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This land/lake was bought 1 year ago. Previous owner used it to duck and goose hunt in the winter. He said it was stocked with bass 7 years ago. We could not find any fish period. But it was and is full of frogs. So we killed the pond over a year ago and saw no fish.

In April I used pond perfect plus and treated it twice. Pond is 7.5 foot deep in center and 4 foot on shallow end well built, not much if any algae. It has thousands of tadpoles in it everywhere. Lots of frogs, has several wood ducks and couple of geese daily.

I had tremendous outcome with a 1/2 acre pond in mid 1990's that I stocked with 200 RES 100 BG and 50 LMB in stages. To this day it has 10-12 inch RES and BG and lots of 12-14 inch bass. I am a big fan of RES shellcracker are great to eat.

So I would like to have Big Bream and lots of Bass. Redear shellcracker have been hard to find this year here. Monday May 2 I stocked 10lbs of fat head minnows and 300 RES. Got them from fish wagon, they were to be 2-3 inches, but they were 1.5 to 2 inches. I was going to stock HBG and Coppernose until I started reading this forum. So stocking rest in June. Do I get 300 Copper nose ( by the way thank you pond boss didn't know what they were!) and another 100 RES? I want to stock 100 LMB as well, I was told to wait until october to stock the bass. My goal is big bream. I would like any input you guys have. Was just wondering since bass and copper nose 2-3 inches, if I could stock in June? I am fine doing it in stages it worked before, but I think RES are more of 50/50 stock if you want to have enough to catch, since they do not reproduce as much. I know I am new here but I would really like any help I can get, I want to do it right.

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Welcome to the forum. I'm not sure about the CNBG. If the pond freezes over in the winter, you may be better off with regular BG. CNBG will live but they might not do as well as regular BG if the pond freezes. If you like RES, stock as many as you want. For the LMB, you can stock them now, and further down the road harvest any LMB that is bigger than 12"-14".


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The pond did freeze over for a couple of days this winter but it only lasted couple of days and was not very thick, but ducks and geese wouldn't land on it. It will not freeze at all most winters, but last year we had that rare single digit temps for a couple of days.

I to have wondered about CNBG here, after reading up on it. I know several people here that have stocked them and they have done well. The guy I am getting fish from in June is out of Bowling Green, Ky. He only carries CNBG, RES, and HBG. He suggested mix of CNBG, HBG, and RES. 600 total Bream with later stocking of 100 LMB and 10 lbs Fathead. I just stocked 10lbs Fat heads and 300 RES, as I posted, from arkansas. They suggest 900 mix (600 BG 300 RES) with same FHM and 100 LMB.

So which total number of bream would be better 900 or 500/600. And with my options of CNBG and HBG in June. I was thinking of getting another 100 RES (if they are 2 -3 inches and not 1.5 inch) and 300 CNBG. Or how bad would it be to get 200 CNBG and 200 HBG? I want 50 to 60 percent RES. I am feeding Purina Aqua Maxx starter food by hand.

Pond is 1.1 acre I do not have it aeriated but would love affordable way to do it. ( that is not 1000 dollars). Spring fed and gets great run off 3 sides. I would appreciate any suggestions!

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I am leaning towards 300 CNBG ( no hybrids) and maybe 100 more RES ( if 2 inches or bigger) My big question is when to stock 100 LMB ( 2-3 inches) in June or wait till October? The 300 RES and ten lbs fat head minnows( already stocked) have 5 week head start and the Copper Nose will be same size? Feeding Aqua Maxx starter every day in small amounts,

I welcome any advise, I really want this to work in 2-3 years.

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If you wait till October it will sure give the FHM more time to fill up the pond and make a better food source for the small LMB. But I can't tell you which stocking time for the LMB is best and will defer that to more of an expert than me.

The FHM will sure do good on that starter feed and in fact they will do quite fine on feed that is way too large of pellets for them as long as they do not have predators keeping them away from it. When we had FHM's in our pond early we only fed Game Fish Chow because that is all we had readily available. We would see numerous minnows pushing the pellets around till they got soft enough and eventually get them consumed. Of course once the BG get big enough to consume the pellets they pretty much steal it all away before the FHM's can get it. But the FHM's are agressive pellet feeders till they get some competetion or predation.

