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#371764 04/09/14 12:08 PM
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All:

Been getting several requests to perform another Grass Shrimp group order so I've reached out to Fattig to see if our original agreement is in place when Dale was still with us. I'll report whatever information I learn when they return my call.

If you are interested in a shrimp order here's the old arrangement:

Shrimp cost: $.25/ea
Shipping: Flat $35 next day anywhere in the US
Guarantee: We had a couple orders that sat at the front door for several hours in the heat and Dale was always good about refunding the order or sending replacements. I'll look into their current policy and report changes if any.

Shrimp require submerged aquatic vegetation to escape predation in ponds with current fish populations. For ponds with existing fish populations I would recommend higher stocking qtys - I personally went with 1,000/ac and was successful. Not sure how few one could get away with, just sharing my experience and I didn't want to blow the investment by stocking snacks. I now have a population that's self sustaining over the past 5 years.

For ponds without risk of predation I would recommend lower rates - maybe 100-250/ac.

If you are interested feel free to reach out via email please:
tj@hudlandmgmt.com

TJ


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Very tempting, when are you going to place an order?



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This Spring - say within a few weeks. Hows your population? Stocked 800-900 right?


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He He. The the cost of a rainbow trout right now!!

Wish I could order some!!


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TJ....would they make it in the Texas summer heat?

Are grass shrimp basically an additional forage base?

I have lots of coon-tail so I guess they could escape predation?


Fishing has never been about the fish....

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Originally Posted By: teehjaeh57
Stocked 800-900 right?


Yep!

Quote:
Hows your population?


No idea but the milfoil I released them into was sparse last year and will likely be sparse this year. I never did see any last year but really didn't look for them.

Quote:
This Spring - say within a few weeks.


Dang, I might be out of town when they show up in a few weeks.



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Yo Z

These are Palaemonetes kadiakensis, or Mississippi Grass Shrimp, and I show them as native to the Mississippi river drainage all the way down into TX and the GOM.

We add them up here to help provide an additional forage source for our YOY and age 1 predators and RES, BG and YP. We treat them much in the same way as crayfish - but shrimp will spawn throughout the warmer water months unlike crayfish.

I love the little critters and, when I can successfully collect them which isn't often, I try to transport them to all my other ponds and client's fisheries. They feed on detritus and if stocked in enough initial numbers should establish a self sustaining population - one time investment.

Here's a link to an old study - but some of the information is pertinent to our species:
http://www.nwrc.usgs.gov/wdb/pub/species_profiles/82_11-035.pdf


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Will they do well in a SW michigan pond that just saw ice out now? How long to wait for water to warm up? No fish now, but hoping to build forage, add RES possibly predator way later. Will they overwinter? I'd love to order some.

I have 1/3 acre pond give/take, 8' at high tide (high ground water mark) and am thinking that 75-100 would do or maybe that is overkill for an empty pond?

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.25 each... or 4 for $1

That seems high to me. Petsmart/petco ect has them for $1 dozen maybe 10 for a $1...

now I think they might be another species maybe Palaemonetes paludosus?

are Palaemonetes paludosus limited by northern climates?


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Another subspecies labeled as grass shrimp for $.50 each on a site that sells shark food...



http://sharksupply.com/cleaners.htm

Grass Shrimp (Palaemonetes pugio) PM
These will be shipped in tropical fish boxes with chill packs as needed to protect future shipments.

We are trying to be as cheap as possible, but, shipping on these kills us. The more you buy the better the price!30 Shrimp - $29.99 S&H Included

30 Shrimp $29.99
60 Shrimp - $34.99 S&H Included
120 Shrimp - $59.99 S&H Included
220 Shrimp - $74.99 S&H Included
330 Shrimp - $86.99 S&H Included

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Originally Posted By: BobbyRice
are Palaemonetes paludosus limited by northern climates?


I believe so as they are just found in southern climates.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palaemonetes_paludosus

Quote:
Palaemonetes paludosus is common in southern states east of the Appalachian Mountains. It is also found in Louisiana, where it may not be native, and there are scattered records from further west, in Texas and California.


The type TJ is getting are adapted too northern climates, they are raised here in Nebraska.

Quote:
Palaemonetes kadiakensis

Common name: Mississippi grass shrimp

Native Range: This shrimp ranges from northeastern Mexico, Mississippi River north to the Great Lakes and east to Florida. It is sporadic in the central US, west of the Allegheny Mountains, and from the Gulf of Mexico to Canada (Pennak 1989).





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When Travis and I first started looking for grass shrimp 5 years ago on the forum the best pricing for PK shrimp we could find was $1/ea from aquarium stores - kinda like the guys selling LCS for $6 each. Eventually Travis found Fattig and through high volume and multiple orders I managed to whittle down the pricing and get to know Dale's family pretty well as they are Nebraska folks, too.

I haven't found a source for PK Shrimp close to this pricing since - but there certainly might be one out there. Bottom line for me is I like doing business with small family owned companies who are fair and honest and I also get an opportunity to support a Pond Boss advertiser in the process. This is not only good for Bob and Mike, but also allows us to continue to enjoy resources like the free forum.


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THE ONLY SPECIES THAT WILL DO WELL IN PONDS OUTSIDE OF THE FAR SOUTH(think Florida and coastal areas up to southern SC) IS Palaemonetes kadiakensis. Or as we call them, PK shrimp.

Other species like Pugio can live in freshwater but need brackish water to spawn. Paludosus can live and reproduce in freshwater, but cannot tolerate winter temps where any ice over occurs.

