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Good Afternoon Everyone,

I am a new member and excited to be here! I recently inherited a 1/10 acre pond on a 6 acre property I purchased. The previous homeowner indicated that the deepest part of the pond is 12-feet, however, I haven't yet verified it myself. The pond is currently fed year-round with 2 miners inches of irrigation water in the summer and half an inch in the winter. Currently the only inhabitants of the pond are 6-8 red-eared sliders, frogs/tadpoles, and some occasional mallards. I would like to stock my pond with fish so that I can teach my daughter to fish there and occasionally fish there myself. I know that 1/10 acre is not that big so I think I have scaled my goals accordingly. I would like to stock fathead minnows in the pond now, add pond structure for spawning and habitat, and add a diffuser for aeration. My plans are to initially stock the pond now with 500 fathead minnows, in the fall add maybe 20 bluegill fingerlings, and next spring add 2-3 largemouth bass fingerlings. Would this be an acceptable stocking rate? I would also like to add two Rouen ducks in the pond area.

Thanks in advance everyone!

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Welcome - Interesting that pond does not look like it is as large as 0.10 ac although looks can be deceiving. Have you checked the pond size using an online area calculator? Try this for pond sizing. Also check your maximum pond depth. IMO you will be lucky if it is over 8ft deep. Ponds are rarely as deep as the seller claims them to be.
http://www.acme.com/planimeter/

My main concern for stocking sportfish into a tiny pond is their ability to reproduce which very often after a few years leads to way too many small stunted fish which after the original BG die of old age would result in No. 1 option below; bass only. There are several much better options for adding fish into a 0.1 ac pond that will result in a very enjoyable fishery. Other members will very likely have other suggestions of stocking options.
Number 1 very important rule to remember is try to add catchable fish that will NOT reproduce or reproduce minimally so the result is fewer fish but higher quality larger fish. Remember the pond is small and has a very limited amount of fish that it can grow due to the small size and limited natural productivity. Thus when you have reproducing fish and low productivity this almost always results in lots of small under fed fish that are not growing due to too many mouths to feed and not enough food present.

1. One common option would be to stock only largemouth bass. They would not grow any bigger than 10"-12" which would be fun catching for your daughter. The bass would reproduce annually and eat most all the offspring, any other invertebrates, anything alive that fits into their mouth, and maybe some minnows if any can survive 1 year of bass predation. For a situation like this,,, the pond would likely support 8-12 bass depending on their size. the larger they are the fewer the pond would support due to natural carrying capacity. Now if you regularly fed those bass, purchased as pellet trained bass, then the pond could easily support 2-3 times more bass or pounds of bass. Carrying capacity is based on poundage the pond can support from the amount of food it produces. More numbers as smaller fish, fewer as larger fish, and all weighing close to the same total fish poundage per acre.

2. Another option is to stock only hybrid striped bass(HSB) into this pond. HSB may be difficult to locate in CA. They are raised to eat fish pellets. They will not reproduce in ponds. As they die for whatever reason replace some of their numbers every couple years. Several of these HSB could be raised to 16"-18" long in your small pond. A few are or should be stocked every year or two to maintain several sizes and ages for some variety of the fishery.

3. Another option, if you are adept at fisheries is to stock only female LMbass or only male LMbass. With just one sex or the other,,, you would have LMbass with no reproduction. These bass would grow bigger due to more food available for fewer bass than if both sexes were in the pond. One way you can best determine a female bass from the wild is to catch females at spawning time when they are plump with eggs or catch males off the nest and would be ripe with and oozing white milt. A few male bass would grow up to 2-3 pounds ( 15”-17”) in your small pond.

4. Use one of the above predator options and each spring when water reaches 70F add some tilapia for algae and small submerged plant control. This would keep the pond clean and no chemicals would be necessary. Reproducing tilapia would never over populate the pond because they die each winter when water temper ature drops below 50F. Some species of tilapia will die at 55 or 60F. Tilapia in this small pond would tolerate the high CA air / water temperatures in this small pond. Tilapia as a fish in your pond would be harvestable as dinner guests. A win, win fish for this small pond that could easily develop significant weed and or algae problems.

5. Tilapia are available and legal to stock in CA according to: https://www.alpinefishery.com/ Check with the farm for regulations in California.

This place or one similar to it in CA should be able to sell you tilapia. https://www.ezfarmsandfish.com/

Tilapia by themselves in the pond, would keep the pond very weed / algae free and when they are 8"+ they are a very good hard fighting panfish and very good to eat. Some tilapia are sold as male only fish and some farms sell 50:50 males and females. Ask before buying.

