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Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #514555 12/02/19 10:07 PM
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LOL!!! Thanks Dr. Perca. It sure helps to have the Dean of Students keep me from double secret probation because professor Hudson was about to fail me!
JK.
Thank you both for your help!
Heppy

Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #514566 12/03/19 09:58 AM
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Let us know your crayfish trapping results. Some more southern crayfish may still be "somewhat" active and invited into traps with some good tasty food items.


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Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #514721 12/07/19 06:29 PM
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The small fish in the stream that I thought were bluntnose minnows are actually the eastern blacknose dace. There are creek chubs in the stream as well. 80-100 gpm is coming through the 10” outlet of the big pond from the 3 sources of water that feed it. I need to check the flow amount in the next drought.

TJ, I have been thinking about the HBCP vs BCP and considering stocking the HBCP. Fall 2020 the 50-75 SMB and 20-25 WE (ladder stocked each fall) will be going into the pond. When and what numbers should I stock of the HBCP and HSB according to your plan if I’m able to locate the HBCP?
I’m unable to get to the farm until Monday at the earliest to put out crayfish traps but will report results when I return.

Thanks,
Heppy

Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #514924 12/14/19 11:23 PM
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Bill Cody email sent with minnows and local crayfish that feed the main pond. I’m not sure how to post iPhone pics to here. Repost pics if you would like to educate others.
Thanks!
Heppy

Last edited by Heppy; 12/15/19 07:39 AM.
Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #515265 12/25/19 12:48 PM
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Quick question?
As you know I have already stocked 25 8+” and 400 4-6” feed trained YP. Recently, I learned of a public body of water where 16-18” YP that are not feed trained are caught regularly over the next month or two. I have the capability to transport any caught fish and am wondering if it would be a good idea to put these genetically larger fish that are NOT feed trained in my 2.7 acre pond assuming I can catch them? Thoughts?
Thanks for the help!
Heppy

Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #515267 12/25/19 04:09 PM
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Please post pictures of 16"+ YP next to a ruler. I've only seen one or 2.

Lusk stocked large LMB and they actually lost weight in the pond. Don't know if YP will do the same.


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3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).
Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #515268 12/25/19 04:44 PM
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Yes Heppy, if you do catch some perch that big, please post all kinds of fotos.
If I caught any that size, I'd be eating them, not stocking my pond with them. Ha! I'd consider pond stocking of some 14" or so. Remember, it's mostly great feeding opportunities throughout the entire lifetime of a fish that is mostly responsible for it reaching its maximum potential. Sure, genetics play a part, but those good genetics likely exist in many of the YP from that BOW.
An example is Cascade reservoir in Idaho. 2+ pound perch have been caught there. Some age classes in that lake have perfect feeding their entire lives. Other fish born in other years aren't as fortunate.
Regardless, good luck fishing for those jumbos.

Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #515273 12/25/19 10:45 PM
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Here is a picture of the VA state record set in 2010 but not from the same reservoir. This fish is 16.5 inches. The only reason I believe the possibility of 16-18” YP is because my son has seen the pictures caught by the professional fisherman who is a friend of his who has been fishing on the lake his entire life. Guess I will find out soon enough and report back with my findings.


https://www.flickr.com/photos/vdgif/4463219900

Thanks,
Heppy

Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #515762 01/15/20 09:42 PM
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I have no more information to pass along on the YP as of now but did learn that some of the crayfish in the small stream that feeds the pond are Cambarus acuminatus common name Acuminate Crayfish via Bill Cody. These are a burrowing species but there’s not much that I can do about that. Hopefully the YP and SMB can enjoy them. I will update this thread as the additional crayfish and minnows are identified.
Heppy

Last edited by Bill Cody; 01/16/20 09:04 PM. Reason: word edit
Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #516144 01/27/20 02:18 AM
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I have a question that I have been unable to find the answer after a substantial time. Here goes. I have 140’ of 10” construction drain through the bottom of my dam. The 10” pipe has been reduced to an 8” UD slide gate valve. The problem I’m trying to solve is the size of the cage/guard that will go at the bottom of the pond around the UD slide gate valve that is constructed of cutting board like material and stainless steel springs. I understand when RAH stated that surface is your friend. Does anyone have suggestions on what size of cage and shape the openings should be to allow the passage of leaves and sediment to pass through the grate openings in order for the construction drain at the bottom of the pond to not clog with leafy debris? Any help is greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Heppy

Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #516145 01/27/20 06:03 AM
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Is this a pipe only used to drain the pond or is it the primary spillway?

Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #516151 01/27/20 10:52 AM
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RAH,
This is the primary spillway with a riser and trash rack that sets the water level at the surface in the pond. It has the drain valve in the bottom of the pond. This is a conventional pond piping system. Here is a picture http://www.ponddampiping.com/conventional.html
Thanks,
Heppy

Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #516153 01/27/20 11:27 AM
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My bottom drain tube has an elbow and extension going upward with lots of 1" holes drilled in it and a small slotted cap on the end. I have never used the drain so I cannot report on its performance. I will say that I worry about the valve failing some day. I actually have a bottom drain on my most recently built pond as well, but I needed some way to drain water while I was building it.

Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #516163 01/27/20 04:23 PM
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RAH,
My pond has the UD slide gate valve. It is made of plastic about the thickness of a cutting board functioning as the open/close feature. Other than that there are 6 or 8 stainless bolts/springs/nuts (no need to worry about rusting shut) to set the amount of pressure required to open/close the valve. My drain is 3-4 feet off the bottom of the pond with about a 10x10 sump area for collecting debris. I’m wanting to cage the area around the drain to allow leaves and such to pass through but not fish. Do you believe the 1” holes will suffice?
Thanks,
Heppy

Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #516347 02/02/20 02:11 AM
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I Think That I Finally Figured It Out!!!
This should be easy to replicate for anyone with a UD slide gate bottom drain in their pond. Now for the specifics. As previously mentioned I have a 10” conventional pond piping system with a bottom drain inside the pond. The 10” pipe drain is necked down to an 8” UD slide gate valve with a 10’ long 1 1/4” pvc handle to allow opening/closing of the drain. The plan for my trash rack is as follows.
Pond Drain Trash Guard
55 gallon PVC drum
Drill many 3/4”- 1” holes all around the drum.
Remove one 2” bung and leave the other intact. I may have to leave both intact and cut a new hole in the top of the drum if the location of the bung hole will not permit valve housing to fit. Either way not an issue.
Use a jigsaw cut from the bung or new hole (on top) 3/4 way down the side of the drum. Cut an 8.75” hole from the side of the drum centered with the cut you just made from the 2” hole. The final product will look like Swiss cheese with one 2” hole on the top of the barrel cut all the way to an 8.75” hole.
Slip the drum around the valve sideways and turn straight with the bung hole going around the 1 1/4” pipe and the 8.75” hole that you cut going around the 8” pvc pipe holding the valve. 2 or 3 zip ties may have to be used on the cut from the bung hole to the top of the 8.75” hole to secure the drum as a trash guard. Be sure to drill small holes on each side of the cut you made before attaching the trash guard if the zip ties are needed.

This should allow me to open the drain a couple times a year to get rid of sediment and decomposing organic debris that enters the pond without fear of having fish larger than 1” being washed out. I have given lots of thought to this and would appreciate all helpful feedback good or bad. Hopefully this can extend the life of a pond where buildup becomes a nonissue.

Thanks!
Heppy

Edit: A picture of the U.D. Slide Gate is here.
http://www.ponddampiping.com/accessories.html
Edit: 8” sch 40 pvc has an od of 8.625” therefore the cut has to be larger than 8”. I decided on 8.75” for a little slop going around the outside of the 8” pipe

Last edited by Heppy; 02/03/20 09:14 AM.
Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #516370 02/02/20 11:55 PM
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Good idea. The holes will let 1" tall or smaller fish through, but if there isn't much O2 at the bottom of the pond there won't be many fish there either.


