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#51075 01/10/05 01:50 AM
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I was just curious if it is possible to have more than 2 or 3 species of fish in a 3-5 acre pond. Im sure its possible what i really want to know is how difficult would it be to start off and maintain I really like bass, bluegill, perch, walley and bullheads Ive heard several times about why one or the other wont be good in small ponds and I know it would probably be difficult but can all these fish be compatible together? They dont need to be there in large numbers just there for the occasional suprise I also like crappie. So many fish so hard to choose. If possible I would like perch or crappie to be the focus of the pond if i could get a little direction it would be great

#51076 01/10/05 09:34 AM
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You are truely new to this sight. Do some reading on the different posts on this sight, because there have been several GOOD discusions on this sight about these topics!!!

#51077 01/10/05 11:24 AM
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Good morning, Pondenvy. Big Pond is certainly right -- we have many disucssions along these lines on this forum.

I've been on this web site for a couple of years now, and the biggest lesson I have learned is just how much interest there is in diversity of pond fishes!

When I started here, I sort of preached the same thing that you hear from most fishery professionals and most university extension programs. In the past, we really tried to keep things simple. Thus, many, many recommendations were as simple as the largemouth bass-bluegill combination. The bass is the predator, and the multiple-spawning bluegill is both a good prey species as well as a good food fish. It works well, and it's pretty safe under most conditions.

However, I do believe you can have a more diverse pond fish community. I'm not sure where you are in Iowa. However, if you have a 5-acre pond with a 20% rim of submergent aquatic plants during midsummer, and water transparency is at least 15-18 inches for a good part of the year, then something like the following may work. I'd suggest you establish the largemouth bass as your primary predator. Keep them in the crowded state that is so commonly discussed in so many threads here on the Pond Boss forum. Crowded largemouth bass can keep both bluegills and yellow perch in check in your pond. Also, crowded bass will create a low density black bullhead population (they'll really thin the schools of small bullheads after spawning each year), but you'll catch some 12 inch and longer bullheads. Expect to see an honest 2 pounder. Everyone in the North Country wants walleyes. In fact, I just wrote an article on use of walleyes in ponds in the January/February 2005 issue of Pond Boss magazine. Without repeating all of that information here, let me say that you'd be better off to have a secondary or low-abundance population of walleyes to sort of be a bonus fish in your pond. That may fulfill your wishes.

When it comes to diversity, there is another side of the coin. Because much of this is relatively new and outside the scope of traditional (simple) management recommendations, there are differences of opinion. For example, one of the best pondmeisters on this forum is NOT a fan of yellow perch in ponds, especially in very small ponds. His caution comes from practical, personal experience.

I suspect some of the reason for these different opinions is due to a simple fact: what works in one place under one set of pond conditions will not necessarily work in other places or under different pond conditions. Ponds can be big or small, clear or muddy, deep or shallow, have submergent aquatic plants or not, be warm or cold, thermally stratify or not, etc., etc. So, experimenting with diversity is a little dangerous. What I've found, however, is that a pretty good number of folks here are willing to take a few risks, realizing that it might require some "fixing" in the future. :-) You can get lots of input on your thoughts by interacting with folks here before you take the plunge.

Dave


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#51078 01/10/05 11:32 AM
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Welcome to the forum, pondenvy.

Where in Iowa are you? Can you describe your lake a bit more such as how old it is, how deep it is, is it currently stocked or not, etc. Do you plan to feed your fish or not?

Then can you describe your goals a bit more. Do you plan to fish this lake heavily or not? Although it is seldom mentioned in this forum, in my opion, this is one of the most important questions in dealing with our lakes. Do you want to grow fish quickly to eat or do you want to have high catch rates? Then, can you tell us why you want each species? What do you think each species will add to your fishing pleasure?

Next, buy the book "Iowa Fish and Fishing" from the IDNR. It is outstanding!

You're right, LMB and BG will be the basis of your fishery. I think that almost everyone here would suggest channel catfish rather than bullheads. Bullheads can be very hard to control. Redear sunfish have a good chance of surviving anywhere in Iowa but expecially in the southern half. They would add a great deal to your lake.

We have both walleye and yellow perch in our 4-acre lake that was started in 2000. The yellow perch have been essentially eliminate by predation by bass and catfish. That long slender shape goes down too easily. The walleye have a hard time competing for prey until they get to about 14". That means that all of my walleye restocking must be fish 14" or longer. It's worth it to me but it might not be to you. However, when stocking all little fish, it is no problem.

As to crappie, we have both black and white crappie although most people would suggest you use only black crappie. We have such heavy predation in our lake that we have NO crappie reproduction. The Missouri DNR has some excellent articles about raising crappie in small lakes. The secret is to have heavy predation but to allow some reproduction.

One idea that you will see here more is that of stocking, growing and harvesting fish. You will read about it most with Hybrid Striped Bass. Non-reproducing species are much, much easier to manage than are reproducing species. This opens so many more opportunities.

I hope some of these ideas help in your thinking.


Norm Kopecky
#51079 01/10/05 12:17 PM
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My personal opinion is that you can have any fish you want in your pond, on the condition that you know what to expect from each one and the community as a whole. Once you understand your goals these fine folks will gladly help you find the best combination of fish to meet them.

Understanding the biology and life history of fish is the second step to selecting fish for your pond.
Here is an example, yellow perch are early spawners who lay huge masses of eggs. But YP year classes compete and a strong yr class will suppress the number and growth of the next 3 or 4 yr classes. So if you put YP in your pond, and they reproduce well, you will have a cyclical population. Every 5 or 6 years you will have really good YP fishing, the rest of the time most of the fish will be too small. You will always have some keeper fish, but most of the time the dominate year class will be smaller fish.

If the right managment techniques, proper care and money, and a sane stocking program are instituted from the beggining you can have great fishing.

One thing I consiedered with my family's pond is "what can I not get from other local lakes?" Do you want to catch 24" walleye every time you go fishing? or is thier already a lake you can do that on? Is it easier to find 8" BG or 4lb bass near your house?
The reason I point this out is that it ussaly isn't hard to find bullheads, but if you really want them...

#51080 01/10/05 10:03 PM
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The more different species of fish you add to a pond, the more difficult it becomes to maintain consistant original stocked numbers for ALL the species over the long term. Usually what happens is one, two or three species succeed well, sometimes too well, and the others dwindle away over the years if their numbers are not constantly supplimented.


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#51081 01/12/05 04:48 AM
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thanks to everyone for the great replys. Im not exactly sure about the depth of the pond. Its out on an acrege I went hunting on a few years ago. One my friends at work spends alot of time there because him and the owner are friends. We brought it up the other day. He only has bluegill and LMB I asked him if he had ever considered other fish, but he was a little uneasy when it came to the topic because he lost most of his fish a few years ago and i dont think he wanted to deal with it to much until he figures out if his improvements help fish survival for a few years. He wants nothing to do with the bullheads that was me they harass me for that all the time and i wanted to be able to snap back with something educated. Thanks alot to all of you who replied

#51082 01/12/05 09:28 AM
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It seems like two fairly safe additions would be redear sunfish and channel catfish.


Norm Kopecky

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