Grass shrimp are in my opinion the most under utilized forage in ponds. They should be stocked in ponds just like FHM. In every pond right in the beginning! They turn detritus(rotting organic matter) into high quality fish food! I can think of NO downside to having them in a pond. Only positives... How can you go wrong? At $0.25 a piece and $35 shipping, you could purchase 200 for $85. That'll be the best $85 you spend on your pond! If you have a new pond and are just looking to stock it, these are a MUST in my opinion. If you have an established pond with areas of vegetation for the shrimp to take cover in, they're worth the investment as well.

I was down at my pond this evening and observed several grass shrimp cruising in the shallows. I was excited as this was the first time I had seen grass shrimp since the spring thaw. I can run a seine in the shallows in mid summer and when it comes up, it literally moves there are so many shrimp coming up. All those shrimp are pure fish food. YOY game fish feed on them, BG, YP, crappies... You name it, feeds on them. They make unbelievable bait as well.

TJ and I first bought our shrimp from Fattig after a lot of searching and work and we've had them since 2009. Fattig treated me right and every other person who has ordered from them, I've yet to hear a complaint. I know $0.25 per shrimp seems expensive but in a new pond, just 100-200 is all it would take to establish them. For a pond with an established fish community, as long as you had some areas of submerged aquatic vegetation, I think you can still get them established.

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Severral ponds around me a have a good population of Palaemonetes paludosus. I think I will start a netting and stocking campaign to see if I can get them to stick Or I might see if I can get a bulk order for a the price of a dinner out and save my time.

I agree and think Grass shrimp would add to the food web greatly.


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I have 6 acre pond, but can't buy 6,000 shrimp. I am planning on purchasing 1,400 shrimp and putting 1,000 in the shallow weedy area of my 6 acre pond and put 200 in two of my smaller ponds with no fish but lots of weeds. I was curious if TJ or anyone else has tried to raise in one pond and move to another? The weedy area in my large pond is about 1/3 acres with soft rush growing in it. Hopefully many of the shrimp will stay in that area and not venture out into the open water.

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I don't think you need to stock 6k shrimp - they are translucent and escape predation pretty well. If you spread out your stocking into several shallow weedy areas I think you have the best chance for success.

Yes, I transfer shrimp from my main pond to all my other ponds, and for friends when I can collect them. In my pond they only move shallow when the American and Sago pondweed gets dense. Until then I think they are either holding deep or dig into the FA along the bottom. I don't like collecting them in the FA as it's hard to remove them without a lot of messy effort and I fear I might be injuring them in the process.


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Some information on them that might be interesting to some.

Petshrimp.com discussion Talks about some caught in east central Kansas. Also has pictures and some feeding habit info.

Images for PK shrimp

An old PK thread on PBF

Found in Illinois

Another older PBF discussion on shrimp including PK

PBF thread from 2009

While reading this stuff, thought I would post the links in case others were interested.


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For 1/3 acre pond in SW MI I'd like to order 100-200. Who can I order through and how do I arrange payment?

also:

Will they do well in a SW michigan pond that just saw ice out now? How long to wait for water to warm up? No fish now, but hoping to build forage, add RES possibly predator way later. Will they overwinter? Over the weekend we had a 60 degree rain, now temps falling and 1" of snow on grass by morning, will melt later in the day and then back up to the 60s.

I have 1/3 acre pond give/take, 8' at high tide (high ground water mark) and am thinking that 75-100 would do or maybe that is overkill for an empty pond?

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Originally Posted By: teehjaeh57
All:

If you are interested feel free to reach out via email please:
tj@hudlandmgmt.com

TJ


I delete my PMs routinely as I am beyond the forum's personal user capacity and I'll likely lose whatever information either of us convey via PM. Please email whatever questions you have to me at the address provided and I'll try to help in any manner I can.

Thanks



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TJ,

Just sent you an email...


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I've had my PK shrimp in two ponds since 2009. One pond is 1/10 of an acre and has no fish in it other than roughly 10 all male BG. The other pond is 0.34 acres, 7' deep. It's in northern VA. Since they were stocked, we've had lows down to -5 and ice cover in excess of 1 month. We've had summer temps over 105 and water temps that have pushed into the mid 90's. The PK shrimp have survived these conditions no issues... PK shrimp are native from the Great Lakes down to the Gulf of Mexico. So, there are few weather extremes they cannot handle. The larger pond I have them in has no vegetation. It does contain a large number of willows on about 1/3 of the shoreline with a lot of twisted roots, a fair amount of submerged woody structure and FA. It is a mostly mud/detritus bottom. However, I have a limited predatory fish population which is a factor in why the PK shrimp have done well in this pond without an submerged vegetation. I can tell you, that GSH, banded killifish and even FHM will readily prey on PK shrimp. I watch them gang up on a shrimp and literally tear it to pieces. I commonly see shrimp hopping out of the water to avoid being eaten. I regularly see shrimp eating Aquamax pellets that have floated to the shore. They will gladly clean up what the fish don't get. You really cannot go wrong in stocking PK shrimp in your ponds...

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Originally Posted By: BobbyRice
.25 each... or 4 for $1

That seems high to me. Petsmart/petco ect has them for $1 dozen maybe 10 for a $1...



I stand corrected. , Was at petsupermarket today.
they are now 10 for $2, with tax thats 21.5 cents each....

still are the southern type shrimp I believe....


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I got my PK shrimp today from Carol Fattig. All shrimp were alive and looking good. No photo's yet. It is sleeting and snowing here and 31 degrees. Hard to get to the ponds where I would like to release the shrimp so I put them in 50 gallon tank with pond water after equalizing the water temperatures. I have some 100 gallon tanks also so may try and grow out some of the shrimp in the tanks. Hope this current cold weather isn't to hard on them.

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Glad things worked out for you


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Worked out great. Thanks for lining everything up TJ. I owe you one.

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