Pond Boss Magazine
https://www.pondboss.com/images/userfiles/image/20130301193901_6_150by50orangewhyshouldsubscribejpeg.jpg
Advertisment
Newest Members
antscozz, Bowhunter2004, Thomas7, tynpond, hershl
18,550 Registered Users
Forum Statistics
Forums36
Topics41,033
Posts558,726
Members18,551
Most Online3,612
Jan 10th, 2023
Top Posters
esshup 28,618
ewest 21,518
Cecil Baird1 20,043
Bill Cody 15,165
Who's Online Now
7 members (Theo Gallus, Boondoggle, sroane, bstone261, Sunil, FishinRod, Wallaman), 712 guests, and 596 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3
#428094 10/31/15 05:35 PM
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 27
C
OP Offline
C
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 27
I continue to have problems with what I think is a major coontail invasion. The problem started 2 yrs ago and the past 2 summers my 3-4 acre pond has been covered with this weed (approx 50-75% coverage). I introduced some triploid grass carp two years ago per specs. recommended and they are now huge but have done little to mitigate the aquatic vegetation. I prefer not to use chemicals but may not have any other options. Can any of you help me confirm the identity of the vegetation from the attached pics and offer any solutions other than grass carp. Thanks in advance for your help.

pond veg1

http://i1383.photobucket.com/albums/ah311/GMD0911/Pond%20veg2_zpscnyc4tlo.jpg

http://i1383.photobucket.com/albums/ah311/GMD0911/Pond%20veg3_zpsis1jrfrr.jpg

Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 3,959
Likes: 188
P
Offline
P
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 3,959
Likes: 188
Chara maybe

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 4,596
Likes: 36
Lunker
Offline
Lunker
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 4,596
Likes: 36
If you don't want to use chemicals have you thought about pond dye? Add dyes this fall and then refresh the dye in February.



Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 27
C
OP Offline
C
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 27
Don't want to use chemicals, but will if works without killing the fish. Any recommendations on what and how to use. Assume fall/winter not the best time of the year? early spring the best?

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 28,618
Likes: 868
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Lunker
Offline
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Lunker
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 28,618
Likes: 868
When you say you added triploid grass carp per specs, how many did you add?


www.hoosierpondpros.com


http://www.pondboss.com/subscribe.asp?c=4
3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 27
C
OP Offline
C
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 27
12 per acre, 36 total. I can see at least a dozen per visit with fish appearing to be in the 10-15 lb. range. Maybe they are getting too fat and lazy? I have been accused of same.

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 28,618
Likes: 868
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Lunker
Offline
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Lunker
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 28,618
Likes: 868
Up the amount of GC by about 4 per surface acre. See what happens then. Do you know for sure what size pond you have? i.e. measure it?

Google acme planimeter and see if it's on there.


www.hoosierpondpros.com


http://www.pondboss.com/subscribe.asp?c=4
3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 6,080
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 6,080
Likes: 1
This one is very interesting to me. Been scratching my head on it today. I see it as how many GC are required to "mow the lawn" and then "keep the lawn mowed" as two different numbers of GC. Does it make sense to help the GC out with either herbicide or mechanical removal of the bulk of the problem and then just stock to "keep the lawn mowed?"


[Linked Image]
Be Brave Enough to Suck at Something New!
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,511
Offline
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,511
That's what I did, Bill.

When I moved here in March, 2012 the CT was so bad you couldn't row a boat in the pond. Treated with Fluridone in June 2012, followed with stocking 8, 12" GC in the fall. Follow up treatment again with Fluridone in Spring 2013 and to date my pond is clean.

The GC are huge yet rarely seen. I'd remove them if I could catch them and restock at 12" if needed.

I believe the way it's worked for me is that the GC have kept the lawn mowed smile .


Keith - Still Lovin Livin

https://youtu.be/o-R41Rfx0k0
(a short video tribute to the PB members we met on our 5 week fishing adventure)

Formerly: 2ac LMB,HSB,BG,HBG,RES
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,930
Likes: 2
R
RER Offline
Offline
R
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,930
Likes: 2
would loading it down with tilapia in the spring help eat some of it?


Goofing off is a slang term for engaging in recreation or an idle pastime while obligations of work or society are neglected........... Wikipedia
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 6,080
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 6,080
Likes: 1
CP,
Is stocking crawfish an option for you? Many have reported a healthy crawfish population wiping out a lot of vegetation.

Has it been confirmed that your vegetation is in fact coontail? I read back thru the thread and didn't see that question answered definitively.

Last edited by Bill D.; 11/02/15 08:49 AM.