Early on I would drop a small pile of sinking feed in about 4-5 feet of water. I had bought an under water camera on a cord that I could drop down and watch what was going on. In a short period of time a school of FHM's would find the feed (catfish sinking pellets) and tear into it till it was gone. Actually after a minute or so I would lose track of them because they would muddy the bottom up so much around the feed I could no longer see them on the camera.

Another experience with FHM's early on in my ponds life is I put my scuba gear on and just laid on the bottom in 3-5 feet of water. Within a minute a school of FHM's would find me and start tugging on my hairs all over my arms and legs. I would rarely see them with my eyes, for some reason tish seem to be able to tell which end the mouth is on and that face mask I think just looks like a big mouth ready to eat them. But I could feel 10-20 maybe 30 of them trying to eat the hairs off my arms and legs.

Wife and daughter had a similar experience with their feet. They would sit on the dock and dangle their feet in the water. They would start giggling as a group of FHM's would go after their feet and ankles. They said they were getting a food massage.

Of course all this ends when BG or LMB or any other predator gets big enough to cause a threat to them. Then they are mostly relegated to the shore line or where there is cover from predation. But as long as the fatheads have free range on the pond, they will be everywhere trying to eat what they can. If you can hold off on stocking predators for a while, we just enjoyed feeding them. I even caught a few on hook and line with a tiny hook and just a wee bit of a worm on it. Size 10 or smaller hook.


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HBG and BG in the same pond is not the best idea. I would not add the HBG.
There are different options on adding LMB. If you wait until fall then use larger advanced fingerling LMB (6 inch +) and use only about 35. If you decide on June then use 2 inch and use 75+-. You want the first spawn of BG and RES to not be decimated by the LMB. Initial stocking #s for BG/RES using 2-3 inch fish range from 1000 to 3000 per acre depending on goals. This changes if you use advanced size BG/RES and they spawn quickly without LMB present.
















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I agree with ewest, at least for the first 4-5 years leave out the HBG. See how the BG and RES perform with your management. . Your fish guy is pushing HBG just making money moving HBG. HBG will grow initially fast but then tend to slow growth at around 8"-9" whereas well fed BG-RES will keep on growing well and out grow -perform the HBG as top end size if they get plenty of food. Plus offspring of HBG is sparse density and grow not as well as the original HBG parents. If your goal is big BG & RES then you want the bass to trend toward the smaller sizes less than 14"-15" as noted by esshup above when he said ""further down the road harvest any LMB that is bigger than 12"-14". ""Lots of smaller bass eat lots of small panfish to reduce their high numbers. As you noted above "" back in 1990's, lots of 12-14 inch bass allowed big panfish to develop.

The remaining BG-RES have more food and less competition that allows them to grow faster and bigger. Also to grow the biggest BG,,,,, harvest primarily the females. Bull male BG are needed to suppress spawning of smaller BG so smaller ones keep growing fast instead of expending energy for early spawning as smaller sizes.

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I am going to get 300 CNBG and maybe another 100 RES, if size is better than 2 inches. Now back to stocking the 100 LMB.

Still trying to decide if I should wait until October or go ahead and stock in June, since they all should be 2-3 inches bass/bream.

I like the idea of stocking the CNBG in June and giving the summer for the minnows, RES, CNBG, time to get established. Stocking 100 LMB 2-3 inches in October.

However after reading way to many articles, I fear that the Copper nose can spawn at 4 inches. Is this true? I do not want to be over run with BG from the get go, without a predator in the pond. My question is if I stock these CNBG in June is there a chance they spawn this summer, while small? And if I wait till october is that too long without any predator?

I had just assumed that it would be next spring or summer before any spawning. This forum is great and I appreciate the help!

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I had a friend of mine that has two ponds, tell me that with me feeding every day the food I am. That the CNBG and RES could be 6 inches by october. He said if the bass I stock, in october , are on small side (closer to 2 than 3 inches), that the bream would eat the bass. He is telling to stock them at the same time because they are the same size.

My other friend, that works for fish and game, told me to wait and they would not grown that fast and wouldn't eat the bass. He said it would be better to wait and let the bream and minnows have the summer to settle in. He said I could stock bass in fall or early spring. He made a good point, once the bass go in there is no going back. He also said LMB do better stocked, in cooler water in fall and early spring.

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Wait until fall and stock lower numbers of 6 in LMB.
















