Pond Boss Forums STOCKING A NEW POND Types of fish to choose small water Walleye - Bill Cody feedback

Hello, this post is based on Bill Cody asking for me to circle back and give advice on how things went with a small pond and a few walleye.

Our pond is a groundwater pond, no inlet or outflow. It is about .2 and maybe .25 acres when overflowing its banks. There is a fairly big swing of water as we get runoff events and then we lose some through evaporation and tree action plus some loss through the bottom/seams. I think our trees really suck water in the hot days of summer. I have sealed it with soilfloc on two occasions which has helped in a huge way minimize entry/exit through ground water seams.

Soil has small percentage of clay, mostly loam/sand mix. No gravel.
I have bottom aeration set at 10' but by mid summer the diffuser which are raised up no a tote are probably 7' under while depth is probably 8' in the middle in summer. Wish I had gotten the right equipment in to dig it deeper when we built our house. We had the edges mucked out and a bulldozer pushed dirt out of the bottom as deep as the operator could go without getting stuck. There was ground water in the middle when pond was pumped empty at that time so the original intent of being around 12' in middle didn't happen.

WE stocked FHM, GSH, and 100 YP in 2014. Over time I have tried to add bonus species including RES, LES, LCS, and SFS. A few pumpkinseed have been added over the years. Sadly one lone BG was bucket stocked by a careless person. The goal was to have zero BG due to a host of issues with BG management.

YP have done very well (pellet fed by hand when time allows) Biggest female YP are 13", may even be one 14" specimen in there. Last few years we have had lots of egg strands but poor fertilization and survival so we may have less males left, or GSH are consuming fry.

GSH are mostly gone, only a few old and probably sterile widows are caught on hook and line occasionally (6" plus)

FHM were gone in 2 weeks

No other predators, till one fall I ran up to Stony Creek Fish farm (was it 2 years ago already?) I stocked a dozen 4-6" walleye. I figured for my size pond the correct number of WE to stock is probably 2-3 but I didn't know what survival would be in my 'shallow' pond and figured winter kill was likely.

I have tires and pallet structure in shallows, but otherwise no other structure. No rocks, sadly no vegetation at all so little place for walleye to hide in. I guess they could stack up around and next to the diffuser and tote structure in the middle. Soilfloc makes the bottom like concrete and we get no plants. I now see some buttercup species (swamp? marsh buttercup?) bushes popping up all around the waters edge.

No sign of walleye ever again. I didn't try to fish for them. My son said he saw a big 'V' chasing something up into the shallows which clearly was larger than a YP and something that YP would not do. I had hoped that there actually might be a walleye that survived some two years later! I figured outside of an underwater game camera I would never know if they were there or how many survived. Certainly there is clouds and clouds of SFS everywhere so there should be plenty of food if walleye wanted to eat SFS minnows.

But then we had a big rain event a couple weeks ago. A big flush of heavy rain plus street run off added a huge inflow of stormwater plus whatever chemical may have washed off the streets with it. The next day we had a few floaters of the largest YP, no small fish. Then each day for 2 days later we had a few more floaters, some smaller YP. One of the biggest 'YP' somehow was dragged up on one of my floating turtle platforms and left there. When I got closer to it, it clearly had the mouth and teeth of about a 14-15" walleye!! The body had decomposed and was partially eaten on the underside so hard to get a good idea on condition, coloring, health etc. I thought it was funny that the turtles who probably started snacking on the fish went right for the 'walleye ear' meat and after digging that out left most of the rest of it alone.

Then as I was raking algae the next day I found another large slender 'floater'. It was another walleye, same size, about 15", but with good heft in the midsection. Looked like it was well fed.

I don't know if they died from too much silt in the water from the big plunge of water coming in the pond, or rapid temperature change or what. I would say that with aeration there should have been plenty of oxygen. air and water temps were not excessively high. It could be that the cold water refuge below the 'thermocline' was suddenly disrupted with all that water coming in.

So the take home is that even in my tiny pond, with not much depth, very little structure, little opportunity for cold water refuge, no flowing water, and only YP or SFS/GSH to pick from for a food source my few walleye made it 2 years, went from 5" to 14" and without a big runoff event would probably have continued to survive on.

Now I'm excited to think that some of the other walleye stockers may still be in there. We'll have to see. I like the idea that they are in a way my apex predator. They are selective in how they feed and will not reproduce which is to my advantage.