[Linked Image]
Be Brave Enough to Suck at Something New!
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,511
Offline
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,511
Good question, Bill!

IN CP's pics I don't see the whorls commonly found on Coontail. To me it appears to be Chara, which I understand to be an algae.

IIRC, one way to check to see if it's Chara is to pinch it and see if it puts off a foul smell.


Keith - Still Lovin Livin

https://youtu.be/o-R41Rfx0k0
(a short video tribute to the PB members we met on our 5 week fishing adventure)

Formerly: 2ac LMB,HSB,BG,HBG,RES
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,488
Likes: 2
Lunker
Offline
Lunker
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,488
Likes: 2
Originally Posted By: Bill D.
Has it been confirmed that your vegetation is in fact coontail? I read back thru the thread and didn't see that question answered definitively.
No doubt, it is indeed coontail.

Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 6,080
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 6,080
Likes: 1
Originally Posted By: Kelly Duffie
Originally Posted By: Bill D.
Has it been confirmed that your vegetation is in fact coontail? I read back thru the thread and didn't see that question answered definitively.
No doubt, it is indeed coontail.


Thanks for the confirmation Kelly. You are definitely a pro on vegetation so, what is your recommendation to get it under control and then sustain?


[Linked Image]
Be Brave Enough to Suck at Something New!
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 27
C
OP Offline
C
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 27
Thanks very much for the responses to this thread. I can confirm based on both Pond Boss expertise and TPW Dept. opinions that vegetation is Pond Weed. Given my perspective of the feedback so far I would like to develop a plan going forward for a "mow the lawn" / "kill the weeds" approach. Add some young bloods to my grass carp herd and supplement with some selective herbicide application in the spring. I would appreciate any commentary on the following plans.

> Spring 2016 - add additional 20 grass carp to the pond (I have a TPW permit for 25 fish). My pond is 3-4 acres with a depth of 12 - 15 ft. on the dam side of the pond. I would estimate that I currently have 6-10 lg. fat carp cruising the pond.

> Spring 2016 - Apply aquatic herbicide (either Flouridone (Sonar) or Endothal (Aqualhol - copper compound mix needed?)). My assumption is that vegetation should be actively growing before application and amount/application method should follow label directions.

I have raked the pond before and do not wish to pursue this option going forward as it is very labor and time sensitive and concerned that I may be simply spreading the problem.

I really appreciate the PB community input and counsel on this issue and am happy to serve as a "case study" for those afflicted with similar challenges. I will document a plan based another round of feedback and update on implementation and results in 2016. Thanks again and look forward to anymore questions.

Overall the rains of 2015 have been wonderful for my Parker county pond as it is full, family and friends are enjoying catching lots of LMB and BG, and habitat is thriving (including coontail). Need to improve the size of my LMB's but that's another subject for a different thread.

-- Coolpond

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 28,618
Likes: 868
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Lunker
Offline
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Lunker
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 28,618
Likes: 868
Go here and measure your pond to know it's size for sure.

http://acme.com/planimeter/

Depending on the amount of weeds you want to regrow in the pond after the herbicide treatment, you might need more or less Triploid Grass Carp. For complete control, 12-15 per acre would do it if you have a lot of plants. So, you can see how the difference between 3 and 4 acres is critical.

It's also critical for applying herbicide. You also have to get a good idea of the depth profile of the pond to correctly figure out how many gallons of water are in your pond, especially with Fluridone. If you think you have 4 acres and only have 3, and apply as if you have 4, it will cost a LOT more. You can't spot treat with it, the whole lake has to be treated, and you should keep the concentration at 90 parts per billion for a minimum of 45 days.

You could also use Diquat with a copper kicker and a surfactant.


www.hoosierpondpros.com


http://www.pondboss.com/subscribe.asp?c=4
3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 27
C
OP Offline
C
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 27
Thanks again

Joined: May 2014
Posts: 21
A
Offline
A
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 21
This definitely does not look like pondweed of any kind. To me it looks very much like Chara. Cara is an algae and is best treated with Chelated copper like that in cutrine granular. If you use a liquid cutrine it can work as well but does not get as much contact time. Cutrine is very safe and will not kill your fish. You can always get a fish kill if you kill to many weeds at one time however this is easily prevented by treating one part of your pond at a time.

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 8,800
Likes: 69
Chairman, Pond Boss Legacy award; Moderator; field correspondent
Lunker
Offline
Chairman, Pond Boss Legacy award; Moderator; field correspondent
Lunker
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 8,800
Likes: 69
Coontail - looks similar to chara. Follow Esshup's advice on treatment - PM him, he can provide treatment at low cost and walk you through application.


