Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations Trespasser Problems & Stories

Thought it'd be interesting to discuss problems with trespassers and possible solutions. My buddy purchased a 3 and 1/2 acre pond about two years ago. He has no house on the property and thus can not always be there to watch it. There is a farm house within 200 yards of the pond, and you would think that most people driving by would assume the farm owns the pond and thus stay out.

However, last year there were several instances of trespassing, which involved litter, loud drunk campers at night, and so on. This year we know of at least three instances in which somebody was on the pond. None of these people have been caught yet, and the farmer next door refused to investigate possible trespassers for safety reasons, since this usualy occurs at night.

Anyway, we hung a locked chain across the gravel driveway going back to the pond a few weeks ago, complete with a no trespassing sign. The only possible way to get around this is by driving threw the neighbors yard, and sure enough somebody trashed their property last week to drive back there.

Finaly, this past Sunday I was fishing the pond with the pond owner and his wife when a vehicle pulled all the way back to the pond. Three guys drinking beer started to get out, ignoring the pond owner's wife. She aproached them and asked if she could help them and the driver responded "Oh, we're just here to do a little fishing", not even asking but telling her their intentions. She told them it was private property and to leave, at which point the driver got angry and said "You mean we aren't allowed to fish here?", like it was his right to do so. She then pointed over to me on the other side of the pond and said "Do you see that guy over there, he'll put a bullet in your rear (cleaned up for your reading pleasure) if he catches you out here again.

Anyway, there are a few points I wanted to make with this story. First, I can't believe that people have the guts to fish a pond when the house right next to it is the possible owner, and second that I can't believe they are so brazen as to simply pull up and fish while we are standing there. I'm guessing that the trespassers are locals who know that the pond owner doesn't live in the area, and am searching for ways to eliminate the problem. This Friday starts labor day weekend, so I plan to hide me and my truck in the pole barn just before dark, in the hopes of catching more of these people. If somebody shows up I plan to keep hidden and call the sheriff on my cell phone, as I want to bust these people for trespassing before they can get away. I figure word spreads fast, and if you simply kick them out then everybody knows you will only do that. However, if they get a nice $200 ticket for breaking the law then others might be warned that we meen business. Other ideas and options welcome, and I've love to hear your stories.

How about setting up a couple of those motion detector cameras that are used for scouting? I saw them at Walmart for about 60.00 or so. Set it up so you can get the plate coming up the access road and also around the pond. Might be enough for the local police to act on.

Bob

You may want to call your law enforcement ahead of time to let them know what you plan on doing. If it was my law enforcement they probably would be off for the weekend! LOL

I once called in boating violation on a Friday evening to our Conservation Law Enforcement. (In our state you have to call the Sherriff's department first and they relay the information) Anyway, I was told there would not be an officer on duty until the following Monday. What a joke.

The gall of some people is incredible. I have a couple of tresspassing issues, one is my neighbour. (An alcoholic with a long list of criminal offences and Hell's Angels connections with a son serving jail time for B&E and assault right now). He figures he has full rights to come over and wander around my place and the property of my adjacent neighbour as well. (Other neighbour has caught him going through his barns twice and since he always has at least 2 big dogs and 5 or 6 big guys aound at all times, (He runs a gravel operation), I think the guy got the hint when he told him it was a bad idea to ever go there again.) But he has gone so far as to drive his truck right up on my lawn to go 'snooping'.

Other big problem is with people hunting on my property, which is funny since there are hundreds of acres of open land around me. They have been kind enough to repeatedly cut through my barb-wire fences. Of course I am never home when they do so.

I wonder if the 'visitors' to your pond are the same group of people all the time or are you dealing with a larger group of non-connected trespassers.

My advise is to contribute to the local sheriffs campaign. You may have to contribute to both candidates! I was invited to the victory party and brought up the tresspas problem at that time! I also let him know that I would be glad to contribute to the Indiana Sheriff Association whenever a violator is caught! One downside to this is a higher patrol rate around my section so rolling through a stopsign is not a good idea! Ha! These officers are not social workers so be ready to file tresspas charges! They are not interested in having a talk with violators!

Bob, The cheap motion detectors just don't work. I've been through several of them and now have a $350 one that works "OK". Essentially, these things ain't ready for prime time.