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They are not even an option, I have to buy 2-3 inch LMB (1.50 a fish) or maybe special order them but they are going to be 6 to 8 dollars apiece if, I can get them them at all that size. So what to do? Right now my plan is 300 CNBG and 100 LMB in June and if some die add to it in october. Welcome any and all thoughts!


I do not want to get behind the 8 ball and have to many bream ( if they spawn this year with no predator) I do not think the 300 RES already stocked will spawn until next year but these new ones not so sure!

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LANGSTER,
Many on this forum have waited a year or more to introduce predators to their pond. No one has ever complained that they had too many baitfish. The idea of waiting to stock your predator fish is to have the baitfish reproduce as much as possible. Once you introduce the LMB there is no turning back. Pay close attention to what Esshup, Bill Cody and Ewest are saying.

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I do understand and appreciate it. I just do want to many bluegill and it really bothered me that 3-4 inch CNBG of BG could spawn. It threw me off the original game plan. I will stock another 300 CNBG or BG, let them do their thing and stock my LMB in October. Tennessee wildlife resources says stock 500 bream and 100 bass. Most sites I have seen say 10 to 1 ratio. I assume 10 to 1 is for people wanting to raise big bass. That is not my goal, I just want bass to keep bream eaten down.

Had it not been for you guys and joining this forum, I would have stocked HBG, BG, and RES. Down the road that would have been a mess! Does anybody out there have any affordable aeriation ideas for pond with no electric even close bye?

I just cannot see spending 1500 or more on it, there has to be a redneck way to do it, I hope! Thank you all again

My RES are slowing taking pellets more and more each day and FHM love them

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Originally Posted by LANGSTER
Does anybody out there have any affordable aeriation ideas for pond with no electric even close bye?

There is the DIY Solar power option. With the prices associated with buying a system, DIY can be attractive for those on a tight budget.

I had tried to plan out a Solar system for my pond using a rocking piston pump but they demand too much power and the cost for battery storage was prohibitive for me. I would recommend setting your sights on a diaphragm pump such as a Hiblow, that will have lower electric requirements. There's always the option to find a cheaper brand as well but you usually get what you pay for.

I am no solar expert whatsoever though. I just know what little I learned while trying to map out the option for myself although I eventually went to using my house power for my aeration.

You'll need solar panels, 100W can be found for around $100 a piece. You'll need a controller (< $100, maybe < $50), an inverter (< $100, maybe < $50) , battery and an optional timer if you don't want to run it 24/7 (all of which can be found on Amazon and the questions and reviews found with these items can be very informative). Some of those items you can find cheap (controller, inverter) as you'll likely build a system that doesn't require a lot of power. If you haven't went this route with something before, some youtube searches on DIY can be beneficial to get the right components that work with each other and serve your needs. Also, I found a forum that was a big help where members will try to help you with your projects much like the community here does. Also, there are resources on this site as well.

The solar forum I am speaking about is at https://diysolarforum.com/

It wouldn't surprise me if you could find a system that works for your size pond that's $1000 or less if you purchase the items and install it yourself.

One day I'd like to build one myself for the part of my pond that's too far away from my house to run electricity.

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With only stocking 300 CNBG in a 1.1 acre pond, I wouldn't worry about them getting too far ahead of the bass when the bass are stocked in the Fall, in fact only stocking that many I'd recommend waiting for the CNBG to pull off a few successful spawns before adding the LMB. You are fine stocking them this Fall. Only throw 100 in there, you can always add more if needed, but with a great forage base those LMB will be over 12" long in a year.


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I personally believe in stocking a new pond with 10 pounds of fathead minnows, 500 to 1000 3 to 4 inch bluegills, and 300 to 500 red ear sunfish. Use an electric feeder. After a year, add bass.

I realize that different regions should be stocked differently. But, I want to create an environment when the top of the line predator(s) can go to sleep with their mouth open and wake up with a full belly.


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Originally Posted by Dave Davidson1
I want to create an environment when the top of the line predator(s) can go to sleep with their mouth open and wake up with a full belly.

That's a great line to explain that pond management philosophy!