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3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).
Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #516374 02/03/20 12:27 AM
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Thanks esshup!
This is a flow through pond and I’m uncertain of the amount of O2 at the bottom of the pond but you give me further confidence that this will work!
Thanks!
Heppy

Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #516397 02/03/20 08:41 PM
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I finished the PVC 55 gallon trash rack today. Ended up with 7/8” holes instead of 1” simply because it was so quick using the step drill bit to push all the way through and pull out. The drum had to be cut with the jigsaw all the way across the top, completely down one side and all the way across the bottom in order to be able to spread the trash guard around the valve and 1 1/4” open/close vertical pipe. It will be secured with (about 10-12) heavy duty zip ties after installation once the water warms. I didn’t use the bung holes on top of the barrel because it didn’t look wide enough for the valve that close to the side of the barrel. Instead, I used the jigsaw to cut the 2” hole closer towards the center of the drum and the lower 8 3/4” hole a couple of inches off the bottom on one side.
Heppy

Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #517950 03/13/20 10:36 PM
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Ordered 2 bags of Optimal junior to get the Texas Hunter feeder fired up shortly for the feed trained YP. The fixed pond dock was completed a couple weeks ago. The decking that I decided on was Sure Step decking in the tan color with rope railings going out the walkway and black piling caps. I really wish I could add pics with my iPhone to this new format. I hope to be adding 200 more feed trained YP in the next 1-2 weeks for some fishing (catch and release) over the summer. I’ve talked to a contractor about building a 20x32 foot pavilion/storage(8x20) combo dockside just waiting to hear back on the price. Attached is a link similar to the pavilion/storage to give you an idea

https://sullivanconstructiononline.com/featured-projects/outdoor-patio-with-storage-shed/

Heppy

Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #519214 04/11/20 01:03 AM
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Stocked 200+ 8” plus YP and 400-500 2” YP this evening in the 2.7 acre pond. I have not seen any YP ribbons this spring (absentee pond owner) and wanted to make sure that there were some yoy this season. These fish were not feed trained but I’m hoping some will learn from the 425 pellet fed YP that were stocked last fall. The TH feeder is set to throw Optimal junior at 7am and 8pm for 1 second each until I get the opportunity to observe how they are feeding(next weekend). Bill Cody has provided EXPERT help and so much more in getting my Spotfin/Satfin shiner spawning devices(sd) assembled. Under Bill’s guidance I have assembled the (sd) with varying widths in the crevice size to determine which size is best for the shiners in my area. Once the water temperature hits 68 degrees they will be deployed to collect the eggs to transfer to both ponds to ensure a sustainable population. I will also attempt trapping the adult shiners in the same waters that the (sd) are set. Stay safe out there! Happy Good Friday!

Thank you Bill Cody!
Heppy

Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
Heppy #519222 04/11/20 09:52 AM
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Heppy, if you have 425 existing perch stocked last fall then I would have to believe they would be able to produce egg ribbons. The 200 large size (8") perch have to be more than 50% female and should drop eggs too. If your water temps are warm enough then you should find egg ribbons. Perhaps they are in a little deeper water although by us they choose the deeper water first and then later we see them in all depths, even barely covered depth.

Please share your experience with SFS spawning devices. Bill has been a great help to me as well. I found that the stack of CDs worked the best for me, but my CD structure has broken down considerably. I want to experiement with different structure and crevice size as well. I'm thinking of taking some natural sections of stumps or fallen decaying logs from our woods and use a circular saw or angle grinder and put in some crevices, some deeper, some more shallow, some arranged parallel to the pond bottom, some perpindicular (vertical) crevices and see what they like best.

My Spotfins are amazing. They pellet feed all through the cold water months from ice in to ice out. They seem to be reproducing fairly well, we'll see about this year as there are more hungry mouths to feed and hoping to see more young YP this year.

Also let me know what kind of traps they seem to enter most easily as I have to build some trap devices too.

