Pond Boss Forums STOCKING A NEW POND Creating the food chain Stocking new LMB pond w/o Bg?

Joe,

Just to add to your confusion...if you are looking for diversity....and I am not a pro but...

IMHO Walleye (WE) would be a nice fit with a SMB, YP, PS, and minnow/shiner pond....

[quote=Bill Cody]Golden shiner are often suggested for NY ponds and should be available and work okay with YP-SMB. Get the shiners in with the FHM asap to get a spawn before adding SMB.

http://www.dec.ny.gov/docs/fish_marine_pdf/baitfishofny.pdf
http://www2.dnr.cornell.edu/cek7/nyfish/Cyprinidae/cyprinidae.html
Bait Shops in NY
https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=zcrgvPKbkhdM.kNocREHXpZ_U&hl=en_US
Aquaculture Fish Growers in NY likely to have pellet raised YP'
Smith Creek has pumpkinseed sunfish
http://smithcreekfishfarm.com/live-pond-fish.cfm
http://nysaquaculture.weebly.com/fish-for-sale.html

Bill, thanks for all that great info! I will put it to good use. I failed to mention ( I completely forgot) that this past fall I made a minnow trap and was able to catch some small fish in the creek running through my land. I wasn't sure what they were but after reviewing the links you posted I believe they were eastern black nosed dance.

Bill D,
I like the sound of that. I never imagined walleye would be possible in such a small pond.

Whatever fish you catch out of the creek, be sure of the ID, and research them to see if they will reproduce in your pond. Many creek/stream dwellers need flowing water to reproduce, therefore won't do well reproductive wise in a pond.

Not too long ago, I read an old post by Bill C. where ponds near him are 1/3 acre and have WE. I just put some in my little less than .5 acre last fall. Just remember, they will not reproduce so when you harvest some, you will need to ladder stock more.

As a general rule the fewer species (assuming they are compatible to start with - a good plan) the easier it is to successfully manage . That is why it is often suggested ( see Bill's post). If you want HSB and or WE add them as advanced fish after the base is established .

I agree. I believe I will start with a few species of minnow to start this spring. I won't add any other species until next season allowing the minnows to increase in numbers and this will give me more time to add additional structure and cover. It seems like the FhM-YP-SMB combo might fit me well. Once I (hopefully) successfully establish that combo I will consider adding additional species. As much as I want to throw a bunch of fish in and begin to "play" I know a little patience can go a long way.

Joeambro,
Pictures can be very deceiving, but your pond looked similar to mine. My pond is about 100 feet wide by 200 feet long with more of a stretched out oval shape than a rectangle. I always thought my pond was 1/3 of an acre. However using googles measure tool or one of the several good online, or app based measure tools I found that my pond was closer to about .2, or .22 acres when full. What does it matter? Well when you go to picking your stocking numbers, especially of reproducing panfish and then later your apex predators, there is a big difference between a .2 acre pond which yours might be compared to one three times that size (you mentioned in your introduction that yours was .75 acres).

Also, hopefully your spring keeps your pond nice and full. If it doesn't and you start measuring for a liner or for a sealant of some type, having a good accurate measurement is very important.

IF you have to treat the water for any reason (pond dye for algae suppression, weed or FA treatments for example) you can save a lot of money if you buy the right amount and give it at the correct concentration for your amount of water.

Keep us posted on what local minnows you can source and what you can trap in local waters in NY. The folks here are pretty good at identifying local minnow species if you post good close pictures.

Welcome to the addiction known as pond ownership!

Measuring a pond with google.

http://www.acme.com/planimeter/

I think the pond is smaller than 3/4 of an acre now that I think about it. I do not remember the exact measurements. The next time I get to the land I will take waterline measurements. As for google maps, the pond was dug this past September so it has not been photographed on any mapping systems yet. As soon as it is I will use the tools you guys have suggested. When I estimate the pond perimeter on the mapping calculator I am getting something just shy of a 1/2 acre. I would of never want to miscalculate and over do anything with the pond. I rather under estimate. I will be sure to update you on the minnow situation and exact pond size. I will upload full pool photos also once I have them.