With plenty of food Tilapia grow very fast as 2”-3” per month in warm water small ponds. Expect them to die every winter when water becomes 50F. A small 0.1ac pond would support 10-20 tilapia each spring and could by late summer produce 14” fish if stocker fish were 5”-7” long. It is an annual cheap price for a high quality weed free pond and some fun angler experiences each year.

Last edited by Bill Cody; 02/15/22 10:31 AM.

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This place https://www.wcfisheries.com/Fish_in_California is a bit closer than Alpine.

From the looks of the pond I would be very surprised if it is 12' deep. I'd venture to guess 6', maybe 8'. Please let me know how close I am.


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Here's the picture of the pond:

[Linked Image]


It does look a bit smaller than 1/10 acre, and if so, a depth of 12' would seem unrealistic, but there's nothing in the picture to reference the actual size of the pond. Looks like it will be fun to develop.


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Thank you all for your feedback. The pond is approximately 90 feet long by 50 feet wide, obviously it is not a rectangle so I would say close to but shy of 1/10. I like the idea of stocking several nonreproducing bass to the mix of forage fish and some tilapia for weed control/catching+eating. I forgot to mention that I plan to supplement with feed. Ideally I would enlarge the left side (picture above) of the pond with an excavator but I have to clear a fallen oak tree first. I have 500 FHM on order from Toledo so I am looking forward to placing them in the pond this weekend along with cinderblock structure and crisscrossed stacked 3" drainage pipe with wrapped in wire sized to exclude anything larger than minnows for them to reproduce and such.

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Let us know how it progresses!

50' wide at a 3:1 slope = 8.3' deep in the center. 2:1 slope = 12.5' deep in the center.

You can put a weight that will sink a bobber on a line. Cast across the pond, drag it back. When the bobber doesn't float any more, reel in, adjust so the bobber is further up the line, repeat. A slip bobber works great for this. Then measure the distance from the bobber to the sinker once the bobber stops being submerged at the deepest spot.

That's an easy way to tell the depth from the shore.

Or if you have other places that you'd like to check the depth, something like this would work too. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01CQLVO5U/?tag=myonefish-20

My neighbor has one and he used it to map my personal pond, and it was VERY close to the mapping software I had on a depth finder on the boat.


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Originally Posted by esshup
Let us know how it progresses!

50' wide at a 3:1 slope = 8.3' deep in the center. 2:1 slope = 12.5' deep in the center.

You can put a weight that will sink a bobber on a line. Cast across the pond, drag it back. When the bobber doesn't float any more, reel in, adjust so the bobber is further up the line, repeat. A slip bobber works great for this. Then measure the distance from the bobber to the sinker once the bobber stops being submerged at the deepest spot.

That's an easy way to tell the depth from the shore.

Or if you have other places that you'd like to check the depth, something like this would work too. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01CQLVO5U/?tag=myonefish-20

My neighbor has one and he used it to map my personal pond, and it was VERY close to the mapping software I had on a depth finder on the boat.

Thanks for the tips. I was planning on just swimming in the pond when I placed the structures. laugh

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Originally Posted by BillyBones
Originally Posted by esshup
Let us know how it progresses!

50' wide at a 3:1 slope = 8.3' deep in the center. 2:1 slope = 12.5' deep in the center.

You can put a weight that will sink a bobber on a line. Cast across the pond, drag it back. When the bobber doesn't float any more, reel in, adjust so the bobber is further up the line, repeat. A slip bobber works great for this. Then measure the distance from the bobber to the sinker once the bobber stops being submerged at the deepest spot.

That's an easy way to tell the depth from the shore.

Or if you have other places that you'd like to check the depth, something like this would work too. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01CQLVO5U/?tag=myonefish-20

My neighbor has one and he used it to map my personal pond, and it was VERY close to the mapping software I had on a depth finder on the boat.

Thanks for the tips. I was planning on just swimming in the pond when I placed the structures. laugh



Oh man!!! Who's got a picture of King Ding-A-Ling????


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No comment.


