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Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
#529878 01/21/21 07:47 AM
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Hey Ya'll

We are all nature lovers right?

Asclepias incarnata (Swamp Milkweed), and other milkweeds

Is absolutely vital to the life cycle of the Monarch butterfly.

Some studies are showing these butterflies are at about 1% of the population it had in the 80s due to loss of habitat.

These flowers are pretty, grow in wet environments, and other types of milkweed grow in dry ground.

https://www.kqed.org/science/197179...rnia-but-they-still-dont-have-protection
If I sent yall some seed packets, would you plant em?

Last edited by CityDad; 01/21/21 07:48 AM.

Im going to ask a lot of questions, but only because I'm clueless
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Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529882 01/21/21 08:10 AM
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My wife and I continue to plant swamp milkweed near our ponds and wetlands. It has formed nice colonies in some places and does have an attractive flower. I have observed more monarch caterpillars on the swamp milkweed plants compared with the other perennial milkweed species on our place. Our non-hardy tropical milkweed also seems to be very attractive to monarchs and makes a good flower-garden plant. We continue to spread swamp milkweed around. I also found that clay-adapted butterfly weed does very well on our soil (also a milkweed). We probably have about 10,000 milkweed plants on our place (mostly common milkweed), but we need them to be planted all along the migration route, so please help from south to north! https://www.prairienursery.com/butterflyweed-for-clay-asclepias-tuberosa-var-clay.html

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Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529883 01/21/21 08:11 AM
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Let me see what some of the gurus say about the plant. If it not an invasive species around here I would be more than happy to plant some.


The people who say I can't do it can just sit the @^#% down and watch me. Friends call me Rusto I also subscribe to pond boss mag. http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=504716#Post504716
Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529884 01/21/21 08:13 AM
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Note that a non-migrating population of Monarchs are present in Florida. https://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/uw311

Last edited by RAH; 01/21/21 08:14 AM. Reason: better citation
Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
RStringer #529885 01/21/21 08:22 AM
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Stringer- it is NOT invasive, it's Native 100%.
Even if you dont get monarchs right away you WILL get other butterflies/moths/pollinators.

RAH- That is awesome. I have big plans for milkweed at the new lake smile Passionflower is also great, and super easy to propogate. I've got 8 that I've harvested into pots ready for planting at the new place frpom the 1 i purchased last spring.


Im going to ask a lot of questions, but only because I'm clueless
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Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529886 01/21/21 08:25 AM
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CityDad - While you clearly do not live in the Midwest, you might enjoy this group even though it is small and has few recent posts: https://www.facebook.com/groups/442011656723370/ Would love for you to post pics there as you progress.

Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529888 01/21/21 08:32 AM
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Found a pic of swamp milkweed near our pond. A little blurry though:
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529889 01/21/21 08:40 AM
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You can buy the seed from https://www.cardnonativeplantnursery.com/ and maybe plugs if the time of the year is right.

Price sheet:https://www.cardnonativeplantnursery.com/current-inventory-pricing

Look on the first page of the price sheet (you will have to open the PDF). Look for any plant starting with the name Asclepias but if looking for only Swamp Milkweed, look for Asclepias incarnata

There may be other native seed nurseries around but this is the one that I use because it's the closest to me.


www.hoosierpondpros.com


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3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).
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Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529897 01/21/21 10:21 AM
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City dad are you harvesting seed from your property or purchasing it? If you are harvesting it I would take you up on the seed offer. I have some places that it would do well.

Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
cb100 #529899 01/21/21 10:38 AM
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Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
cb100 #529906 01/21/21 02:10 PM
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CB I am willing to buy you your first seed kit. The only extras I currently have in my garden are some passionflower vines that I have plans for already. Butterflies came through and mowed down all my stuff before they could seed this year. Good problem to have imo!

RAH-
https://calscape.org/loc-California/Milkweed

California has 19 types of milkweed to choose from if you want California only! I doubt a native plant group would look at you sideways for planting incarnata in a wet area in Cali.


Im going to ask a lot of questions, but only because I'm clueless
Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529908 01/21/21 03:02 PM
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I am not a purist, but simply wanted to suggest that it is not native to CA so other species might be more appropriate there.

Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529914 01/21/21 09:23 PM
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I have several different milkweed varieties growing right now. I don't know wether it will flourish in California. I imagine it would do well but I don't know about planting it if it is considered invasive.

Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
cb100 #529922 01/22/21 06:46 AM
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I have not seen anywhere that it is considered invasive. You might look up seed suppliers and see if they restrict shipment to CA. My quick search did not seem to indicate any shipping restrictions.

Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529925 01/22/21 08:39 AM
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I do hope there remains a future for Monarch Butterflies. I remember only 25 years ago what I perceived to be clouds of them making their migration south along I-44 in OK. The highway was littered with butterflies. I remember wondering if the highway served a behavior that put them at greater risk. The interstate ran northeast to southwest and this may have been the direction their inner compass was telling them to fly.

Their is much risk of losing the Monarchs and I do hope efforts like this are able to save them.

Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529928 01/22/21 09:49 AM
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The biggest threat the highways pose is destroying their habitat, and then alongside palm trees are planted instead of milkweed frown


Im going to ask a lot of questions, but only because I'm clueless
Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529930 01/22/21 11:00 AM
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#1 Daughter bought four potted marsh milkweeds at a native plant sale in the spring of '19.

We planted those around the pond bank, and so far they seem to be doing well.
They look just like the variety in the pic posted by RAH.

We have protected the common dry land milkweed on our property to the extent that it's practical,
and it is becoming more prevalent every year. We like to keep the horse pastures mowed to keep
the weeds down, but the patches of milkweed are left alone until they die back in the fall. It also
saves me from having to run the weed whacker on the road bank at the end of our driveway. The
neighbors probably think I'm lazy, but I'm really just feeding the monarchs.

Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529931 01/22/21 11:14 AM
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I, too, mow around any of the milkweed-like plants on my property. It seems to be improving the populations. Not quite as fast as I'd like, but I get a few more every year. I leave my flower patches that have been mowed around until late winter/early early spring before mowing them down. I am betting the seeds do better on the dead plant through the winter than mowed down and left to settle into the grasses for the mice and bugs...I don't really know, but it's what I do.


Fish on!,
Noel
Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529933 01/22/21 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by CityDad
The biggest threat the highways pose is destroying their habitat, and then alongside palm trees are planted instead of milkweed frown

The loss of 99% of the population is an alarming statistic CityDad. I have my doubts that habitat is the sole cause of this but am also confident that automobiles are not a significant factor either. To me, Monarchs are like a canary in the coal mine and are warning of more of what we are likely to see. The loss of song birds are similarly alarming (though there seems to be an abundance of water turkey frown ). Let's hope we figure this out before its too late. Habitat improvement is a good step in the right direction but I do think factors we do not yet understand are also at play.

Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
jpsdad #529935 01/22/21 12:08 PM
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Where did see that the monarch butterfly population is down 99%? Is this just for the western population? As a point of interest, we had 4 monarch pupate on our porch but only 2 emerged. The other 2 seemed to be diseased.

Last edited by RAH; 01/22/21 12:30 PM. Reason: addition
Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529936 01/22/21 12:31 PM
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CityDad remarked about it in the original post (relative to the 80s). I accepted the number without challenging it. To be sure, I don't often see Monarchs nowadays in the big city. Its always a treat when we do.

Rod, if your observations reflect a pathogen that the population had not been exposed in the past, it wouldn't be first time this has happened. Other examples that resulting in great losses are the American elm and the American chestnut.

Last edited by jpsdad; 01/22/21 12:40 PM.
Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529937 01/22/21 12:52 PM
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Disease as well as climate change have been suggested, but milkweed got a big boost due to the introduction of widespread farming by European settlers, but this was reversed by improvements in weed control. I think that we only had reliable counts on Monarchs since the 1990s, but I also have witnessed the decline, and more recently an increase which I attribute to increased plantings of milkweed. Time will tell, but we are doing what we can on our place. It is really no hardship to add milkweed to our habitat improvement activities, along with other flowering plants. We saw quite a few giant swallowtails this year which was nice, but I am not sure where they were finding their larval host plants.

Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529939 01/22/21 01:17 PM
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Rod,

I am probably wrong but one very important habitat could be their overwintering refuge in Mexico. Global warming could effect overwintering survival there. One line thought is that they may age faster in a milder climate over the winter with fewer surviving to reproduce the subsequent spring.

In northern OK, one of the factors greatly affecting prairie spaces is the proliferation of blackjack oaks. In the past, trees were primarily concentrated along creeks. Fire suppression has allowed the blackjacks to take over. Even so, there is a lot of milk weed still around and again I don't think this loss of habitat is solely responsible. Even so, tens of thousands of acres of prime upland milkweed habitat have been lost there do to this influence. But probably most of that habitat was lost before 1980. Nowadays ranchers burn annually to keep trees at bay. Few are using herbicides there except for maybe hay meadows. Milkweed is especially abundant on heavily grazed land.

Last edited by jpsdad; 01/22/21 01:18 PM.
Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
jpsdad #529940 01/22/21 01:36 PM
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Illegal logging of overwintering sites in Mexico is well recognized as a significant factor in Monarch butterfly decline. The even larger decline of the western population of monarchs seems to argue against any factor specific to the Midwest. Planting more milkweed seems to be helping, but we simply do not understand why this is happening or how it compares with historic fluctuations over long time intervals.

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Re: Could I convince you guys to plant Swamp Milkweed?
CityDad #529942 01/22/21 04:22 PM
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I would be more then happy to plant some of the swamp milkweed, not sure what it is but if its advantageous Id be glad to do it, and it looks beautiful.
Another issue we have in this area is a decline in honeybee numbers, we don't have near as many as we used to. and talking to bee keepers it is getting harder and harder to maintain healthy hives. but I think a lot of it has to do with some of the potent pesticides that are being used these days. makes one wonder if any of that has anything to do with the decline of Monarchs.


All the really good ideas I've ever had came to me while I was milking a cow.
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