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#530502 02/11/21 01:40 PM
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Hello.

Are there members here who breed crayfish for fun, and put them back in the pond in the fall.

Take females full of eggs in the spring and rear the young.

A+

azteca #530530 02/12/21 01:44 AM
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Around this part of the world them mud bugs get eaten.... tasty lil critters....

azteca #530763 02/17/21 07:24 PM
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Yep


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
azteca #530767 02/17/21 08:26 PM
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I have done it for experiments. In most instances females already in berry where brought inside to incubate young. The young where then placed in rather large plankton cultures so they could advance through some instars to get more size. This was done to make so I had a better handle on the number of crayfish stocked that actually survived the first day. Only a couple of times have I pulled off the first mating through independence with crayfish like you have in Canada. The crawfish like down south are easy as pie to bread even in Tupperware bowls. There is still a procedure, but simple.


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azteca #530775 02/18/21 10:11 AM
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Hello.

In my small pond where I raise my Yellow-perch fry, there are always filamentous algae, but I control fairly well with tadpoles and panels.

But I would like to try and see how the little crayfish will behave and if they will eat lots of filamentous algae.

A+

azteca #530777 02/18/21 10:39 AM
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In my experience, the crayfish, especially the smaller ones, will not do much consuming of the filamentous algae. Larger crayfish at higher densities can offer a level of control by damaging it looking for eats hiding within clumps of algae. That higher density of crayfis will be harder to sustain, especially with abundance of crayfish eating fish.

Last edited by Jim Wetzel; 02/18/21 11:19 AM.

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azteca #530779 02/18/21 11:02 AM
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My plans are to add a bunch of them asap (if any survived this weather) to the pond this spring to help reduce some of the BPW and feed some of the lmb. I hope they will feed on the BPW. When I first added them to my new pond at that time, they denuded all the plant life.


Do not judge me by the politicians in my City, State or Federal Government.


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TGW1 #530797 02/19/21 01:26 AM
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Originally Posted by TGW1
My plans are to add a bunch of them asap (if any survived this weather) to the pond this spring to help reduce some of the BPW and feed some of the lmb. I hope they will feed on the BPW. When I first added them to my new pond at that time, they denuded all the plant life.

Anyone know if mud bugs will eat slender spikerush?

azteca #530811 02/19/21 09:25 AM
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It's been my limited experience that crawdads tend to eat the submerged plants more than the others and tend to really like the ones that float their leaves on the surface. I have struggled with starting APW and Lilies due to the craws. The APW got uprooted overnight after I seeded the pond with over 100 sprigs. I assume they are after the more tender roots. The lilies are affected the same way except they don't get uprooted, but appear to be damaged at the roots which hinders the growth that can lead to the death of the plant. They also put the hammer on some Mud Plantain that I tried to get started.

I have taken to growing the APW and Lilies in hanging basket/buckets off the dock to keep the craws from doing what craws do. You can tell if a craw finds its way into the APW bucket by the overnight loss of greenery...remove the craw and it comes back fairly quickly. The lilies take longer for the craw's harm to show and it may be too late.

I have always thought that they were eating FA at my pond, but it may just be that they keep it muddy enough to thwart it. But, with the absence of forage, I have seen CC fill their belly with FA...Craws could be convinced to do the same I suspect.

I have a common Spike Rush at my shoreline and the craws don't touch it.

Plants that have been established with a high population of craws are...

Thalia Dealbata,
Arrowhead,
Pickerel Weed,
Common Spike Rush.

The Jury is out on whether the craws are getting at my Water Primrose, but I suspect they are. It's too soon to tell as I just installed them last late summer. They did not gorge on it, but it is having a hard time taking a hold.