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Generally the bigger that you want those bass to be in the pond, the fewer of them there should be in there. Again -- the carrying capacity limit of each acre or 0.1 acre is a big limiting factor. Don't forget that water quality conditions play an equal role. Bad water quality conditions will kill all the fish no matter what size the fish are. Our moderator Condello killed a whole pond of pellet eating HUGE hybrid striped bass in learning that very important basic lesson. I hope you are talented enough to select some single sex LMB in your angling adventures. If you plan to buy the single sex bass, be cautious of what a fish farm tells you what sex they are. Ask for a money-back guarantee. In my history, I trusted a fish farm guy I know for selling me all female perch. Now I am one of those King-Ding-A-Lings. Anyone want to buy some small yellow perch? LOL.

Last edited by Bill Cody; 02/16/22 11:01 AM.

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BillyBones, just don't be this guy.......

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Excerpt from Robert Crais' "The Monkey's Raincoat:"
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Originally Posted by Bill Cody
Now I am one of those King-Ding-A-Lings.
We've seen your boat, Bill. You're Admiral Ding-a-Ling.


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Originally Posted by Sunil
BillyBones, just don't be this guy.......

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Who wouldn't want to be an infamous pondmeister, hand-deploying masterful artificial structure carefully constructed from scientifically selected used buckets, plastic tile scraps, an old dishwasher rack, and the remnants of a 100 gallon watering trough that nearly burned to the ground, using pool noodles, in order to grow award-winning giant BG?

P.S. Aviators are cool.


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Originally Posted by Bill Cody
Generally the bigger that you want those bass to be in the pond, the fewer of them there should be in there. Again -- the carrying capacity limit of each acre or 0.1 acre is a big limiting factor. Don't forget that water quality conditions play an equal role. Bad water quality conditions will kill all the fish no matter what size the fish are. Our moderator Condello killed a whole pond of pellet eating HUGE hybrid striped bass in learning that very important basic lesson. I hope you are talented enough to select some single sex LMB in your angling adventures. If you plan to buy the single sex bass, be cautious of what a fish farm tells you what sex they are. Ask for a money-back guarantee. In my history, I trusted a fish farm guy I know for selling me all female perch. Now I am one of those King-Ding-A-Lings. Anyone want to buy some small yellow perch? LOL.

I'm going to take it slow adding fish and allow plenty of time to see how the pond responds. Today I will add the 500 small FHM I ordered from Toledo and start giving them structure. I plan on adding a diffuser to the pond this spring. I like the idea of adding blue tilapia and I found a place that has tilapia fingerlings so I will try a few of those as the weather warms up. Then perhaps BG and maybe 1-2 LMB in the fall, but that can be pushed out to next spring.

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Originally Posted by BillyBones
Originally Posted by Bill Cody
Generally the bigger that you want those bass to be in the pond, the fewer of them there should be in there. Again -- the carrying capacity limit of each acre or 0.1 acre is a big limiting factor. Don't forget that water quality conditions play an equal role. Bad water quality conditions will kill all the fish no matter what size the fish are. Our moderator Condello killed a whole pond of pellet eating HUGE hybrid striped bass in learning that very important basic lesson. I hope you are talented enough to select some single sex LMB in your angling adventures. If you plan to buy the single sex bass, be cautious of what a fish farm tells you what sex they are. Ask for a money-back guarantee. In my history, I trusted a fish farm guy I know for selling me all female perch. Now I am one of those King-Ding-A-Lings. Anyone want to buy some small yellow perch? LOL.

I'm going to take it slow adding fish and allow plenty of time to see how the pond responds. Today I will add the 500 small FHM I ordered from Toledo and start giving them structure. I plan on adding a diffuser to the pond this spring. I like the idea of adding blue tilapia and I found a place that has tilapia fingerlings so I will try a few of those as the weather warms up. Then perhaps BG and maybe 1-2 LMB in the fall, but that can be pushed out to next spring.

The ONLY way that I know to sex LMB is to determine if they have either eggs or milt in them. Any other times of the year is a gamble. If someone knows how else to determine sex 100% accurately, please let me know.


www.hoosierpondpros.com


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Originally Posted by esshup
Originally Posted by BillyBones
Originally Posted by Bill Cody
Generally the bigger that you want those bass to be in the pond, the fewer of them there should be in there. Again -- the carrying capacity limit of each acre or 0.1 acre is a big limiting factor. Don't forget that water quality conditions play an equal role. Bad water quality conditions will kill all the fish no matter what size the fish are. Our moderator Condello killed a whole pond of pellet eating HUGE hybrid striped bass in learning that very important basic lesson. I hope you are talented enough to select some single sex LMB in your angling adventures. If you plan to buy the single sex bass, be cautious of what a fish farm tells you what sex they are. Ask for a money-back guarantee. In my history, I trusted a fish farm guy I know for selling me all female perch. Now I am one of those King-Ding-A-Lings. Anyone want to buy some small yellow perch? LOL.