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

[Linked Image from i1261.photobucket.com]


Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 5,324
Likes: 306
Moderator
Offline
Moderator
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 5,324
Likes: 306
Originally Posted By: Bill D.
This one is very interesting to me. Been scratching my head on it today. I see it as how many GC are required to "mow the lawn" and then "keep the lawn mowed" as two different numbers of GC. Does it make sense to help the GC out with either herbicide or mechanical removal of the bulk of the problem and then just stock to "keep the lawn mowed?"

Bill, this is what I'm doing as well. I had a very severe coontail problem, but only stocked GC at half the recommended rate. They will muddy the water, so I didn't want to deal with too many for the next 4-5 years. Aggressive herbicide applications this year, and hopefully the GC will be able to handle most of the coontail next year.


AL

Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 27
C
OP Offline
C
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 27
Measured pond with the planimeter tool. Currently 3.415 surface acres. Would estimate 90% full and can change dramatically between drought and wet cycles (worst case - 60% full in drought conditions). Average depth 6-8 ft.. Recognize the need to ensure herbicide application is "scaled" properly for best results.

I struggle with the Coontail vs. Chara identification. I have included a couple of new links to higher quality pics that may be more useful.

Thanks again for the interest on the forum and the help identifying and treating my pond vegetation.

Image of stalk: http://i1383.photobucket.com/albums/ah311/GMD0911/pndbossstalk_zpsf410od8a.jpg?t=1448474250

Image of tip: http://i1383.photobucket.com/albums/ah311/GMD0911/pndbosstip_zpsqfjqdtqd.jpg?t=1448474248

Image of clump:
http://i1383.photobucket.com/albums/ah311/GMD0911/pndbosstip_zpsqfjqdtqd.jpg?t=1448474248

Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,488
Likes: 2
Lunker
Offline
Lunker
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,488
Likes: 2
It's coontail. Chara doesn't possess forked branchlets.

Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 27
C
OP Offline
C
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 27
Thanks once again Kelly. I will not ask again.

Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,488
Likes: 2
Lunker
Offline
Lunker
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,488
Likes: 2
Originally Posted By: coolpond
Thanks once again Kelly. I will not ask again.
CP: NEVER hesitate to ask questions until you're satisfied; and preferably before you invest in any control-measures.
I'm not always right (just ask my wife), but I'll always state if any uncertainty exists - which isn't the case this time.
Let me know if have any remaining questions concerning control-options.

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 8,800
Likes: 69
Chairman, Pond Boss Legacy award; Moderator; field correspondent
Lunker
Offline
Chairman, Pond Boss Legacy award; Moderator; field correspondent
Lunker
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 8,800
Likes: 69
CP - for what it's worth, I'd say 90% of us [including myself] find chara and coontail very similar and difficult to differentiate.


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

[Linked Image from i1261.photobucket.com]


Page 1 of 3 1 2 3

Link Copied to Clipboard
Today's Birthdays
There are no members with birthdays on this day.
Recent Posts
Tilapia with Winterkill
by Theo Gallus - 05/27/24 01:18 PM
Spillway Design Help - East Texas
by FishinRod - 05/27/24 12:06 PM
Spillway recovery from record rains
by sroane - 05/27/24 10:16 AM
Dock width suggestions
by Theo Gallus - 05/27/24 10:11 AM
My big bass are disappearing 1 acre pond
by Boondoggle - 05/27/24 10:07 AM
Dock Addition!
by antscozz - 05/27/24 09:48 AM
New 2 acre pond stocking plan
by bstone261 - 05/27/24 08:35 AM
Help,BG Dying, 1 a day
by esshup - 05/27/24 08:31 AM
curly leaf infestation
by esshup - 05/27/24 08:24 AM
recommendations for northern YP/SMB/BT pond
by esshup - 05/27/24 08:02 AM
Dirt swells or artificial cover?
by esshup - 05/27/24 07:40 AM
Ideal food/pellet size?
by esshup - 05/26/24 10:27 PM
Newly Uploaded Images
Eagles Over The Pond Yesterday
Eagles Over The Pond Yesterday
by Tbar, December 10
Deer at Theo's 2023
Deer at Theo's 2023
by Theo Gallus, November 13
Minnow identification
Minnow identification
by Mike Troyer, October 6
Sharing the Food
Sharing the Food
by FishinRod, September 9
Nice BGxRES
Nice BGxRES
by Theo Gallus, July 28
Snake Identification
Snake Identification
by Rangersedge, July 12

� 2014 POND BOSS INC. all rights reserved USA and Worldwide

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5