So bottom line is if you have a northern pond, even small, even if somewhat shallow, don't exclude the possibility of walleye as your apex predator (as long as you don't have a problem with too many BG) A shiner/YP/SMB pond would work really well and it would be exciting to add some bonus WE for fun, variety, good eating. Or you can even do a shiner/YP/WE pond (no bluegill, no bass) and I think it would work well. Think of the quality of your table fare with access to YP and WE at will!!

Thanks to all who have helped me get this far.

I love hearing this! I'm in the process of having a similar pond excavated. I'm slightly warmer in southern OH, but current plan is YP/RES/WE/HSB, instead of your dozen WE, I was going split 6 WE 6 HSB initially. So far its estimated 1/3 acre size with max depth of 11ft due to reaching solid bedrock trying to go deeper. My soil is clay, so hopefully not as many problems with water level. Do you have riprap around your pond? My understanding is the limestone would help filter some of that runoff.

Great Report For A Small Northern Pond. See if you can lengthen the wording by several paragraphs and get several good pictures of some fish pics, your structure, and maybe an empty pond picture? You mention """RES, LES, LCS, and SFS. ... A few pumpkinseed have been added over the years. Sadly one lone BG.""" Briefly discuss these fish. Did you every see any hybrid BGXRES? Do you try to sample the fish by other methods than angling? Then send the package to Lusk the PB magazine editor. You have a very good start of a Northern Pond article. He is always looking for articles and this would make a good contribution.

DrewSh, something to consider about WE and HSB....

From my experience with them, you'll visually see the HSB a lot more than you will the WE, outside of catching either when fishing. The HSB will be very aggressive hitting feed, and balling up baitfish. The WE may never show up visually.

Just to add my experience to this thread. I built a one acre puddle, max depth of 14 feet. Stocked FHM, SFS, BNM, Crayfish, YP, GSH, RES, RESxBG, WE, HSB and SMB. Stocked at different times and the WE and HSB ladder stocked. Every species is doing well, length and weight....expect for the WE. Length-wise they're fine. But they're skinny and sickly looking. So we are actively removing them and considering a different route without them. Just my experience. Congrats to those who successfully grew them in small ponds. I'm jealous!!

I am curious why not BG and LMB if you have WE? I have a gazillion BG and a healthy population of LMB and a little bit of everything in my pond, I stocked my YP and WE later then the rest, I have yet to see or catch a YP, dont know how, have never caught one, I thought they may be great for ice fishing if the ice ever gets thick enough for it. Th WE did amazing, they went from 3 to 4" in March to 14" by Oct. I catch them a good bit on crappie jigs but havent as much this summer, was wondering if they moved to some deeper water. They are extremely fiesty when you hook one and very tasty to eat, I like my crappie better tho.
I have probably a little over 5 acres that is 25' or deeper, and a ton of cover in the rest of it including several acres of flooded standing timber.

YP tend to disappear when LMB occupy the same waters. Though if you have that much cover, maybe some will survive.

I am absolutely expecting that, they will purely be bonus fish predators charged with keeping my YOY at bay. I'll be stoked to catch one every now and then, but as long as they do their job (and survive) there will be no complaints from me.

Thanks for all for chiming in!

After reading and learning as much as I could since 2013 I decided that for myself there is no possible way to balance a LMB and BG or LMB and HBG population in a small northern pond. Every lake under 100 acres around here is eutrophic with cottages or farms and run off fertilizer and silt issues. They all are loaded with stunted LMB and BG. I grew up only catching dink BG and 12" bass no matter where I went. Almost every pondowner on this forum struggles on this front. Those who stock HBG under the hope that they are 'sterile' end up finding out that they just get unwanted pure GSF instead. Then they have LMB AND LMB wanna-bees GSH who try to outcompete each other in eating.

I knew I didn't have time or interest in catching LMB in sufficient number to cull back into balance. I don't eat LMB either. Also, achieving enough forage for LMB was going to be a tall order in a small pond. Standard bluegill may pull of 2-3 spawns but that isn't always predictable here. I didn't want to have to stress about that balance and since it presented a situation that guaranteed constant battle, lots of stress about which species is underfed or over stocked I was committed to do everything I could to never let a BG in or a LMB. SMB someday? sure. LMB hopefully never.... or, I guess it would be OK to put ONE adult LMB in (prefer male).

