Pond Boss Forums POND CONSTRUCTION Selecting a site Upstate Newb

Hi everyone,

I just stumbled across this site. It's just what I've been looking for.

I'm in Upstate New York and am starting to play with the idea of putting a pond in. I've read a lot of the posts on the site and gotten some ideas, but still have a few questions. Just for reference I'm thinking of a 40 X 60 pond. I have no outside source of water (i.e. stream). I wouldn't mind being able to support fish but that's not my main goal. Mainly want it for the visual aspect and for the kids and dogs to play in and around.

This past weekend just for "fun" I dug out a "hole" (the kids call it our pond) that's about 6' diamater and 5' deep at the deepest point. About 2.5' down I hit pretty dense clay. I hit ground water at about 5' and now have about 8" of water in the deepst part. I'd love for this "hole" to be the start of one side of the pond and for it to reach back into the lot (there's a gradual slope towards the back of the lot). I picked this spot to play around with because I have an 8" drain pipe running from my driveway dry well that allows rain overflow to be carried off into the back away from the drive. I thought this would be a nice extra source of water for my "hole".

So...my questions...

1. I assume if I have a good clay content I wouldn't need a liner. Is there a good way to know this for sure? Would I just dig more holes (with an auger this time) to see if I have clay everywhere I want to lay the pond out? Is there a way to have the clay analyzed?

2. Is having ground water enough? For instance the ground water I hit with my hole I don't think will ever rise above the leve it is at now. What good is ground water if it only fills up the bottom couple feet of my pond? Will rain water fill the rest? Or do you fall back on filling it with outside water from time to time? Are there people who will come in and dig holes down to try to hit a spring or larger water source? Do I have to worry about messing up my well? It's a 300 foot drilled well.

3. Can anyone give me an idea what a 40 x 60 foot pond would cost to dig out? If I have to dig down to hit some groundwater, I figure it's going to have to be at least 10 feet deep in the middle. I will probably keep the dirt and just push it into the back of the lot. Maybe make some hills for the kids to play on in winter.

I know I have a lot of questions. Just trying to decide if this is something I can afford right now or need to wait on. I'm not really able to spend a lot of money on this, but would like to pursue it if it's not too bad.

Thanks for any answers anyone can provide.

Hey there and welcome. I am also from Upstate NY and have been lurking and getting great tips and ideas from everyone here.

What area are you from? I am Rochester NY. I recently ( Last Fall ) put in a 80' x approx 100' pond as well. I ran into alot of the same questions you did. I also put in a test hole in the back and it filled but later drained or dired up over the summer. Don't let that discourage you. The most important thing to do is find out about the soil in your general area. You can do that by going to the New York soil and water conservation district page for your county. They usually have someone on site to help you with the general guidelines. But also understand that you can have great clay in one area and 10 feet away you might have sandy soil.

When I had my Pond dug we hit mainly clay at about 2.5 feet deep and was in good shape most of the way. when we got back to the last side to be cut, we found the clay to be mixed with some sand. This was a concern for me and I didnt want to wait to see if it was going to be a problem, so I got bentonite in and had it put into that side of the pond prior to it filling and prior to the contractor going away. Thus far ( with a very wet spring ) I have not lost even an inch on the pond. In fact every time it rains I know I am going to have a good run off.

But enough about my pond. I might be able to help you with you questions.

1) You can have the county soil and water office analyze your soil if you like. I looked into it in my area and it would have been something they would have done along with digging multiple test holes up to 14 feet deep. This would have cost me about $1200 for that service. Thus I dont know what it would have been to just analyze the soil. What I ended up doing is I found a few people who had built small ponds around my area that year and talked with them and their contractors to see what they thought. I had a few come in a test the soil. ( Make sure the contractor has been making ponds for a while and not just digging septic systems.

As for the question around what the cost would be to dig, I had estimates from $1500 to $5000. I am assuming here you digging it out. What you can expect is that it is about $750 /day for an excavator and about $500/day for a dozer. If you have to truck the soil out the trucks can run up to $400/day as well. You could lessen the cost if you either move the soil around in the yard in a small area or if you have someone who would purchase the top soil from you. DOing that many places up here would be glad to dig it for free just to get the top soil for other jobs they might be doing. In my case I could not truck off the property and as such mine was about $2600 for the pond. I went about 14 feet deep at the deepest and 10 feet in most spots with a ridge about 6 feet deep around the pond.

As for rain filling it I was fortunate enough to be able to tap into a seasonal water source to fill it and now that its filled I rely on the rain as the primary source.

I hope that this helps a bit.

I'm also in upstate NY. Had my pond done by Catskill Pond. If you want a pond for recreation you will need some size to it.

To see my pond and get info go to this link:

http://catskillpond.com

Then click the photo album link.

We are now getting it ready for summer use. A beach area and boat dock as well as aerator are on the schedule very shortly.

Tuzz,

Your pond looks very nice.

I'm trying to get past the fantasy stage of building a pond in NY state. Can you tell me the size of your pond, roughly how much it cost, and why you need an aerator?

Thanks,
Ken

My pond is about 1 1/2 acres. The aerator is necessary to help the natural cycle of decomposing the nutrients from plant and animal waste in a oxygen environment and to make sure that the pond does not have stratified areas that are oxygen poor. It also maintains an open water area during winter freeze so toxic gases don't accumulate.

The other reason is that we tend to have a period during summer when the water would tend to stagnate due to low rain fall and resulting runoff.

Cost is hard to estimate until a site survey is done. We had a boggy area to deal with that needed much prep before the excavagtion equipment came in. Was able to sell a significant amount of very rich top soil to offset the excavagtion cost.

Figure on $1000 per day plus (especially with the new high energy prices) for good quality excavation. Then you need to adjust pH and add aerator ($1000 or so) and stock with fish.

Aeration is a very low cost insurance policy for a healthy pond ecosystem.

1 to 2 acre ponds cost anywhere between $15 and 30K.

Give my pond man Scott a call for an estimate: 845-888-0084.

Thanks guys. Thanks for all the information. Sorry I didn't get back to you earlier, I've been out of town.

I'll give the NY Soil & Water Conservation District a call and see what they say.

I'll be in touch.

Dunadan,

Years ago, I got a soil survey manual, for my County, from the SCS (Soil Conservation Service). The SCS goes under the name NRCS (Natural Resources Conservation Service) now. Lots of useful information.