I'm going to take it slow adding fish and allow plenty of time to see how the pond responds. Today I will add the 500 small FHM I ordered from Toledo and start giving them structure. I plan on adding a diffuser to the pond this spring. I like the idea of adding blue tilapia and I found a place that has tilapia fingerlings so I will try a few of those as the weather warms up. Then perhaps BG and maybe 1-2 LMB in the fall, but that can be pushed out to next spring.

The ONLY way that I know to sex LMB is to determine if they have either eggs or milt in them. Any other times of the year is a gamble. If someone knows how else to determine sex 100% accurately, please let me know.

No rush to add LMB, I don't mind waiting until next year's spawn to get it right.

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Billy bones who did you find with blue tilapia fingerlings and what did you find out about stocking in California ponds

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Originally Posted by cb100
Billy bones who did you find with blue tilapia fingerlings and what did you find out about stocking in California ponds

https://lakewaytilapia.com/Live_Tilapia_For_Sale.php

This is the website I found. Looks like they ship to most states.

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Originally Posted by BillyBones
Originally Posted by cb100
Billy bones who did you find with blue tilapia fingerlings and what did you find out about stocking in California ponds

https://lakewaytilapia.com/Live_Tilapia_For_Sale.php

This is the website I found. Looks like they ship to most states.

Billy, when you contact them ask them how they know that their Blue Tilapia are not hybrid Tilapia, i.e. ask if they are genetically tested. I was talking to Rainman a while back and he said that there are VERY few pure Blue Tilapia suppliers left in the USA.


www.hoosierpondpros.com


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I'll have to set my large aquarium back up and order some tilapia so I can keep the water temperature up until my pond temperature raises up.plus I can put a little size on them before releasing them

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What did you find on stocking tilapia in California. knowing how they are on almost every other regulation I am surprised that they will allow it.even though there is no danger of them surviving the winter California wants to regulate everything.

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Originally Posted by esshup
Originally Posted by BillyBones
Originally Posted by cb100
Billy bones who did you find with blue tilapia fingerlings and what did you find out about stocking in California ponds

https://lakewaytilapia.com/Live_Tilapia_For_Sale.php

This is the website I found. Looks like they ship to most states.

Billy, when you contact them ask them how they know that their Blue Tilapia are not hybrid Tilapia, i.e. ask if they are genetically tested. I was talking to Rainman a while back and he said that there are VERY few pure Blue Tilapia suppliers left in the USA.

esshup, I was curious so I emailed that outfit today.


For me, every fish that goes in is only in for a couple months and they die. I guess buying 'food grade' as described on their website with the best growing potential would make the most sense to get the hungriest and fastest growing tilapia to eat the most algae possible. The Texas ponds get the bonus of the adult tilapia having thousands of young and the multitude of small mouths really is where the algae starts disappearing. In MI there is no time for babies by the time mid October comes and they die.

Their webpage is incredibly detailed about how they sort, grade, and choose fish based on their growth patterns. Browsing their webpage it sounds like a lot of time must go into watching, measuring, separating, feeding and growing. They seem fairly detail oriented. However the person who replied seemed to not be very happy to have to answer the question. He sent me actually 2 different replies to the same email so perhaps it is a topic that he really gets passionate about.


Reply 1:
"We get health certificate every year and part of the process is selecting the species to be tested. The lab verifies the species and provides a health certificate for them.

That said, there is nothing preventing us from intentionally mixing our species after the test or deliberately sending you the wrong species. So any “hatchery” with ill intent and without concern or understanding of how reputation can affect a business can easily send you genetically mixed fish.

I point that out for the same reason that I point out the uselessness of the health certificates that we pay for every year. Nothing stops a “hatchery” from sending you fish that were diseased right after the health certificate was issued.

So in the end it's all about reputation and nothing more. We know what we have and we know what we do, if you need more than you should shop around until you find someone that makes you feel good, because thats all it is, a feeling.

Good luck,"

Reply #2:
"Another way to look at it is like this.

As a professional hatchery, we do the most common things. For example, there are over 100 different fish diseases that tilapia can get, but to test for every one, we would have to charge $5 per fish. So instead, we pay to test for the most common diseases and if the farmer wants to test for something else, he can. We sell fish to science labs. I necessary, the lab will do a PCR test to check for the fish against the known ladders (DNA test).

