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#378557 06/02/14 01:28 PM
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Hi,
I bought 1/2 gallon of FHM and golden shiners this weekend. as I was sorting them I immediately noticed a problem. I didn't have a camera and now I wish I did! There was a fish easily 5" long, long slender body, yellow tint to side, but clearly was not a FHM.. It was in with the shiners. My boy in his haste grabbed it to show me and almost dropped it into the pond. My heart was in my throat!! But I grabbed it in time and tossed it on the bank. Later when I checked all the others and released them I studied it some more. It did have the telltale down turned mouth, although the eye wasn't as big as can be expected for an asian carp. It clearly was not a bluegill, baby bass, pike etc.

I'm not good at recognizing juvenile chubs but I was worried it was a carp so it went in the woods. I guess it could still be there but I bet it is gone. I can check. I'll try to get a photo now but natural color will be missing.

These are the 3 closest pictures I can find on the web. one is a sketch of asian carp and looks very much like the body traits of what I saw in the fish I found. The other picture is a grass carp. Not sure how that would get mixed in with a bait wholesalers bait when gathering and baggin up their bait from their ponds or holding areas. The third one is a baby asian carp.

The coloring of the grass carp (baby carp 3 in posted pictures) with even yellow, even scales and little other markings matches what I had, but I'm worried I may have had a baby asian carp!!

What would that have done to my small pond? I wonder if I could have caught it out once it grew?

File manager will only let me load 1 file. I'll try to add the other 2 in another post

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here goes the other 2 pictures

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baby carp 2.jpg baby carp 3.jpg
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Could wholesaler have used grass carp to control algae/plants in their growing pond? and netted a baby by mistake? I believe the point source for the bait was Wisconsin but not sure. Came by truck to the western lower half of the state.

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Actually baby carp 2 and 3 are both grass carp taken from google image search. Baby carp 2 was actually seized by DEQ folk in Michigan. Great, all I need is an illegal carp in my pond!!

The asian or bighead carp seem to have a more pronounced downturned lower jaw, bigger eyes. This fish seemed to have the jaw symmetry and normal size eye of the grass carp.

Not sure what typical great lakes carp babies look like, maybe it was a normal carp too..

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Did it look like any of these pictures?









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The body shape and color was very similar to the bottom picture. However I had been reading a notice recently that we should be checking our bait buckets for asian carp. They mentioned the downturned mouth as if the fish was frowing. Your pictures show 'pucker lips with hinge in middle' whereas this had a frowning mouth with hinge near bottom almost as if it would grow up to be a suction feeder.

When I get home I'll scour the woods but I bet an animal probably ran off with it already... I should have saved it..

The top picture was too wide in the middle of the body, this fish was more fusiform throughout. Even looking at the bottom picture again suggests a bit of widening in the middle like the shiners have.

The 2nd picture down shows too much silver coloration...

Thanks for trying!!

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It is TRUE that the MI Gub is asking anglers or those that buy baitfish to keep an eye out for Asian Carp in your local dealings. I know where CC got his FHM for his pond. I think it may have been a chub or sucker tho. Leaning toward a Sucker, because that would be the most common in the mix of a bait retailer. Any type of Carp, including goldfish, would be illegal to use for bait. Chubs would be far and few between, but a Sucker is a prominent bait.

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Originally Posted By: canyoncreek
Could wholesaler have used grass carp to control algae/plants in their growing pond? and netted a baby by mistake? I believe the point source for the bait was Wisconsin but not sure. Came by truck to the western lower half of the state.


CC, it's a 1/4 million dollar fine to bring a grass carp into Michigan, knowingly or unknowingly, plus you'll get 5 years in prison to boot! No baitfish supplier would risk this wink

If you ever keep up with the Aquaculture world, the boy's in Wisconsin on the baitfish scene got nailed pretty good and I'm not sure if the umbilical chord set up by the Gub to 24/7 monitor their operations has been cut yet.

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I think it's hilarious that Michigan is paranoid about sterile triploid grass carp wiping out their natural aquatic vegation when a retired MDNR bioloist told us myself and others in attendance at a Michigan Aquaculture Meeting that grass carp are are ineffective at removing aquatic vegetation in ponds.

Got to love it when someone wants to have it both ways.

And to boot he told us that the digestive tract is so short in grass carp they just poop out what they eat right away.

Hmmm... does this look like a short digestive tract to you? Sure is a heck of a lot longer than any other fish species that I know if. (Typical of herbivore fish btw.)


Last edited by Cecil Baird1; 06/02/14 08:21 PM.

If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.






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Thanks to all for their help. I looked at more pictures of white carp and I think JKB nailed it. Although some of the juvenile white carp have more darker bands on them, my fish was uniformly golden. The mouth looks a lot more like a sucker than a grass carp or asian carp. The body shape is more correct. I'm going to assume it was a white sucker. Compared to the other fish in the minnow bag it looked like a monster!

What would it have done if it did make it in to the pond? Stir up the bottom? Eat the vegetation?

See picture below of a white carp. This came from a web page that looks like it has a lot of potential for identifying fish.

http://www.fishbase.gr/identification/Sp...mp;resultPage=1

I'll attach the photo too.

Checked the pond today, overnight the FA showed up. Just needed a little warm weather and bang there it was. Only a thin rim by the edges and easily raked out. Saw a bit more thin stemmed aquatic plants that popped up out of nowhere, poking through the dead leaves on the bottom.

Do minnows eat FA or any fine plant material? Dead or decaying leaves? Aerator is running at night to try to cool the pond as it really warmed up quickly last week.

The minnows must have found hiding spots as I don't see many. Did find 2 dead fairly large golden shiners probably didn't handle the stress well but the rest apparently are alive and well.

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CC, every picture I posted was of a Golden Shiner. wink


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I was thinking esshup that most of those pictures were golden shiners but I wasn't sure. The body of the fish I didn't trust was more torpedo like. I think it was a white carp, but either way it didn't end up in the pond.

I see today I have like 4-5 dead shiners but no dead minnows. These were bigger sized ones, 4" maybe. I assume they were stressed from the road trip.

Amazing that after being dead 1 day in the pond the eyes are missing (eaten out?) and several were covered with snails. Do snails latch on to dead fish?

I haven't seen any other shiners, they must stay down deep where it is cool?

I was amazed at how much faster they can swim and change directions compared to the FHM. I'm surprised the bass can catch them when I see how fast they can go!


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