Since they all work off heat detection, they can't be used when the temp is over 90 degrees. The max distance advertised is 60 feet. I haven't gotten one to work over 40 ft. maximum. They take pictures of everything so you may run out of film long before you get the picture you want. They have a high rate of theft. Think about it. If I slip onto your property and see the damn thing, I am probably going to take the evidence with me. No matter how I conceal it, there is a flash and click.

That said, I am hooked and can't wait until October to start it going again on deer, coons, bobcats, coyotes, rabbits and of course, crows and neighbors dogs. It did confirm that 90% of wildlife movement is at night and that my neighbors dogs are all over my land during the day.

I do know one guy that got a picture of a neighbor stealing from his barn. Luckily, it was daytime and the thief didn't see the camera.

They can be checked out and compared at www.Jesseshuntingpages.com.

Dave

Look at the "poachers/tresspassers" thread dated Aug 2-02. Some good info there.

i'd be careful implying to anyone to put a bullet thru their head!! it's fun and macho to kid about, but there are some crazy blank folks out there, who have nothing to lose, and they will throw down a few beers and start shooting!! so, i'd bribe your law enforcement officials, get in good with them. make your presence known, firm and strong. but, avoid confrontation...all it will do is cause them to destroy your property, your yard, cut fences, and shoot your dog!! so, approach them carefully, politely, and let them know you mean business when you say they are not allowed on your property. unfortunately, laws stink as far as protecting your property; the bad guys seem to have more rights than we/the property owners have. i'd like to keep a big german shepard out on my property and scare off intruders ..but, my luck, it would put a tiny scratch on someone who crossed on to my property and they sue my butt off!! you try to figure that out!! i was lucky enough to catch a picture of a jeep and 2 guys faces on my wildlife camera...my surprise when i got my film developed!! i asked around, showed the picture to people in the area (which also implied "this guy means business"), someone left me a note in my mailbox telling me where the jeep was. i took a friend ( a big friend!!) with me to the guys house. i asked him to come outside, he was half stoned and drunk. But, i politely asked if he would not drive or enter onto my property because i shoot guns, hunt, and don't want to be liable for someone getting hurt. i also reminded him of my posted signs. i also showed him the picture!!!! he grinned, apologized, said he had seen the feeders and stuff, but didn't notice the posted signs until on his way out. we were all nice about it, no problems ever since. and i imagine he will spread "the word" to other "locals"!! i also kept the picture, because if something turns up missing, i'm gonna make that guy squirm until HE tracks down any body who does something to my property, or his face is on the picture!! also, another item...
i did put some 2x 4's with nails in them in some flower beds near my road i was working on just in case someone tried to drive into them...i was talking to my attorney friend who basically said probably not a great idea. so, instead, i made friends with allllll my neighbors, so they keep an eye out on my place. but they are all aware no one is allowed to fish or hunt on my property. i'm not mean or rude about it, i just say "for liability reasons" blah blah blah. i'm not sure of the exact point of it, but i think there was an old indian saying "it's better to have your enemies peeing inside your teepee than outside your teepee...at least you know where they are!!" i think that means know your enemies, and let them know you..not sure, better ask an indian!!

Well, the remark about putting a bullet in their rear was made by the pond owners wife, not me...although she implied by pointing that I'd be the one doing it. :') I don't mind the remark at all. Make'em think twice.

I'm fairly sure there are several trespassers, based on the neighbors seeing various vehicles at different times..none of which matched the car we had pull up on us Sunday. Again, I believe these are local folks who know the property and pond are not owned by the nearby farmhouse.

I don't agree with warning people and letting them walk away. If the word is that you simply kick them out then it won't solve the problem.

I have several homemade trail cameras I built which work great. One is built in a heavy steel box that would take a fire ax to remove from the tree. I've also installed a timer in it to activate only during day hours and have the flash turned off. I use this one in areas of potential theft and hang it roughly 16 feet up in a tree pointing down at an angle. This keeps it out of site, with no flash to draw attention, and would require a ladder and tools to reach and remove.

I've thought about using it over the access road in the hopes of getting a plate number. However, this opens up new problems. Every time the pond owner or I visited we'd have to turn the external switch off to avoid pictures of us, our cars, or the tractor while cutting grass. Being high in a tree where I'd put it, the switch would be hard to reach. Then again, maybe I could keep a long pole nearby to throw the toggle switch with. I'll consider it. Still, having it on only during the day to avoid flash use limits the potential of catching the night time activity.