Our health certificates only tell the farmers that the particular fish that we sent to the lab passed the test at that time. They will still have to re-test the fish before they can sell them in most situations. Same thing with DNA tests. Just because a particular fish passes a DNA test does not mean anything about the fish shipped tomorrow. So from a business perspective, paying $2.500 to $3,500 for DNA results that are utterly unusable by anyone for any purpose other than to make someone feel good, just isn’t prudent.

Ultimately, they will have to do their own test if purity is important to them. To my knowledge, the only entity that has received fish from us that absolutely needed them to be pure was the University of Maryland School of Medicine and they did their own tests and ordered more and even tested the second batch.

So if the genetic purity of a handful of fish that you put into your pond is that important to you, by all means, get them tested and if they don’t pass, I’ll buy them back from you. But remember also that herons and other wild birds regurgitate fish into your pond and they don’t get the DNA tested. LOL

Hope that offers another way to look at it. Have a nice weekend."

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Originally Posted by cb100
What did you find on stocking tilapia in California. knowing how they are on almost every other regulation I am surprised that they will allow it.even though there is no danger of them surviving the winter California wants to regulate everything.


cb100, their webpage says there is no regulation that prohibits them from shipping to any of the 50 states. I bet there may be some additional fine print somewhere but they feel very confident based on the language of their webpage that it is not illegal (maybe not illegal FOR THEM to provide them, but maybe illegal for you to have them?)

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Canyoncreek thanks for the response I did see that after I posted. If I just have to guarantee that they won't leave my property. I guess I am ok by the time my pond is warm enough it is below full pool and we don't usually get enough rain to create over flow until it would normally be cold enough to cause mortality. The two ponds that I would put them in flow through two other ponds on my property with screens on all the spillways so I think I would be pretty safe

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Buying fish and having them shipped is a slippery slope. That may not be the correct terminology, but for instance in some states buying "X" fish for an aquarium is legal while buying the same fish to stock in a pond is illegal. Look at Illinois. It's illegal to stock tilapia in a pond there. It's legal to buy tilapia to put in an aquarium. Illinois requires tilapia that are brought into the state from Indiana to be health tested, even if the fish are going to an oriental fish market for human consumption as live fish.

Canyoncreek, they talked a lot about the health testing that was done, but nothing about the species testing. Blue Tilapia will survive water temps in the upper 40's Mozzies will die in water temps warmer than that. If using Tilapia for algae control, you want them to live as long as possible because algae will grow in all liquid water temperatures.

I have to be very picky when I buy fish. If I am not, then my customers don't get what they want, and it's up to me to make it right, which costs both extra time and money.

For instance, I bought "Blue" Tilapia for stocking this past Spring. They were stocked in water temp of 65°F. We had a cold snap where the water temp dropped to 58°F. Some customers called and said that they were seeing dead Tilapia. This was well past the time that the customer could have said the tilapia died from poor transportation practices. I could have said "Sorry, I don't know why they died, you will need to buy replacements." But instead I called the supplier and questioned them. Turns out that their "Pure Blue Tilapia" weren't as pure as they thought and I ended up replacing the fish that died. No particular rhyme or reason why they died EXCEPT for water temperature. Blues won't die at that temp, so they couldn't have been pure blues......

Here in Indiana, we have to adhere to different rules than other suppliers that aren't in a state that touches one of the Great Lakes. Here we have to get fish health certified before they can be moved out of state, providing they touch Indiana water, even if it is just well water. For instance, if I buy Channel Cats in Missouri, and deliver them to Illinois (or Michigan), then no further testing is needed. If I do a water change in the tanks here in Indiana before bringing them to Michigan or Illinois, then they need to be tested again and have a clean bill of health before being delivered, even if they never left the hauling tank (which is impossible to do).

Michigan is a whole 'nother world when it comes to stocking ponds as you know. That's why there are very few companies that will stock Michigan ponds if they are from out of state. You as a pond owner have to get permission from the DNR to stock your pond if you have a water inflow or outflow device in your pond, even if the water outflow dumps onto a pasture. We as the fish supplier have to have a copy of that permit in the truck before we can cross the state line or we can get in just much trouble as you the property owner for stocking fish into waters of the state without a permit. THEN add the 3 continuous years of clean bills of health and that adds a whole additional layer of difficulty in stocking there.


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3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).
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