My dad was able to get measurements with his range finder today. The pond is 52 yards by 50 yards. In the calculations, I used an average depth of 8'. The pond at full pool is just over half of an acre (.54). I'm not sure if this plays into anything but the volume comes in around 4.3 acre-feet.

If you can locate pellet trained 4"-6" yellow perch (150-200) and FHM(6-8) lbs you can add them this spring. Pellet feed the YP and they will grow fast and not prey heavily on the minnows which will allow their numbers to increase significantly. By fall you should see 6"-9" perch. If minnows are real abundant you can add another 100-150 YP in the fall or spring of 2017. You can add a few fingerling SMB fall of 2017 or 2018. Note when you add bass be prepared to have all the FHM minnows consumed as soon as the bass get to 6"-8". The fewer bass you stock the longer the minnows will last. Consider adding golden shiners to maintain breeder shiners. If you want fish diversity consider adding a few pumpkinseed or redear sunfish. The sooner you add them the more likely they will be successful long term in your pond.

That sounds good Bill. I will definitely be adding fhm, crawfish and yp this spring. Hopefully I can find some pellet trained. I will also try to locate Golden shiners local. I am definitely holding off on the smb until 2017. I want to improve the forage base as well as the cover/structure in the pond before they are inteoduced.

Any recommended to crawfish #'s?
Also, should I consider planting any submerged plants?

If you cannot find pellet trained yellow perch now, do not stock them until fall when the minnows /shiners have reproduced and are overly abundant. Crayfish in NY will not reproduce this year unless you get then now before Mid-April.

I should on be able to get my hands on the crayfish. Would 100 do it?

joeambro, I am no expert when it comes to ponds, I have about 16 months of experience, so for what it is worth, I can tell you from my experience adding vegetation and crawfish at or around the same time, they crawfish denuded the vegetation and so I lost the plants that survived the planting. So u might want to get your plants established before adding the crawfish. And as far as numbers of crawfish added, I added around 1200+ 1/2 to 1" crawfish last Feb and March to a 3.5 acre pond. I figured the Res would put a hurt on these small craws and as the craws grew, I was seeing some 5" er's walking the pond bottom in late summer. I no longer see any in the pond bottom this spring and suspect the 13" lmb put a hurt on them, but I can not confirm it.

Tracy

Pre-spawn female crayfish will be carrying their eggs as a group under the tail.

Thanks Tracy,
Being the pond only has a few minnow(dace) in it I was thinking the crayfish would have time to settle in before I introduced any threats. Sounds like your Crays are doing what they were meant to do! What kind of vegetation did you add?

Here is a picture of the pond full my dad sent me. He also sent me a picture of the spring pumping water out of the ground.

American Pondweed along with some type of eel grass or water celery(can't recall the exact name right now lol) the craws wiped out a 200yd shoreline of it.

Tracy

Different types of crayfish eat different things. Up here, Rusty crayfish are known for cleaning out plants from a body of water. Papershells won't.

Cody Note: Papershell crayfish when abundant will consume lots of vegetation including some emergent vegetation when the crayfish are very abundant.

essup, it took me almost a year to figure out what type of crawfish I had. I needed to let them grow as Bill Cody was correct when he said, not able to type them till adult stage. Turned out they are Red Swamp crawfish and in my researching, I learned they inhabit a large portion of the USA, Gulf coast to Southern Illinois. Lots and Lots of different types of crays. Makes ones head spin when trying to figure out what type inhabits a pond

Tracy

Tracy, I agree. Trying to figure out what species of crayfish to me is like trying to figure out if a LMB is male or female in August.

Hi all,
Sorry for the radio silence. It has been a long winter and it's about time to follow up and move on to the next step. I waited the year for the fhm to populate the pond. I ended up stocking around 6-7lbs fhm and 3-4lbs golden shiners. I'll attach pictures of the fish trap contents from
My last visit to the pond. It was in for a whole 5 min and came up with dozens of fish.
I spoke to the fish farm today inquiring about their stock. He again recommended 35-40 yp and 35-40 smb. He also recommended I purchase the smb (4-5") now. He mentioned that due to availability. I initially figured I'd be putting another pound of fhm, some
Crawfish and yp this round. Then come fall stock the smb. Any harm to adding the smb now? Is the yp stocking right? The pond again, is approx 150'x150'.

Can anyone id the larger fish?