Re: Thoughts on a new 3 acre pond stocking
canyoncreek #519244 04/11/20 07:41 PM
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Canyoncreek,
I guess that I should have mentioned that the 200 adult YP were spawned out as of 3/20 according to the seller. These adult YP were added for the kids to fish summer 2020. The pond banks are not completely covered yet in my big pond and it will get some suspended clay for 4 or 5 days after a hard rain before it starts getting that green tint again. It is a flow through pond from headwater springs. I thought I read on here that suspended clays can affect the hatch/survival rate of the YP ribbons was the reason that I went ahead and stocked the 400-500 yoy as well. Does anyone have a definitive answer on suspended clays in their experience? I will be sharing the results of the experiment that I have with the spawning devices here and hope that you will do the same. Where did you acquire your first SFS if you don’t mind sharing? I’m trying to decide between purchasing a Z trap or a cloverleaf trap myself. Does anyone have suggestions on the type of trap that produces the best results in their experience?
Thanks!
Heppy

Re: Thoughts on a new 2.7 acre pond stocking
Heppy #519249 04/11/20 09:19 PM
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Quote
I thought I read on here that suspended clays can affect the hatch/survival rate of the YP ribbons was the reason that I went ahead and stocked the 400-500 yoy as well. Does anyone have a definitive answer on suspended clays in their experience?


Suspended silt and clays particulates affect the fishery in two direct ways, plus probably also in other secondary and tertiary ways.
1. Depending on the amount or concentration of silt-clay it interferes with the movement of dissolved oxygen through the gills into the blood stream. Developing fish eggs need high amounts of dissolved oxygen passing through the outer egg membrane for the embryo to continue development especially when the embryo is very close to hatching and more oxygen is required. Sedimentations of silt/clay onto eggs will collect around the egg and suffocate them. High silt concentrations also probably contain more fungus spores which grow on or among eggs to kill them. Proper oxygen absorption for health and swimming strength is very important for new delicate fish fry that have to continually search for tiny foods in the water column. This is definitely more problematic for delicate fish fry compared to older fish which have more body mass as 1.5"+ individuals. The larger a fish the longer it can survive without eating. In searching for food, these tiny fry (1/4"-1/3") in high silt conditions have to encounter and deal with silt-clay particles and then selectively distinguish them from food particles.

2. Suspended silt/clay reduces the amount of sunlight that penetrates the water column. Sunlight is necessary for both the suspended phytoplankton and attached micro-algae (periphyton) communities to grow. They will not grow a lot deeper than the depth of light penetration. So shallow sunlight penetration of 6" to 12" forces fish fry to forage and grow in areas around a 1 to 3 feet below the surface; again depending on the concentration of silt/clay. Plus these fry sized foods can be very limited because the silt-clay is taking up the space in the water column and interfering with plankton rather the water column being primarily food particles comprised of algae or zooplankton. The part of the pond below light penetration is essentially a food desert for fish fry. With high concentrations of silt-clay, the food base in the pond is significantly reduced or restricted.

Micro-algae feed the zooplankton as the next first level of the animal foods in the pond or food chain. Lack of food production has a direct affect in how many fish fry will survive since they first require some micro-algae and very soon tiny zooplankton for survival and growth. Late stage fry eat larger zooplankton. New fish fry basically have NO food reserves in terms of body deposits, so they need to eat almost continually to survive and grow. Without eating almost continually they die. So the more silt-clay is present the less usable fry food is present per unit volume of water. Often many fish fry starve in the first few days or weeks when not enough of the correct foods are present at the right time when it is needed.

Last edited by Bill Cody; 04/12/20 10:59 AM.

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Re: Thoughts on a new 2.7 acre pond stocking
Bill Cody #519261 04/12/20 08:12 AM
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Thank you for the detailed explanation Bill Cody! I’m more confident that I stocked the 400-500 2 to 2 1/2 inch yoy after reading your in-depth information!

Happy Easter! He is risen!

Heppy

Last edited by Heppy; 04/15/20 12:19 AM.
Re: Thoughts on a new 2.7 acre pond stocking
Heppy #519563 04/19/20 07:22 AM
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Heppy,

If you do not mind sharing, where did you source your spotfin shiners?


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