Tonight is stakeout night. I'm hoping the holiday weekend brings out the rats. Would enjoy hearing more stories along the lines of trespassers.

I have been in too many fights because those of the female variety have popped off and things escalated too quickly. You are in a no win situation if you get into it with one of these guys. If you kick their butt they will sue and if they kick your butt they will sue and you could get hurt or even killed these days. Do not put yourself in the situation that you might lose the property because things escalated out of control. Call the law enforcement and the game warden before tonight if possible and find out phone#'s and how you can nail them as hard as you can because news does travel fast and you want to hit them legally so hard that no one else wants to deal with that kind of a problem. Game wardem may actually be the best possible help. A lot of these guys wont have license in addition to trespassing or poaching. You can face these guys once the police get there and it is a lot more effective and safe to do it that way. I would have a definite idea of what you are going to do or say from everyone(including females) before you confront.

Have the sheriff take care of the drunk trespassers.
And when does have him site them for not only trespassing but, public drunk and littering and destruction of private property.
The harder you are now on them now will make them think big time
the next time they want to trespass.

Be careful of anyone that says "Lets you and him fight".

So far we haven't been able to catch the trespassers. Now I've got new problems. About a week ago a new owner moved into the nearby farmhouse. He seemed polite the first time I talked to him, and explained that he was a BIG waterfowl hunter, expressing interest in being able to hunt ducks and geese off the pond.

I told him that I was doing that myself and that he would have to ask permission from the pond owner. I also indicated that he would more than likely require him to only hunt with me or a relative of the owner, as the pond owner only trusts us to escort visitors to fish or hunt. The pond owner has previously warned me that this new guy might start causing him problems, so I was sure to mention the above criteria.

Anyway, Monday opened up goose and mourning dove season in Ohio and a friend and I went out to hunt the field behind the pond. We had been shooting for several hours (doves are hard to hit) with no problem, and during this time the new home owner was out in his yard doing various chores.

With about a half hour left of hunting time I noticed him watching us from the back of his barn. I shot a dove that was flying in front of a line of pine trees. About five minutes later the guy comes FLYING down the access road in his ATV and skids to a stop right in front of me. "YOU SHOT MY BARN!", he yelled right off. I thought he was joking, as I was shooting a 16 gage using #8 low brass, had a line of pine trees behind the bird I was shooting at, and was a good 300 yards from that barn.

When I asked if he was sure, explaining the above variables, he became irate and said "This is the LAST time I'm going to warn you about safety", as if he'd warned me many times before. I tried to calm him down by saying that maybe he was right but falling shot isn't really dangerous, and promising to never "aim his way" ever again. This didn't seem to satisfy him.

He blazed off on his ATV (By the way, as long as we are talking "safety" he isn't winning points driving like that.) and I was left scratching my head as me and my friend wondered what that was all about. I've been rained down on many times before by shot but never from that kind of distance.

I called the pond owner on my cell phone to explain the situation and he said that he gets the idea this guy thought he'd have the whole place to himself. Then I realized, as I've seen this happen to other friends who lost permission to hunt land. He's trying to worm me out of there and worm himself in by making me look bad, unsafe, and god knows what else. Any suggestions on how to handle this situation? I know for darn sure that I won't shoot north anymore, as I don't want this guy to have any reason to complain.

Sounds like loads of fun, sure am glad Alabama has a written permission in hand law to hunt on private property.

Bob

Dave that was a good one, I agree. Critter I would just not shoot in his direction and tell the landowner the things you're going to do to not piss the guy off. Even if the landowner tells you don't worry about it make it very clear that you still are not going to do anything to irritate the guy because if he starts making trouble for the landowner at some point it is not worth letting you hunt.

Critter,
Buzz nailed it. My guess is that the landowner is going to be hearing alot of things you are doing that you aren't aware of. He will scrutinize everything you do & exagerate the smallest slip-up and explain to the landowner how he can better take care of things for him. Be prepared to defend your actions & possibly have to prove you didn't do whatever he dreams up. Good luck!
Ric

First, steer clear of his property line, but get back out shooting asap, don't let him think your intimidated by his actions. Second, there was a dove hunting article in Sunday's Dallas Morning News that stated the maximum carrying distance for dove loads (7.5/8 shot) is 250 yards. If you hit his barn with a 16 guage 8 shot, you had a BIG tail wind blowing !