My initial thought was Perch and minnow only pond and then when I was comfortable with how things went I would pick bonus forage options, plus a bonus unique predator (like NP, or Walleye) and then try to add forage that might be unique such as lake chubsuckers or even different shiner species.

That led me to stock a few LCS which I don't think survived, and the SFS which are doing awesome for some reason.

The RES and LES were also attempts to see if a fish that is 'out of range' for my pond might still survive but apparently they did not.

I'm now slowly starting to add a few pumpkinseed to see what happens. Right now there are 3 in there that I know of but not sure if all male or mix male/female. We'll see if there are nests next year.

So much more to say... I succeeded once on PK shrimp, then failed to keep them going. Failed on crayfish stocking, probably not enough cover.

No, no riprap, just a bare bowl and this year tons of algae. No idea why. Raking constantly, not fun at all.

My next experiment was to try some HSB but sourcing may be impossible due to MI laws.

Canyon - Good additional information. With both posts, a few pictures and a little help from Lusk, I think you have enough information now for a good northern pond report in PB magazine. IMO the article is basically written. Lots of people get the magazine and do not read the forum so all this good info will be new to them. Go for it. I look forward to seeing it in print.

Walleye that stay skinny in pond habitats I think have too much competition from predators and the WE do not get enough easy to capture prey food. IMO WE are not aggressive predators like the LMB. Thus WE do not perform well when the pond has lots of LMB who usually keep prey fish community to a minimum.

""No, no riprap, just a bare bowl and this year tons of algae. No idea why. Raking constantly,...""
You are getting lots of FA and need for frequent raking IMO because you have a bare bottom pond with lots of accumulating unused nutrients. I assume that you feed your fish. Not all the fish food is used for fish biomass. Nutrient laden manure is always a result. FA loves and thrives in those conditions.

It is a shame the MI does not allow tilapia - they love eating FA and are very good for eating for meals at the end of each annual pond cycle. One option that may help reduce the amount of FA would be to build and use a floating island. This will sequester nutrients instead of or in addition to having some submerged vegetation. Submerged vegetation including Chara depending on biomass utilize lots of dissolved nutrients. Vegetated ponds usually have little or no FA. FA loves and thrives with no other plant competition.
Size and number of island/s for success would be based on amount of excess nutrients in the pond.

Bill, MI does allow tilapia! I added them 2 seasons when I had a supplier who grew them in his aquaponics setup and had leftovers for me. They loved my pond but I couldn't tell they did anything to the algae. Probably because I didn't get to the 40 pound mark and even more because my adults didn't have a long enough growing season before cold weather hit to have babies. The babies I'm told are the ones that truly have enough mouths to eat the algae. I think my adults probably found plenty of bugs and other things to eat.

I may ask someone to truck tilapia from another state as part of a fish delivery in the future. I keep hoping to check in with another local aquaponics hobbyist or someone who has a setup in their heated garage or barn and can raise some for me. I don't have know how on how to keep them over the winter. Some pondboss folks in SE MI were doing this and I have not heard them post in a while (John Kelsey I think? and Coach Bryan?)

Thanks for the info on Walleye. It was truly an experiment mainly to do what the local fish farm and local fish biologists said could not be done in MI.

Yes, my lack of vegetation is a problem. I first blamed too many crayfish but I can't see or trap a single crayfish so don't think that is to blame. I think the soilfloc may be to blame. When I try to push a stake in it is like pounding through concrete for 2" and then you hit soft soil. I think plants just don't start easily in that stuff. I do get more plants on the extreme edge of shoreline that is partially wet and partially dry as the levels go up and down. The buttercup really are spreading easily around the edge. I see a few other weeds starting, even 2 bulrush type sprouts that came out of nowhere. I'm going to try to get some duck potato or water pickerel or similar to get started soon. But without disturbing my pond 'seal' I don't think the bowl bottom will ever have weeds.

I did hand feed optimal till I ran out in July. I didn't purchase more as I was managing algae more than enjoying my fish.

Another thing I did was at ice out this year... I had a literal solid coating of fluorescent green algae on the under side of the ice most of the way around the pond to about 4-5' out. Chiseled out the ice to install my duckbox stake and the underside had algae adhered to it! Never had that before. Usually at ice out the water is very clear and nothing growing anywhere. Figuring I was in for bad algae issues I put pond dye in. I had not done that before. It kept things basically a bit under control till pond dye disappeared mid summer. I didn't put more dye in as it is no fun not being able to see any of the creatures in the shallows with the dye. I like watching the critters, minnows, tadpoles and all so I figured let off on dye and be ready to rake more instead.