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Friend of mine took me to 4 acre pond yesterday, It was great! We harvested 40 RES 9 to 11 inch and 19 blue gill 9 to 10 inch. It was full off bass we saw small ones everywhere caught 15. That is what I would love to turn this pond stocking into. The RES hit worms, jigs, road runner, and the blue gill crickets and worms. I am thinking about going 300 CNBG and at least 100 to 200 more RES, they fillet like crappie at 10 to eleven inches thick and had shoulders. Then I add 100 bass in october, just thought I would share that. Thanks again, I maybe totally wrong but I think reason people don't catch shellcracker is they do not stock enough, this guy said he stocked this lake/pond ten years ago with 1000 BG and 1000 RES. We caught 2 to 1 RES, I never fished a good bream pond that did not have lots of bass!

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Should I be concerned. The water in this pond is not very clear except on the edges. When I first started feeding, I was getting the FHM to feed on the pellets pretty good ( some RES too) that went on 2 weeks. I have not seen any minnows or fish in a week, they quit eating pellets. I feed every day, now around dark, I do see activity in the middle of the pond. Looks like top water feeding. I did have a large cricket hatch in the last week. But not seeing any minnows has me concerned. I would have thought that feeding would be getting better not just shut off. No floating fish or minnows. Could it be they just have plenty to eat for now without pellets?

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I stopped feeding for 5 days, went back yesterday and most tadpoles are gone. RES and FHM really took pellets pretty good. I am looking forward to getting my CNBG next week. They should take pellets even better. How long should I feed starter food, before I move to bigger pellet? It looks like my RES have grown an inch or better in a month.

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Feed pellets no larger than 25% of the fish's mouth gape.

May be good to get a multi-sized feed or break some up so all sizes can eat.
















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Is there a brand of multi size feed that yall recommend? That is a great idea thanks!

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Start with Optimal Bluegill Jr. transition to Optimal Bluegill the following year and then that year mid summer see if they are big enough to eat the Optimal Bass food. I feed a 50/50 mix of Optimal Bluegill and Optimal Bass food.


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I get my CBNG next friday June 2 so fired up. I have already stocked 300 RES (1.5 to 2 inch, they are 3 to 3.5 inch already) and 10 lbs FHM ( they have already spawned at least once). I was going to get 300 Coppernose and 100 more RES. I was thinking of getting 400 CNBG and another 100 RES and another 5lbs FHM. That would give me 50/50 split. But it would give 800 bream in 1.1 acre pond. Found a source that will bring me 4-6 inch LMB in october 1. The pond does hold a dozen or so wood ducks daily

Am I over doing it? I could just get 300 CBNG and have 600 bream total. I do think the ducks are getting my minnows, which is why adding 5 more lbs

Any opinions welcome

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Langster,

With a goal of big bream and lots of bass I think 300 BG/300 RES is neither too many nor too few. I would lean more towards a small increase in the number of bass. A general rule of thumb for balanced reproduction is 100 LMB 400 BG and 150 RES. This tends to provide multiple years where panfish are capable of growing >8" and LMB are capable of growing > 1 lb. This combination is manageable by harvest. It is easier to grow larger BG/RES when LMB are more numerous. It is easier to grow larger LMB when LMB are less numerous. The keystone is not the BG or RES, the keystone community member is the predator. The LMB is the dog that wags the tail (fishery). Predator population management determines not only what kind of predator fishery you will have but also what kind of pan fish fishery you will have as well. I have said this before, every pond fishery is a compromise and to have more of something involves having less of something else. My sense, from your stated goals is that there is no limit to the size of bream in your goals ... the bigger the better. So all you have to decide is how big you would like your LMB to be. The smaller and more numerous they are, the bigger those BG and RES will get.

I like your starting place with 300/300. With 80% survival to the end of the second year ... with feeding/fertilization ... they could weigh between 350 and 400 lbs all told. This of course excludes the small BG & RES they will spawn and your standing weight of LMB. So it isn't too few for sure. By the end of the 2nd year, you want most all of the progeny spawned by the BG & RES to be consumed by LMB where only a small proportion (much smaller than the initial stocking.. say 100 to 120 or so annually) are growing to a size to evade predation. If you get more recruitment than that you will need to manage the recruitment through harvest of BG and RES. The larger you want your BG/RES to grow, the more restricted that number needs to be ... otherwise ... recruits will compete and usurp the growth of larger fish. If you want to increase to 400/400, I don't think it will take you to an unmanageable place but you will need to do more harvest. With no harvest until the fall of the second year ... you should expect ... however ... a 25% reduction in the individual weights of BG & RES relative to your current plan (assuming equal feed/fertilization).

Last edited by jpsdad; 05/29/22 09:24 AM.

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