Myself, my wife, and my brother and his wife are absentee owners of 75 acres of land w/ an 8-10 acre lake in Somerset, PA. We live about an hour away.

We've had numerous instances w/ trespassers who fished, hunted, drank, and/or littered, etc.

All these people by now know we live an hour away (we've had the place for 5 years). I've found the best way to bust people is to show up at very odd or unexpected hours for you to be there. The first year, I found out on a Sunday, that my canoe and trolling moter were stolen. I went to the property on a Tuesday afternoon around 2PM (after taking off from work). I went into the property a different way than I normally would. I parked several hundred yards away, and my dog and I walked to our pond.

Getting closer, I noticed that there were two kids fishing from our pier. My dog started going wild (as he felt by now that he owned the place), so I approached the kids as my dog charged full on ahead at them (Now I know that my dog won't bite 'em but just charge at 'em, and I know that me and the dog are at potential risk if these punks try some legal action). So my dog stops short and barks at 'em, and I walk over and just say "how's the fishing?" They say they just got out and haven't got anything. I'm pretty sure at this point that they don't know that I'm the owner. Then I just say "where's my f*ckin' canoe?" Both kids just fell silent. I told them I'd give $50 bucks to the person that got my canoe back.

The canoe was back with in the hour. It was damaged and wouldn't hold water. I mailed the one kid a check for $50 (he was a third kid that the first two brought back to inform me where my canoe was). I gave the other two kids $10 each and told them all to never come back down again. I told them that if they did, I'd get the police involved. I took their names and numbers and said I would call the parents if anything else happened.

Now the beauty of this is that I now had an excuse to tell anyone else (adult or kid) that we tried to be cool with people but that our stuff still got ripped off; and that now, we don't want anyone on the property at all. Anyone that would come by saying they had a deal w/ the previous owners that they'd keep an eye on the place in exchange for being able to hunt and fish there, I'd tell 'em don't come around 'cause our sh*t got stolen and now we can't have anyone around." BTW, the previous owners had no "deals" w/ anyone.

We had done some mild "no trespassing" posting of the property, but after the canoe incident, I went balistic and posted the hell out of the place.

Within the next few years, I'd have some local yahoos come by and say "we've hunted here all our lives, and you buy the place and post it and now we can't hunt here." I'd just tell them "you should have bought the place."

Another time, I showed up on a Saturday, and there were 48 empty beer bottles of Molson Canadian and Yuengling Lager. Now this is not the beer of choice for broke no-cash teenagers. Not a bottle was broken, or thrown on the ground; instead, every bottle was empty, upright, an set on one of my picnic tables.

I just left, went to the local gun shop and picked up a .40 cal HK USP handgun and about 500 rounds. In PA, there's no delay if your record's clean. I went back to the property, set up some coffee can targets, and laid off all the rounds. I left the coffee cans hanging (w/ all the holes in 'em) in the tree in plain view of anyone trespassing.

For the most part, the trespassing has stopped. I get the occasional signs of someone fishing, and I'm sure that people still hunt the place, but much less than before. I'm hesitant to go out in the woods during deer season to try and roust someone.

This is a never ending process that you just have to stay on it. I've got the police involved, and they're receptive. I feel that they like the fact that someone is interested in busting these people by helping to provide evidence and most importantly, testifying when necessary. Most of these local trespassers have other troubles w/ the law, and sometimes your assistance w/ your complaint can help the police increase the overall penalties for these trespassers, and give them more reasons to apprehend them, and more charges to hang on them.

Also, I've found some neighbors to be helpful. Most are full of sh*t, but some really want the area to be quiet. I also have a local caretaker that keeps an eye on the place as well as stocking firewood and garbage removal. We pay him, and give him access to the place if he want to camp for a weekend, or take his family there. He does not hunt or really fish, and we do pay him a few hundred bucks over the year.

Sorry, that post got long. But the main point is to go to your property when you're not expected to be there.