I will consider building plant islands, good idea. I also have worked much harder this year when fertilizing my lawn to be sure that none of it goes around or in the pond. I think that and some big runoff events that happened right after I fertilized last summer and fall put a ton of nitrogen in the pond that could have been avoided.

Too many projects. I have what I need at home to make my own bug light and zapper but no time to assemble it all, test and mount it. So it goes...

As an update, I did catch an adult LCS in a seine net a few years back but never saw a spawn (not enough vegetation)

RES are present in some lakes about an hour south of me and closer to Indiana border but none of the lakes by me have RES. I think we are just a bit too far north for them. Anyone in northern OH or IN who can tell us if their lakes have RES that survive year after year?


No pumpkinseed reproduction so no hybrids.

RES were stocked small (3") and in small numbers. I did see one spawning circle the next year but apparently adults and young never made it through the subsequent winter.

Always enjoy great reports like these. Well done !!

Diligently harvesting lots of algae will help reduce the nutrient basis in the pond. People that harvest lots of FA tell me they see less FA the next year so evidently FA harvest is beneficial.

FA and tilapia. You want your stocker tilapia to be two things; 1. insure males and females. 2. stockers should be 5"-7" so some are big enough to be spawning within 10 days to two weeks. Each fish can eat just so much algae per day. The more FA to be eaten the more individuals that need to be added or you wait longer for them to get the algae under control. I tell people that if they did not get all the algae gone be early August not enough were initially stocked.

There are lakes in southern MI that have reproducing populations of RES. If you really want RES that will survive each year in your pond you should do your homework and take the kids and go fishing. All you would need to get them established would be 4-8 MI adapted RES.

I did a little RES homework for you about Michigan RES.
Following was from a lengthy MDNR report about RES in Michigan.
https://quod.lib.umich.edu/f/fishery/5026204.0001.001?rgn=main;view=fulltext

Research studies indicated that growing seasons > 180 frost-free days are optimal for the RES as a species. However, MI fish surveys have shown that several redear sunfish populations in Michigan have thrived for the past 40 years in areas having an average of only 150 to 160 days of frost-free growing season.

Table 3 compares average sizes and the largest individuals captured in trap net surveys in 30 lakes where redear sunfish have been documented as present for at least five years prior to the survey. Of these lakes, 86.2% had 10-in or larger redear sunfish present in survey catches, but only 10.3% had any bluegills of that size and none contained 10-in pumpkinseeds. The average size of redear sunfish in these trap net surveys was 8.7 in (Table 3), which was more than two inches longer than a similar figure for either bluegills or pumpkinseeds (6.6 in and 6.5 in, respectively). Similarly, the largest individual of each species in the catch greatly favors redear sunfish with an average of 10.3 in, compared to 8.8 in for bluegills and 7.6 in for pumpkinseeds. These lakes have had dramatic changes in panfish population structure and angler opportunity.

Over 40 new redear sunfish fisheries have been established in southern Lower Michigan since an intensive stocking effort began in 1984.

One of the best records of RES success occurred in 1989 during a spring fish survey of Big Portage Lake, Jackson County when 194 redear sunfish were captured averaging 8.6 inches in length. This lake was first stocked in the fall of 1985 with 1.8 inch fingerlings. Other similar successes have occurred in Lower Brace Lake, Calhoun County; Saubee Lake, Eaton County; Baw Beese and Cub Lakes, Hillsdale County; Clear, Gilletts, Grass, and Lime Lakes, Jackson County; and Joslin, North, and Silver Lakes, Washtenaw County (Table 1).

Michigan fishery surveys have found pumpkinseed populations co-existing with redear sunfish in lakes that have had large redear sunfish populations for several decades. Fish populations in Lake George, Silver Lake, and Coldwater Lake in Branch County and in Crooked Lake in Washtenaw County are good examples.

I will check out that article and thanks for summarizing it for me. I'd like to find the lakes closest to my area (Grand Rapids) that might have them. You said 40 new fisheries established but is there a list somewhere?
I also am curious if fisheries that were established by stocking really kept a population going but I guess the only way to know is to go fishing.
Time is very precious so it would be good to know ahead a target with a good chance of finding them.

