catch Bass and another trap, right after being used to catch Bass.

Maybe it will take a few days or wash the trap , to get rid of the smell of Bass.
A+

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 28,275
Likes: 737
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Lunker
Offline
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Lunker
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 28,275
Likes: 737
Originally Posted by azteca
Hello.

To catch Crayfish.

It would be interesting to see the difference between a trap that was used to catch Bass and another trap, right after being used to catch Bass.

Maybe it will take a few days or wash the trap , to get rid of the smell of Bass.
A+


I have never found a bass (largemouth or smallmouth) in any of the minnow traps I have had in ponds. In fact, in the Fyke net I use, I have never caught a Largemouth or Smallmouth (or Hybrid Striped Bass for that matter) in it.


www.hoosierpondpros.com


http://www.pondboss.com/subscribe.asp?c=4
3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69
A
azteca Offline OP
OP Offline
A
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69
Hello.

Then it's difficult to catch Bass even at 4 to 5 inches, it's just for the smell, it's special.

Well we can take Yellow-perch.
A+

Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 128
Likes: 11
J
Offline
J
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 128
Likes: 11
Nice looking perch above.
Those articles are interesting Azteca thanks.
I also have never caught a bass in a trap. Seine net works but hard without two people.

1 member likes this: RAH
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69
A
azteca Offline OP
OP Offline
A
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 561
Likes: 69
Hello.

A friend noticed that crayfish come to the Bass nest, if he put a light to prevent the crayfish from coming, will it disturb the Bass, or will they get used to it.
A+

Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 3,132
Likes: 565
F
Lunker
Offline
Lunker
F
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 3,132
Likes: 565
Originally Posted by azteca
A friend noticed that crayfish come to the Bass nest, if he put a light to prevent the crayfish from coming, will it disturb the Bass, or will they get used to it.

Were the male bass on the nest waiting to spawn, protecting eggs, or protecting the fry? I would think it would be very risky for crayfish to approach during any of those periods.

Or were the crayfish sneaky, and eating eggs during the brief periods when the male left the nest?

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 21,448
Likes: 257
E
Moderator
Hall of Fame 2014
Lunker
Offline
Moderator
Hall of Fame 2014
Lunker
E
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 21,448
Likes: 257
A Cutting Edge article in PB mag a few issues back was on craws and their relationship with several species including SMB. The article was in issue May-Jun 2022. THE CRAYFISH RELATIONSHIP. West discusses use of crayfish in sport fish ponds reviewing some results of a few research studies having different summaries.

Last edited by Bill Cody; 01/18/24 07:07 PM. Reason: added issue month and year
















Link Copied to Clipboard
Today's Birthdays
North Crest Farm
Recent Posts
What did you do at your pond today?
by jpsdad - 02/26/24 04:11 AM
Winter die off
by WiYeti - 02/26/24 04:04 AM
Texas hunter hanging feeders?
by jpsdad - 02/26/24 04:03 AM
Congratulations Bob Lusk!!
by Pond Star - 02/25/24 10:50 PM
HB George
by highflyer - 02/25/24 11:41 AM
Best Way to Keep Your Pond Full (humorous)
by Dave Davidson1 - 02/25/24 06:31 AM
6 acre, LMB, Rainbow, specks, sunfish
by gehajake - 02/24/24 02:26 PM
New pond middle TN: establishing food chain?
by BJ Nick - 02/24/24 01:33 PM
Caloric Densities for bass forage
by jpsdad - 02/24/24 10:13 AM
Dissolved Oxygen under ice, longer days
by Tinylake - 02/24/24 07:13 AM
Fish delivery SE Michigan
by Dergib - 02/23/24 09:43 PM
Sludge floating in pond
by Mark from VA - 02/23/24 08:54 PM
Newly Uploaded Images
Eagles Over The Pond Yesterday
Eagles Over The Pond Yesterday
by Tbar, December 10
Deer at Theo's 2023
Deer at Theo's 2023
by Theo Gallus, November 13
Minnow identification
Minnow identification
by Mike Troyer, October 6
Sharing the Food
Sharing the Food
by FishinRod, September 9
Nice BGxRES
Nice BGxRES
by Theo Gallus, July 28
Snake Identification
Snake Identification
by Rangersedge, July 12

� 2014 POND BOSS INC. all rights reserved USA and Worldwide

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5