Sunil zuludawn4u@aol.com

Critterhunter: Interesting story! Don't know what I'd do differently in such a spot.
As for moving forward, two ideas come to mind that use completely different "defensive" measures.
TACTIC ONE: Take the new landowner a few cleaned birds or fish after one of your outings. Depending on the individual's disposition, this calculated gamble is certain to make the situation either better or worse. A neutral response probably isn't very likely.
TACTIC TWO: If you reload, take a box of shot-less loads on your next hunt. If the fellow again insists that you peppered him or his barn, toss him a few primed and powdered shells from your bag and ask him how that could be, since you've been firing blanks. That lesson might make him think twice before making a fool of himself again.

Well, my buddy and his wife were out working on the pond today. As I expected, the new neighbor had come up with even more than the "you shot my barn" story to tell them. It seems I woke his daughters while shooting the next morning, etc, etc. My buddy told me to "keep a low profile" until my buddy's wife calms down a bit. I informed him that that wouldn't be necessary, as this new land owner will keep moaning and complaining until he has them under his thumb and the property all to himself for hunting and fishing privilages. I told him I'd bring back his key and that he can find somebody else to manage his pond for him. I've seen this happen to other friends with permission to hunt/fish, and I'm going to save myself the trouble of having to hear the latest complaint.

Critter, I think you owe your friend an apology. He is letting you hunt and fish on his property and taking the liability chances and all he is asking you to do is lie low for awhile. He is not going to let the neighbor hunt or fish he just doesn't want to have to spend the $$$ to potentially defend himself with an attorney. The neighbor is a jerk and your friend seems very reasonable except he seems to have a volatile better half. Be his friend don't make the matter worse.

Buzz, there is no point in trying to get along with this neighbor, and he'll continue to cause both me and the pond owner trouble until he gets what he wants. I've seen this happen before to others and there is no pleasing these people.

A friend of mine and his kids had hunted a farm for well over 20 years with no problem. One day a new neighbor moved in next door. He also secured permission to hunt the farmer's land. He began telling the farmer stories about them shooting near his house, parking on his property, seeing them "sneak out" "poached" deer, and even went so far as to call the sheriff to report their car as being "abandoned". They knocked on the guy's door one day to try to straighten out the problem, and he responsed by telling them he wouldn't be happy until they stopped coming out to hunt "his" woods. Words to the effect of him being local and them being outsiders. The farmer knew what was going on but would rather please his neighbor than allow this family tradition to continue. I figure I'm saving myself and the pond owner a lot of grief by ending this early. I'm not happy about it, but I figure when this guy's controlling ways starts to make enemies out of them then I'll consider returning.

Critter, It sounds like you are looking out for your friend so I apologize. I just think sometimes you need to give people some time to figure things out. The neighbor will show his colors if your friend doesn't already know it. Give it some time. He has to deal with his wife and the neighbor and you. He is in a difficult position.

When I bought my land I was having problems with tresspassers. The gates had been destroyed, fences cut and lots of dumping.

I put in new gates, fixed the fences and posted with multiple signs. They kept coming, so I got the sherrif to increase there patrols. Next they dismantled my back gate to get in.

None of the neighbors now anything, or so they say, so my next move was to the local DEA agent who has some land down the street. I told him I was worried about somebody growing pot on my land, but I couldn't find it yet. He said I had a good place for it and it was possible. I then told the neighbors the DEA had access to my land to help me find the pot plants and they would be watching the place.

That was six months ago and I havn't had a tresspasser since. I think the word got around and scared off my problem. I hope so.

Here's an interesting story. I live on a ranch that is high fenced and am trying to grow big whitetail deer - food plots, supplemental feed, etc. I have a neighbor who leases his property to deer hunters and one of them has their deer blind and feeder placed right on our fenceline. I ride my fencelines on a regular basis to check the fence plus let hunters and potential poachers know there is someone around to discourage shooting across the fence. Several weeks ago, I find a note taped to the fence where this hunters stand is placed and the note threatens that he will turn me into the game warden for "harassment" if I drive again along MY property on my fenceline! Go figure that logic? I would be curious as to suggestions on how I respond to this guy? Don't want to hack him off too bad for fear of him shooting one of my good bucks across the fence but also don't want to just ignore his stupidity. One thought I had was to write a note back in a sarcastic way telling him I will start checking with him on his hunting schedule before I drive on my own property. Anyway, how would you guys handle this?? Thanks