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Thank you - If something toxic comes in, then I will have more to worry about since the SMB that I hope to add next year will likely not do well!

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I hope this is a golden shiner because I hade to dump them in the pond because they were dying. Got them from a bait shop and they did not have O2 to add to the bag.


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Looks like one to me.


Excerpt from Robert Crais' "The Monkey's Raincoat:"
"She took another microscopic bite of her sandwich, then pushed it away. Maybe she absorbed nutrients from her surroundings."

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That's great!

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Other than crayfish, FHM, and GSH, are there any other good forage species?

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Could consider:

Lake Chubsucker
Bluntnose Minnow
Spotfin Shiner
Johnny Darter
Banded Kilifish

Discussion Thread

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I assume that I would need to catch these rather than find then at a fishery?

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Read through that thread I attached when you get a chance. We're trying to get some together through a source TJ found. Add your interest to that thread if you want in. I need some very soon as well.

RAH #331298 04/19/13 07:07 PM
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Originally Posted By: RAH
Other than crayfish, FHM, and GSH, are there any other good forage species?


How about freshwater shrimp. Either Mississippi Ghosts (talk to TEEJAY) or a more local smaller variety.


TJ Im sure I butchered your screen name, sorry!!

Last edited by fishm_n; 04/19/13 07:08 PM.

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Yep, here to help on alternative forage species and shrimp, just fire me a PM. Happy to assist, have already helped many here.


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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I assumed that crayfish would eat water plants, specifically newly planted water lillies. Am I off base?

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Can anyone ID this fish?


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It is a shiner. Lets start eliminating what it is not: not golden, nor spotfin, nor spottail, nor common shiner, nor striped, nor redfin, nor rosefin, nor ribbon, nor red, nor emerald, nor ironcolor, nor silver, nor sand, nor mimic, nor ghost, nor channel, nor bigeye, nor blackchin, nor bigmouth. Can't see the mouth very well which is often helpful. I assume you caught it in the creek or small stream?? In the picture it doesn't look like a steelcolor shiner to me cause the scales don't look big enough and distinct enough. I can't see the mouth and snout which are unique to steelcolor shiners. It might be a river shiner? CJ will have to provide an opinion. A steelcolor shiner is a good spawner in ponds. I wish I had a few of them.

Minnows and shiners of Indiana.

http://www.indiana.edu/~inbsarc/divfish_files/species_files/checklist%20of%20indiana%20fishes.pdf

Last edited by Bill Cody; 05/11/13 04:48 PM.

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I put it in the LMB pond because I thought it might be a pale-colored creek chub which is what the other fish in the trap were. I wish that I had put it in the forage pond destined to be a SMB pond. If I catch more, that's where they will go. I was afraid to leave it in the bucket all day.

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Can you give me a little more help with this one. How long is it?

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If it is less than 3.5" or so, I would say a male FHM that isn't in spawning colors. I base this on the first ray of the dorsal fin is distinctly shorter than the next one, there is a fattening of the caudal fin at the base along the bottom and upper edges of it, these traits along with the general shape of the fish is indicative of a FHM male.

A rare FHM male may be almost 4" but that would be a freak. If the fish is longer then 4", well then I am pretty stumped and will have to reevaluate the picture.

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About 2.5" long

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Then it is with 90%+ certainty a FHM.

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Not as exciting as a different species of shiner, but I guess they are pretty common in small streams.

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The fish in the plastic bag sure does not look like a FHM to me. The bag must be distorting the image assuming CJ is correct. Maybe try another picture showing the mouth? Body shape is also not charactistic of a FHM. Some shiners have the first dorsal ray 1/2 teh length of the 2 dorsal ray. But the first dorsal ray of the FHM is thickened compared to that of most shiners. FHM are at times similar appearing to other fish, but FHM are pretty easy to differentiate from shiners. Try to get us a couple more pics. FHM do live in streams but in my experience are not real common in streams - but it all depends.


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I agree Bill, FHM are pretty rare in streams. About the only time I catch them in streams is when they are getting flushed out of a pond upstream from the point I am catching them.

I just don't know of any species that has the 1/2 length first dorsal ray so distinct along with the thickness of the caudal fin edges like this specimen does, other than FHM. What about the shape makes you not think it is a male FHM? When not spawning, male FHM are still chunky like this fish is.

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I released it already, but If I catch another, I'll try to get better pictures. It seemed that it was disproportionately taller than the creek chubs that I caught with it (although the picture did not show this clearly.

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CJ - the fish in the bag just does not look like a FHM to me. The head length appears too long and the midbody height appears too tall for the total length and more like a spotfin body shape. Snout shape will be a key feature of identification for me. Shapes and body dimensions could easily be distorted by the fish being in a plastic bag.


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This fish is in a rectangular plastic fish bagger, but the corners do distort the mouth since the plastic rolls arounfd the corners. The little buggers always stick their heads in the corners!

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My pond was stocked with FHM and GS this spring. I want a SMB pond. I want to wait until the fall of 2014 to add the SMB to get lots of forage established. I'll add collected crayfish starting next spring. Is there any reason not to add YP and RES this fall (I found a source within driving distance)?

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