Pond Boss Forums AQUATIC VEGETATION Controlling unwanted plants LAKE DYE Comparisons

Bill - temperature influence associated with dye-treatments is an interesting and likely concept; but might be hard to validate due to pond-variables beyond dyed vs no-dye.

Kelly - one way to approach this temperature influence is to use the dye in above ground pools. Two similar small ponds at a fish farm, esp two that were filled at the same time ande the same depth, bottom shape, would have fewer variables than two ponds and possibly different ages several miles apart. Temp tests could be made and then in several days after temp tests the dye added to control pond assuming dye was to be used anyway.

I understand the possible methods for narrowing down the variables, but wasn't sure if Greg was interested in a thesis project
It might be more feasible to take 1'-depth temp-readings from several similar ponds (some dyed, some not), at regular intervals over several weeks and then compare the variances within each pond - instead of directly comparing the temps from one pond to another. If the dyed ponds signifcantly increase in temperature (over their base-lines) more rapidly than the non-dyed ponds, I think the theory would be supported. Still, a lot of work.....

Kelly all good ideas. I was just throwing out ways to reduce the variables. IMO the temp measurements would not have to extend for a very long time, probably two to three weeks until the dyed pond temps equalize and 'catch-up' with the control pond.

ok Bob liked the idea. Now I want input. I want to ask as many pond dye manufactures for product. I have no pony in this race and want to know for sure what scores the highest. Im thinking we may not see a huge diff or maybe we will.

I want to test both liquid and powder. Tough to compare one to the other but like selling the water soulbe packets for ease of shipping so want to try a few of those.

I will use the KISS method and yes not a thesis being defended by a panel. No discussion of how much of yellow, etc. to prevent alage just the color change and persistence. To keep it cheap on my part I plan to use water bottles. If I have 15 manufactures I will need at least 60 bottles. That ok or I need glass? I will take pictures, etc. with different concentrations and monitor for a monoth or longer to see change.

input please. I will probably email you Kelly, Cody dye chemist and others.

Having never attempted the dropper-method (I'm sceptical), and to possibly prevent too much time-investment for little benefit, may I suggest a preliminary "trial-run" to test the methodology?
Although water bottles may work fine (maybe not), it might work better to use rinsed plastic milk jugs with uniform volumes of water.
I realize plastic milk jugs are opaque. So, if they're not sufficiently clear to directly view/compare coloration variations, maybe you can run your dilution-ratios in the milk jugs (allowing greater dilutions and error-margins) and then transfer a portion of dyed water from each jug into clear glass cups for side-by-side comparisons (returning the samples back to the respective jugs between comparison-intervals).
If you prefer water-bottles for initial dilutions, go ahead. But, the typical "labeled" field-use ratio for liquid-dyes is 1:1,303,404 (= 1qt/ac-ft). If 132 drops = 1 oz (using my calibrated dropper, with each dropper being different), then 1 drop would treat 77.14 gal. at "labeled rates". Using 10x the standard (though subjective) labeled-rate would require adding 1 drop to 7.7 gallons of water. 100x "labeled-rate" = 1 drop to 9.86 oz.
Just trying to put things into perspective before you tackle this task. I'm simply guessing that color-variances will be more easily discerned at higher dilution-ratios; thus a greater volume of water per drop of dye.
It might be worth a trial-run with a couple of dyes that you may already have on-hand before casting the net for numerous samples.

Thanks Kelly I had planned on doing some kind of dilution in 2 gallon bucket etc then transfer to bottles. The information is helpful. So do you think we would learn any useful information? I hoped to get handle on amount of concentration of dye at the least. If you the pro do not think that is the case then yes why go thru the trouble. I of course have tried being scientific and using dye in ponds but way too many variables to learn anything on how one compares to another. I planned on doing cost analysis as well based on suggesteed retail. Thanks for the info any others? I planned on sending email to manufacturers later this week.

The main reason I use pond dyes these days is actually just to enhance the look of the water. Most of the time I use aquashade as my go to all around lake dye, but oftentimes we will add other shades of black and blue to get the exact color we are looking for. The combinations we use are site specific depending on what particles are suspended in the water to begin with.

With my own observations of using thousands of gallons of dye per year and trying every single brand of dye on the market it seems we get the most value for our dollar with Aquashade, but I am very interested in what you come up with Greg!

N8LY,

Thanks for that info. I was wondering if anyone was going to give me their opinion on the dye's themselves. I used a gallon of Aquashade last year and was fairly happy with it. I was suprised at how dark it was at first! The weird part is when it finally starts to lose some of it's shade it looks like left over color from dipping Easter Eggs! I never did maintian it though like it said. I just did a one time gallon and that was it. Sure worked good though and it kept my plants at bay for another 3 weeks to a month.

after much debate Im sending email to some suppliers today to see what kind of response I get.

When creating drops two features become important. 1. diameter of orifice. 2. Angle of dropper as one holds it. A 45 deg angle creates a larger drop than a vertically held dropper. Be consistant when holding the dropper.
Regarding Kelly's post above and drop dilutions, are you familiar with use of serial dilutions?

BC it will be serial dilutions we are doing to minimize the dropper effect as you mention.

Greg,

If you want to be extremely accurate with your dropper I would suggest picking up a burette and putting it in some kind of a stand. You can get one for @ $20 or less at any lab ware supplier. The stand and valve would remove any inaccuracies from droplet size.

-HH

Im actually plannig on using our digitial titrator. If not more response than i received today might not have enough wanting me to test their product.

The digitial titrator idea did not work. HH burette might be in order.

Did anything ever come of all of this?

Wish I would have found this thread before starting to use pond dye, but maybe best I did not. For what it is worth, black dye has seemed to help me keep FA under control. Will know more next year as maybe FA was simply not as bad this year because of higher water flow through (less potential nutrient load).

My experience with black pond dye starting bottom of page 2 of FA thread