I also wonder if lakes an hour south of me have a different enough climate to affect survival. I assume their ice pack would be same as ours. It seems the lake effect snow warm wind and lake effect snow really changes the weather. There 'snow bands' between us and Kalamazoo that always get way more moisture and lake effect snow compared with towns just a few miles north or south of them.

I tried your link but it pulls up a viewer that strips out the tables. If you know of the full article or pdf please link it to me. I'm going to try to track down one of the biologists in the area who may know about the RES stocking. Another summary page by the MI DEQ designed to give info about stocking fish in MI (dated 2004) gives this summary about RES in general:



Redear sunfish Lepomis microlophus often attain large sizes in heavily fished lakes. This species
grows rapidly while being rather difficult to catch on hook and line. It therefore has the ability to
supply a large, even “trophy-sized” panfish in lakes that are under intensive fishing pressure and are
known for small panfish. Redear sunfish should not be used as a replacement for bluegill or other
sunfishes (Towns 2003). Rather, the primary emphasis should be to provide anglers with the
opportunity for catching a few very large panfish.
Michigan waters are north of the natural range of this species; however, several reproducing
populations have thrived in the extreme southern part of Michigan’s Lower Peninsula since redears
were stocked in the mid-1950s. Since 1984, several more lakes have been stocked and reproducing
populations as far north as Eaton County have been documented (Saubee Lake–MDNR, Fisheries
Division, unpublished data).
Redear sunfish grow quickly and reach large size when compared to bluegill and pumpkinseed. In
some southern lower Michigan lakes, redear sunfish have attained lengths of 8 inches in three
growing seasons. Trap net catches indicate that redear sunfish generally average from 1.5 to 3 inches
larger than bluegills or pumpkinseeds in the same lake (Towns 2003). A similar relationship is
evident when comparing state average length-at-age of these three species (Schneider 2000).
Individuals as large as 10 to 11 inches should be expected within 5 years of introduction. After
diligent stocking efforts, many lakes in southern Lower Michigan now have significant redear sunfish
populations. Surveys have found many redear sunfish in these lakes that exceed 11 inches in length
and a few larger than 12 inches.
Larger redear sunfish feed primarily on snails, but also eat midges, mayflies, dragonflies, small clams,
and other invertebrates (Twomey et al. 1984). There has been some speculation that redear sunfish
may benefit from recent introductions of zebra mussels and help to control mussel populations. A
recent study by French (1993a) demonstrated that redear sunfish preyed on zebra mussels in aquarium
experiments, but preferred native snails. Another report suggests that both pumpkinseed and redear
sunfish will probably prey heavily on zebra mussels in shallow vegetated habitats (French 1993b).
More study is needed to determine if redear sunfish can detach and consume zebra mussels once they
are firmly attached to hard substrates.
Redear sunfish seem to do best in typical Michigan warmwater lakes that are high in marl, low in
turbidity, and are not heavily influenced by rivers or riverine species. Trautman (1957) reported that
wherever the redear sunfish has been introduced into waters north of its original range, it has
essentially adapted to non-flowing waters that were relatively clear and that contained some aquatic
vegetation. Lakes that have good pumpkinseed populations have proven to be good candidates for
redear sunfish introductions. However, a redear sunfish introduction is likely to reduce pumpkinseed
populations because these species complete for similar food items. Both species eat snails, but
Huckins (1996) found that the greater crushing strength of redear sunfish allowed them to shift from a
diet of soft-bodied insects to a diet of snails at an earlier age than pumpkinseed. However, this study
also suggests that pumpkinseed may be better able to eat soft-body prey items, such as aquatic
insects. While the superior snail crushing ability provides an advantage to redear sunfish, it is not so
overwhelming that pumpkinseed will likely be extirpated after redear sunfish introductions.
Michigan fishery surveys have found pumpkinseed populations co-existing (although at much lower
densities) with redear sunfish in lakes that have had large redear sunfish populations for several
decades.
In lakes with established fisheries where an eventual reproducing redear sunfish population is desired,
fall fingerling redear sunfish (1.5-inch) should be stocked at 100 fish/acre for 3 years in succession
(Towns 2003). This method assumes that at least two of the three-year classes will survive in high
enough numbers to establish a breeding population. In some cases, new introductions have resulted
in very large redear sunfish populations, with redear sunfish comprising somewhat smaller numbers,

but similar total biomass as bluegills in trap net catches (MDNR, Fisheries Division, unpublished
data). Newly established populations should be surveyed in the forth or fifth year to ascertain
survival, and determine if successful natural reproduction has occurred. Subsequent stocking may not
be necessary, but if survival to adult size has been low, alternate-year stocking may be used to
maintain the fishery

