Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations Optimal Junior feed

I ordered 3 bags of their feed - Optimal Junior - says it has various sizes of pellets for smaller to larger blue gill. When I feed it I watch after it hits the water - half of it sinks to the bottom immediately - other half floats. Looks to me like half of what I am feeding ends up on the bottom of the pond not to be eaten? Am I missing something?

I've been using it for about 2 years and it has always floated for me. I might see one sink every now and then.

Tim, a feed that has both sinking and floating is utilized by more fish in the long run.
There are some fish that shy away from the surface and these guys at Optimal are very good at what they do..Jr is one of the best feeds-bang for the buck you can use.
I'm going to say it looks to me like about a 10% sink rate (ballpark), shouldn't be 50% sink. I'm starting year 4 and I've not had anything more than "maybe" 10% sink.
Optimal BG on the other hand I'd guess to be maybe 15% sink rate.

I had one Optimal bag early last year where about 30-40% sank. It was a great way to start the year. In fact I wish all of them had a sink rate of 30-40%.

Absolutely. I even asked Bob Lusk to check if Purina would make a 50% sinking BG feed, so that more would get to fish and less to Canada geese. Apparently they rejected the idea, but maybe Optimal folks would be open to it.

I personally am not a big fan of floating feeds....but understand the necessity of it for managing feeding rates in ponds. The goal is to get the junior to mostly float. I've noticed that the type of wheat i use (and when its harvested) has a pretty major impact on how well the feed expands and floats. As i make larger batch sizes, it should minimize that variability and be more consistent. Making feeds is more like pottery than running a microwave, so consistency between small batches can be tricky both for incoming ingredients and final pellets.

The goal is to target ~15% sinking for the standard junior line. I get a pretty mixed response for what people prefer. I have made some 100% sinkers for some big customers with bird problems so if the demand is there i know we can do it!

As always if there are any concerns or feed issues, so not hesitate to reach out!

Dustin

I'm still using up the last of what I got last year and I'm one of the people that got the wrong stuff that was the special Junior that was all round. If any of it is sinking, I don't see it. But the more I think about it the more I think I remember a little bit of it sinking, but not much.

Hey, Dustin, this is Frank James. I just got 8 sacks of Optimal BG food, but am reluctant to use it until geese leave pond. Free food gives them incentive to stay, I dread the day when they don't leave at all.

Some floating makes sense to track how fish are feeding & for the very real pleasure of watching them bust the surface! Do you think there could be a market for, say, 60% sinking/ 40% floating? Birds get much less, but still have advantages of some floating.

Bottle rockets. dogs that will swim after them and other loud noises are great deterrents.

Good suggestions. My problem is that I'm usually not on site.

I'd love it if this forum could put enough interest out there to make it worth it for Optimal to run a batch of sinking feed. Much healthier for the fish and I believe I have a way to extend feeding hours with it.

I'd join in especially if 60 70 percent sinking

My fish have been fed Optimal since they were stocked. #3 Starter, then Jr, now a mix of Jr and BG.
From what I've been able to observe in my pond, the RES and YP seem to prefer sinking pellets to floating pellets,
especially when it's bright and sunny outside. I would definitely buy a BG or Jr formula that had a high percentage of sinking pellets.

Or, they could supply bags of 100% sinking and we could mix what we wanted. I do not recall seeing any of my BG Jr sinking in past years, nor my current BG feed. Maybe I don't pay attention like I should. It might explain why my fish feed for so long...they may be wanting for it to sink...IDK.

That's good idea, too.

Stakes all around the pond, clear mono on the stakes at 6" and again at 12" off the ground. Geese are grazers, and will land on the water, swim to shore to get out and start grazing. Once they realize that they can't get out of the pond they will leave.

I prefer the floating. I adjust the feeder to throw about 1/2 hr after sunrise and 45 min before sunset to right at sunset. No problem getting YP to feed on the floating pellets.

I'm guessing to get Optimal to make sinking feed in a big enough quantity to make it profitable for them, and not too expensive for us would be to get together and do a group buy of 5 tons or maybe more. They will make anything a person or group of people want, but everyone has to remember that machine set up/tear down/clean costs the same for 20 bags or for 5 tons of feed. So, I'm guessing the feed would have to be priced accordingly.

Looking at if from a business owner side of things. I sure wouldn't go make a 5 ton run of fish food if only 20 people wanted to buy 5 bags of food each this year. AND I've been on the business end of "I'll buy more later" and the orders have never showed up.

What esshup said. I wish it could be done but not sure it's realistic. I'd be in for 100-150lbs. That's less than 1% of whats needed.

Wonder if it would be possible for PB folks to piggyback on a large commercial order of sinking feed? You know, maybe an additional ton or half a ton. I could take 400 to 500 pounds, no problem. Darn birds!

The more I think about it I think I could get up to 300 lbs ordered.

I like Optimal. They (Dustin) back their product. Not so with other feeds that I’ve used for the last 30 to 40 years.

I'm on pace to use 320lbs this year. I'd be in for six bags if this happens.

OK dumb question - I have no catfish - only bluegill large and small - so on the feed that sinks that is not eaten as it sinks can the BG still eat it? Seems like once it hits the bottom with the muck and weeds they could not ingest it. I am just trying not to waste this expensive (but good) feed Thanks

I did get a new bag of Jr today and did see a little sinking but it looked like my BG was getting the sinkers as well.
I also think my fish like the regular Jr better than the special Jr that was sent by mistake.

I can't absolutely prove this, but judging from their weight my RES manage to pick up food pellets that make it to the bottom. Most of the pellets don't make all the way down, however.

I can't absolutely prove it either, but I'm nearly certain redear would get pellets that have settled to the bottom.

I feed in about 3-4’ of water in a small feeding ring. I have observed the BG and HSB have no issue removing pellets off the bottom of a pond and will even pick them out of FA. The BG generally spit pellets until they hydrate unless they are very large fish who seem to have no issue crushing and consuming a dry pellet. I personally like a sinking feed as it allows the fish to self feed for several hours. Once they are full they will repeatedly return to the feeding area and top themselves off until all the feed is consumed off the bottom. Floating feed and wind creates more waste but sometimes helps since it ends up in the shallows where smaller fish tend to have a chance at it.

With a sinking feed I would think feeding at shallower depths will help prevent any waste by giving the fish more opportunities to graze off the bottom if they missed any pellets the first round. My pond has good visibility and these observations were made with me in the water. I feed Aquamax 500

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Great pic, Guy!

Has there been a discussion about the best substrate to facilitate the fish plucking up the pellets that have settled to the bottom of the pond?

I was thinking of an old tractor tire placed horizontally and filled with packed sand. That would get the food landing zone a little off the bottom of the pond, and hopefully reduce the amount of silt mixed in with the pellets.

The fish would get a little sand in their mouths, but they should be able to spit that out?

Surely there are better options than a soft, silty bottom where the pellets sink in and decompose. Or a gravel bottom where the pellets can get into the interstitial spaces where the fish cannot pick them out.

Catfish if you have them shouldn't have any issues clearing the bottom if they are hungry at least. Young channels seems really adept at feeding on the bottom.

ThatOneGuy - Thanks for adding those good informative pictures. Educational input!