Fish on!,
Noel
azteca #530992 02/25/21 08:06 AM
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There are new developments in the knowledge of North American Cambarids. In addition to the genetic quirk of the Procambarus Fallax (marbled crayfish) which reproduces by obligate parthenogenesis (can't even cross with males of Procambarus Fallax), another species native to Atlantic drainages, the spiny-cheeked crayfish of the genera Orconectes has been observed to reproduce by parthenogenesis when females are isolated from males for a sufficient period. Also, in China, where Procambarus Clarkii (red swamp) has been invasive for many decades. Genetic testing of a sample of 175 crayfish indicated the presence of 4 clones where the odds by sexual reproduction are about 1 in 10,000 (meaning that these apparent clones were likely produced by parthenogenesis)


Common sense is not so common - Voltaire

It isn't what we don't know that gives us trouble, it's what we know that ain't so - Will Rogers


azteca #531004 02/25/21 02:45 PM
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QA: Thanks for helping us with your real world experience on what plants did best in presence of crayfish. I like the pictures and blossom color of the pickerel weed. I have no idea if it will survive our MI winters but where can one find some and how do you get it started? Does it have to plant in a certain depth of soil? In a basket suspended or in the ground?

I know of a ditch on the side of the road that stays wet that has some skunk cabbage in it. Might try a transplant.

The only vegetation I have period is FA (I know probably not officially a plant) and several 'sedge' varieties and a taller probably rush type plant. I did get some plants that had burrs on it that I think are Beggars-ticks (bidens pilosa) or something similar. These spindly bushes are mostly above the water so they really don't add any underwater refuge but have cool purple colored tips in the fall and I was so happy to see SOMETHING grow that I just let them be.

Looking for other low growing, shallow water 'crops' for the tiny fry but not spreading/floating all over

azteca #531008 02/25/21 03:01 PM
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Pickerel weed is native and common in southern Michigan. Emergent so in shallow water.

azteca #531013 02/25/21 06:10 PM
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Love pickerel weed!
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

azteca #531042 02/26/21 12:39 AM
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softstem bulrush is another I can safely say craws won't mess with... It's the only plant I had left before Crawmation 2020.

Edit: I'm still green with envy RAH...

Last edited by Snipe; 02/26/21 12:40 AM.
jpsdad #531043 02/26/21 12:55 AM
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Originally Posted by jpsdad
There are new developments in the knowledge of North American Cambarids. In addition to the genetic quirk of the Procambarus Fallax (marbled crayfish) which reproduces by obligate parthenogenesis (can't even cross with males of Procambarus Fallax), another species native to Atlantic drainages, the spiny-cheeked crayfish of the genera Orconectes has been observed to reproduce by parthenogenesis when females are isolated from males for a sufficient period. Also, in China, where Procambarus Clarkii (red swamp) has been invasive for many decades. Genetic testing of a sample of 175 crayfish indicated the presence of 4 clones where the odds by sexual reproduction are about 1 in 10,000 (meaning that these apparent clones were likely produced by parthenogenesis)

I've had dates where the lady suddenly developed an interest in parthenogenesis. Oddly, things never seemed to go well thereafter.

Last edited by anthropic; 02/26/21 01:01 AM.

7ac, 2015 CNBG, RES, FHM; 2016 TP, FLMB. 2017 NLMB & GSH,L. 2018 TP & 70 HSB, PK. 2019 TP, RBT,. 2020 TFS,TP, 25 HSB & 250 F1,L,RBT, -206. 2021 TFS,TP, GSH, -310




azteca #531065 02/26/21 08:32 AM
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Quote
I've had dates where the lady suddenly developed an interest in parthenogenesis. Oddly, things never seemed to go well thereafter.
Now that there is funny and IMO safe for PBoss.

Last edited by Bill Cody; 02/26/21 08:32 AM.

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azteca #531076 02/26/21 09:07 AM
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Canyon - My Pickerel Weed sees little water level fluctuation. A 10 inch variation in water level covers the year. The top of the soil it is rooted in always has water covering it, certainly an inch or 2 at low levels and at full pool its in about 8 inches of water. I have noticed no difference in its health at any of these situations. The shoreline along my dam is loaded heavy with rip-rap and this houses the bulk of the crawdads. This is where the Pickerel Weed is planted...the craws must not like the taste as it thrives there.