Canyon - Yes the link does not put the report and tables in a normal readable fashion. I started to make an alphabetized list of all the lakes in southern MI that had RES stocked in them. It was too time consuming so I stopped doing it mid-way through the list. I figured if you wanted the list you or one of your kids could do it. I figured this part of the report would be the best places to most likely to catch some RES:

One of the best records of RES success occurred in 1989 during a spring fish survey of Big Portage Lake, Jackson County when 194 redear sunfish were captured averaging 8.6 inches in length. This lake was first stocked in the fall of 1985 with 1.8 inch fingerlings. Other similar successes have occurred in Lower Brace Lake, Calhoun County; Saubee Lake, Eaton County; Baw Beese and Cub Lakes, Hillsdale County; Clear, Gilletts, Grass, and Lime Lakes, Jackson County; and Joslin, North, and Silver Lakes, Washtenaw County (Table 1).

Thank you! I also found a table of emails in another DNR document, I'll see if anyone replies and then use the MI DEQ/DNR network to see if anyone knows. These lakes are definitely far enough east and south of me that it could be that our lakes won't work for RES.

Can someone post the link to the fish database again? the one that folks take pictures of fish and catalog their catches? I'd like to see if there are RES pictures from anglers in southern MI. I know it was posted a few times here but I can't find the link.

Was doing some searching on WE reproduction and this thread came up, I am curious, I have WE I stocked in my pond 2.5 yrs ago, March of 21, they went from 3 to 4" fingerlings to 14 inches that first yr, and a yr later I have caught one that was 19" probably close to 1.5 lbs, since then I am not catching anything of that size, I have caught a bunch of them but they are all still around the 14 15" range, they appear extremely healthy and fat. the pond is about 14 A with tons of cover, a lot of deep water, and a gazillion BG, GS and GSF of every size range, also LMB yoy of all size ranges. also the CC are reproducing in the pond.

My question is, what are the chances that they have reproduced in my pond? or if not why did they absolutely quit growing for two yrs already? the ones I catch seem extremely healthy and fiesty and fat as a tick.

A 19" WAE at 1.5lbs is 56.7%RW.
A 19" WAE should weigh 2.64lbs to be 100%RW.
Chances of reproduction are very, very low. WAE topping out at 14-16" in a pond is not uncommon because they don't do well on sunfish generally. It would take a large abundance of golden shiner to keep them happy in a shad-free pond.
Lot's of rock/sand/gravel substrate in 1-4' of water with current is needed for higher chances of reproduction.

I agree well with Snipe. It is likely that your original stocker WE are growing slowly especially if they have low relative weights. Note males grow more slowly compared to the females. The 19"er was likely a female and smaller ones are males. Pond walleye usually do not grow much bigger than 4 to maybe 5 lbs at 23-24" maximum. If you grow some 25" consider yourself fortunate and doing something right. Natural reproduction is very rare in regular pond habitats but not unheard of. Do not consider that WE are reproducing in your pond unless you catch some that are 8"-12" long. Do come back and tell us if you catch some 8"-10 walleye from your pond.

Thanks for the info, the 19" one was'nt actually weighed, I just guessed at the approximate weight because I did not have a scales with me and I returned it to the water quickly because they do not last long out of water, the weight is hard to judge with them being so much different shape then say a LMB. I didn't have a tape either but did have a piece of wire that I put a bend in at its length and then later measured it to be 19inches.

I was just curious as to why they grew so fast and then just completely quit, even tho when I catch one they seem extremely healthy and gorgeously fat. wonder why they would not grow in that condition.
I will try to keep a scales with tape with me and get a relative weight on them when I catch some again.

Again,, thanks a bunch for the input! much appreciated and valued. I didn't think they were probably reproducing but was perplexed at the growth.

geha - In certain situations and weather conditions WE have been known to have a small amount of recruitment in pond habitats. Walleye do spawn in ponds HOWEVER the eggs very rarely hatch due to lack of proper conditions for egg incubation. IMO and experience water quality and clarity are important parts of the equation along with proper zooplankton for fry, good types of habitat / cover, and right type of predators to allow survival to the 8"-10" sizes. Usually it is more luck than planning. As I mentioned confirmation of egg hatching and survival of fry to juvenile walleye will be evidenced by catching or sampling some individuals that are 8"-10" providing no fingerlings nor yearlings have been stocked within 2 years. We are interested in how the WE perform and survive in your MO pond. Take some water temperature measurements surface and near bottom this hot summer and report back. Thank you.!

