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#543384 01/25/22 10:30 AM
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azteca Online Content OP
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Hello.

Several provinces consider Smallmouth bass invasive after being introduced.

British Columbia, Manitoba, Saguenay river and lake St-Jean in Quebec, New-Brunswick, Nova Scotia.


https://bcinvasives.ca/invasives/smallmouth-bass/

https://fviss.ca/smallmouthbass-cultus

https://globalnews.ca/news/7371495/...asive-smallmouth-bass-in-st-marys-river/

https://www.thestar.com/news/canada...k-watershed-delayed-until-next-year.html
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Smallmouth are......................AWESOME!!!!!


Excerpt from Robert Crais' "The Monkey's Raincoat:"
"She took another microscopic bite of her sandwich, then pushed it away. Maybe she absorbed nutrients from her surroundings."

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I'm keying in on an invasive species then!! :-))

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Hello.

If the Smallmouth Bass is the black sheep of our fish, I want it.
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Last edited by jpsdad; 01/25/22 05:44 PM.

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It isn't what we don't know that gives us trouble, it's what we know that ain't so - Will Rogers


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Originally Posted by jpsdad

What's the difference between the colors on the map? There is no key to the colors on the map.............


www.hoosierpondpros.com


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3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).
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native range - yellow
non-native area - red/brown

Last edited by ewest; 01/26/22 12:12 PM.















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This just in - Homo Sapiens not indigenous to North America! The invasive species is believed to have been introduced between 13,000 and 30,000 years ago.


"Live like you'll die tomorrow, but manage your grass like you'll live forever."
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Originally Posted by Theo Gallus
This just in - Homo Sapiens not indigenous to North America! The invasive species is believed to have been introduced between 13,000 and 30,000 years ago.


Just in ? Knew that news travels….. but? Who’s been sitting on that tidbit

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Originally Posted by ewest
native range - yellow
non-native area - red/brown
Does this actually mean invasive? No.. Means introduced there. Some feel that is however invasive.
Not dogging ewest, just using that key as an example. Everybody does it different but Kansas's process is "If the species has been verified in an impoundment, or verified in a down-stream area from where a stocking is requested, in the last 70 years and is not on the invasive list" they can be stocked without the paperwork process that usually accompanies this type of stuff.
Thinking out-loud here but for a species that doesn't seem to do super well where LMB exist and prosper it's kind of funny.

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Originally Posted by Snipe
Originally Posted by ewest
native range - yellow
non-native area - red/brown
Does this actually mean invasive? No.. Means introduced there. Some feel that is however invasive.
Not dogging ewest, just using that key as an example. ....

No problem smile Just using the right word. This is not a cut and dry issue by any means. I did not use invasive on purpose and must comment on non-native. The way both are determined is very uncertain. Example - different studies including tracing genetics back have different interpretations on what native range is for many species. On SMB see the chart and how many rivers are involved. Fish can easily move by rivers, live there for generations, die out in that area and later reestablish. So is that species in that location, native or non-native ? Does it depend on if the second introduction is by man stocking or by fish swimming? In most places, close to native range, can one be sure how the fish got there?

Of course, some situations are clear. IIRC there were no LMB west of the Rockies until man moved them there - clearly non-native.

Last edited by ewest; 01/27/22 11:33 AM.















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Any creature, wherever happens to find itself, does its best to flourish and survive to the betterment of its own kind. How successful a creature is as flourishing in non-native habitats is probably a good indicator of its invasiveness in habitats where it is not native. It's not complicated.

To Theo's point, we really can't exclude ourselves. It's only natural to want to flourish. The saga has been going on a very long time, most of that time without us, but we've most certainly accelerated it now that we are here.


Common sense is not so common - Voltaire

It isn't what we don't know that gives us trouble, it's what we know that ain't so - Will Rogers


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Originally Posted by azteca
Hello.

If the Smallmouth Bass is the black sheep of our fish, I want it.
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As a black sheep, Smallmouth are baaaaa-d to the bone.

Last edited by anthropic; 01/27/22 09:28 PM.

7ac 2015 CNBG RES FHM 2016 TP FLMB 2017 NLMB GSH L 2018 TP & 70 HSB PK 2019 TP RBT 2020 TFS TP 25 HSB & 250 F1,L,RBT -206 2021 TFS TP GSH L,-312 2022 GSH TP CR TFS -110




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Hello.

They say Smallmouth bass prefer cooler water.

Wow, Smallmouth bass in Hawaii.

https://dlnr.hawaii.gov/ais/other-ais/smallmouth-bass/

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You can get almost any temperature you want in Hawaii.

I have touched snow near the summit of Mauna Kea (13,796 ft, 4,205 m) and then been swimming on the beach in a tropical ocean three hours later!

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Hello.

Yes it's true, just watching the following introduction by man.

Smallmouth bass in Hawaii.

Largemouth bass in Alaska.

http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/index.cfm?adfg=wildlifenews.view_article&articles_id=886
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LMB is in the top 10 most invasive fish species in the world... Wow..

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Kenny
What are the rest of the top 10 invasive species?

Last edited by Bill Cody; 01/31/22 08:15 PM. Reason: clarification added top 10
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Hello.

Although the bass was imported to Europe around 1880.

Did you know that a big part of the bass imported in France was by the American GI's.




https://www-achigan-net.translate.g...tr_sl=fr&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=fr

Last edited by azteca; 01/31/22 08:57 PM.
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Originally Posted by Snipe
LMB is in the top 10 most invasive fish species in the world... Wow..

That's exactly what I thought. Didn't actually expect it to be as high as that on the list but did know they have been spread around and have caused a lot of ecological damage.

Pat, I know you asked Snipe and I don't know the answer but Wiki's list may be good place to start. Selecting fish from the top down I got the following list in this order.

1. Walking catfish
2. Common Carp
3. Gambusia affinis
4. Nile Perch
5. Largemouth Bass
6. Rainbow Trout
7. Mozambique Tilapia
8. Brown Trout

There weren't any other fish in the list of top 100 invasive species at Wiki.


Common sense is not so common - Voltaire

It isn't what we don't know that gives us trouble, it's what we know that ain't so - Will Rogers


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Sorry Pat, not getting to spend as much time on the forum as I'd like to.. Not sure on the other 9 but jpsdad has the best suggestion I could think of as well.. I have to think back at what ewest said but maybe invasive and non-native can both mean different things at different times...???

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When I looked at the list two things stood out, LMB and Gambusia affinis. Each species has significant overlap and it made me wonder where are BG in this mix? Both BG and Gams are prey fish that co-evolved with LMB. Resistant to the predation of admittedly one of the strongest freshwater predators of prey the size of juvenile BG and smaller.

For most people I think invasiveness is a function of whether they would like more of them. Take Augie who has SMB and doesn't want BG. He might describe BG as invasive even though they are native to his neck of the woods. He might say the same of LMB if they happened to get in and squeezed out the SMB.

I guess the problem arises when not everyone wants the same thing or especially when some want something which will cause damage to the things others want. Finding agreement doesn't seem to matter long term because we have a tendency to change our minds anyway.


Common sense is not so common - Voltaire

It isn't what we don't know that gives us trouble, it's what we know that ain't so - Will Rogers


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I will cry if I ever find a LMB in my pond.

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In case anyone cares about semantics of invasive vs. aggressive species: https://moinvasives.org/invasive-plant-definitions-native-invasive-aggressive/


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