I planted them after the pond dam was rip-rapped and filled. I decided to construct a pile of rocks in a ring for each planting. My dam drops off rather quickly hence the need for the elevated rings to ensure they were planted in shallow water, but not so shallow that low pool would leave them high and dry. The rings were filled with seasoned muck dirt from the pond renovation and the sprigs were planted there. I have added more muck dirt to the rings over the last few falls because it settles out of the rings and/or the craws dig it out some. It has spread out from the rings into the surrounding pond bottom and my hope is that the dirt installments will become unnecessary.

I bought mine from...PondMegaStore. I have bought a couple rounds of plants from them and the experiences were good. The Pickerel Weeds that I received were nice while some other varieties seemed a bit on the small side for the price. For some reason, the Blue Pickerel Rush (Pontederia Cordata) all survived while the White Pickerel Rush
(Pickerel Cordata Alba) did not make it into the second season.

Last edited by Quarter Acre; 02/26/21 10:03 AM.

Fish on!,
Noel
jim100 #531088 02/26/21 11:20 AM
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Thanks, I'm not sure I ever saw this native in my area in the ponds but I need to keep an eye out. The purple flowers are they spring or summer flowers?
I'll look around online to see where I can order some pickerel weed.

azteca #531089 02/26/21 11:25 AM
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QA, if you have time, can you go back to this link and help me with which species you picked? Which of the purple ones did you find worked well?

https://pondmegastore.com/apps/omega-search/?q=pickerel

azteca #531090 02/26/21 11:44 AM
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I also lost my white pickerel weed. Lizard's tail also seems to thrive with crayfish.
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Last edited by RAH; 02/26/21 11:46 AM.
azteca #531091 02/26/21 11:56 AM
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Canyon - Pickerel Rush (Pontederia Cordata)...

https://pondmegastore.com/products/pontederia-cordata

It says good in hardy zone 3 to 10, so depending where you are in Michigan...you might be pushing it. Mine flower all summer with them tapering off deep into the fall.


Fish on!,
Noel
azteca #540777 10/19/21 10:09 AM
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As far as the crayfish question;

Has anyone ever heard of buying the next day delivery crawdads for pond stocking? To feed pond fish?
The ones that can be bought by the sackful live for eating.

I know there could be an issue of invasive but I think they are already pretty established in a bunch of states.

Just asking for a friend….


Is it feasible to trap crawdads locally and put in a pond to do the same?

azteca #540783 10/19/21 03:34 PM
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I think the local craws are best. They are going to be best adapted to the climate of the locale. It doesn't have to be a lot of them. A good to time to seek them out is in the March through May time frame at your location. Most species of crays up there will exude eggs around then. If he can find just a few of them and a bit of cover for them ... they'll establish. The numbers they can reach will depend on the available cover and their predators. One only need a few pounds overwintering each year to contribute meaningfully to forage.


Common sense is not so common - Voltaire

It isn't what we don't know that gives us trouble, it's what we know that ain't so - Will Rogers


azteca #540793 10/19/21 06:07 PM
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I think those crayfish bought by the sack are red swamp crayfish. They get big and if reproducing and recruiting they could be invasive causing problems of muddy water in your pond. Have a good plan of eliminating them if they cause lots of unwanted problems. Ohio native crayfish that are smaller are less likely to cause pond problems.


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Bill Cody #540796 10/20/21 06:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Bill Cody
I think those crayfish bought by the sack are red swamp crayfish. They get big and if reproducing and recruiting they could be invasive causing problems of muddy water in your pond. Have a good plan of eliminating them if they cause lots of unwanted problems. Ohio native crayfish that are smaller are less likely to cause pond problems.

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Do the Red Swamp Crayfish get bigger than these?


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