The surface temp obviously is simple, I still haven't figured out just how to get sub surface temps, I know there is a tool out there to do that, I just haven't put any effort into finding or obtaining one,, I will do that tho. My pond is good and deep tho, probably 5 plus acres, that are 25' plus deep. What I can do is open the bottom drain and let it run for a while and check the temperature there.

As for WE in this area, we stocked a dozen WE in a local strip pit lake back in the day, just for the fun of it and they were free, an acquaintance had access to a fish hatchery farm that was going out of business and these were leftover. anyhow, never did catch any again till 6 to 8 yrs later I was LMB fishing in that lake and latched on to what I assumed was a 6 plus pound bass, I fought it for a while and got it up to the boat and it was about a 24 26" WE, obviously it cut my line and got away but that was our first indication that they were still in there. Otters had cleaned the pond out pretty much before that so I was surprised to catch anything with any size in there.

Thanks!

This thread has evolved to ponds stocked with unusual species for the Latitude. A quick description of mine, WE and YP in an unusually far south pond. Stocked 6" WE in my 1.8 Acre pond April 2021, caught 14" WE in Oct , 2021 , 16" Dec 2021 . Fall of 2020 through fall of 2021 stocked
850 YP, 195 lbs of FHM's / Golden Shiners . ( lots of 3" to 9" GSH caught this spring early summer on lures , beautiful bright gold ,
back to silver color now ) . We are still catching WE 14" to 16" . Western Oklahoma , on I-40 , 61 miles from Texas Panhandle. Never seen a skinny one , see lots of 1.5"-2.5" GSH while feeding Optimal . Still catching YP on regular basis . Water depth average is
about 12' at Full pool, probably .2 Acres over 20' at full pool. Visibility summer months 24"-42" , winter 70"-96"+ . Don't know if this info is of interest , But must say, the Bonus Fish catches of WE, YP, and SMB , is exciting for the fishermen in Western Oklahoma , where every pond is LMB, BG, and CC , over and over .

My SMB , stocked with my WE, appear to have 2 successful spawns . Stockers 14"-18", 2022 spawn now 10" , 2023 5" caught in a clover leaf trap last week, only one so far.

Q#1 : Is lack of current , across a rocky , gravely bottom the #1 reason for lack of spawn for WE in smaller BOW ?

Q#2 : The 5"-9" GSH, although they colored up beautifully this spring , are they most likely sterile ? would you cull in a WE/SMB/YP pond ? The ovarian disease, at 3,4, or 5 YOA , is there still sufficient egg production to justify keeping ? If belly appears gravid and good golden color, does this indicate fertility ?

Q#3 : Stocked RES June 2021 for a massive snail infestation. 400, guessing I received ?150? RES, 100 NBG, 100 GSF, 50 assorted Hybrids , all a guess, niave enough to believe if a bought RES , I would get RES. 1" fish , so you know the story. The Lemonade is 9"- 10" BG, very thick , 8" GSF that thrill the kids. I do not want LMB. If I introduce my WE to my friend Mr.Skillet , how many Saugeye
would you stock to knock down the BG, GSF #'s substantially ? To give my YP a chance ?

Sorry first paragraphs rambled , hope you can make sense of them . God bless each of you.



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Q#1 answer. Yes.

Q#2 answer and a question. Why do you say they are most likely sterile? Do you have proper habitat for the GSH to spawn on at the proper time of the year? Lack of proper spawning habitat could cause them to re-absorb their eggs. I wouldn't cull any.

Q#3 answer. and a question. Do you still see a snail population? If you still see snails, buy more RES, but this time buy them 3"-6" in length to make sure you are getting RES. YP will predate on GSH, I have caught large YP on a 6" soft plastic jerk bait that had a 3/0 hook in it while fishing for LMB in the pond. As for # of Saugeye to stock, that all depends on the amount of panfish fish you want to be eaten. Could be as low as 4/ac, could be as high as 30/ac depending on the amount of forage fish for them in the pond and how many of those forage fish you want to remove. Hopefully Snipe will chime in.