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#312066 11/14/12 05:45 PM
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Would a couple these be good for shade around pond? Not on dam of course.


If you ain't gonna fart, why eat the beans?
.
RES,HBG,YP,HSB,SMB,CC,and FHM. .seasonal trout.
John Wann #312070 11/14/12 06:49 PM
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Yeah they look great can grow in water.. The wetter the area the more knees it will grow making it hard to mow around..


I believe in catch and release. I catch then release to the grease..

BG. CSBG. LMB. HSB. RES.

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John Wann #312083 11/14/12 07:52 PM
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Will they suck a pond dry?


If you ain't gonna fart, why eat the beans?
.
RES,HBG,YP,HSB,SMB,CC,and FHM. .seasonal trout.
John Wann #312086 11/14/12 08:08 PM
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A really small one maybe


I believe in catch and release. I catch then release to the grease..

BG. CSBG. LMB. HSB. RES.

[Linked Image from i90.photobucket.com]
John Wann #312089 11/14/12 08:10 PM
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I wonder if they would grow in clay of new pond.


If you ain't gonna fart, why eat the beans?
.
RES,HBG,YP,HSB,SMB,CC,and FHM. .seasonal trout.
John Wann #312090 11/14/12 08:15 PM
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I have some trees to plant!


If you ain't gonna fart, why eat the beans?
.
RES,HBG,YP,HSB,SMB,CC,and FHM. .seasonal trout.
John Wann #312102 11/15/12 12:14 AM
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I got alot more than you a few years ago through the county extension dnr office.. I have one bald cypress left.. If you do not take pretty good care of them te first couple years don't plan on many survivors.. Especially with a drought like this year.. The last bald cypress I thought was dead for sure this year but came bak here in the last month with new growth and greened back up..


I believe in catch and release. I catch then release to the grease..

BG. CSBG. LMB. HSB. RES.

[Linked Image from i90.photobucket.com]
John Wann #312104 11/15/12 12:19 AM
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Mmmm... I love me some pawpaw trees! Best fruit out there...

John Wann #312107 11/15/12 01:06 AM
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Agree on Pawpaws if you can get them to grow in your area.


Get out and fish.
jakeb #312109 11/15/12 01:32 AM
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Originally Posted By: jakeb
Agree on Pawpaws if you can get them to grow in your area.

They grow wild all around here.


If you ain't gonna fart, why eat the beans?
.
RES,HBG,YP,HSB,SMB,CC,and FHM. .seasonal trout.
John Wann #312119 11/15/12 07:56 AM
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I planted 8 bald cypress near my lake 7 years ago. Although they have all survived, they haven't grown well. I planted them in East TX red clay, and they don't seem to like that as well as the black clay here in the Dallas area.

Knowing what I know now, I probably would have planted them during the fall water drop, and then had them semi-submerged for a greater part of the year.


AL

FireIsHot #312144 11/15/12 11:54 AM
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Originally Posted By: FireIsHot
I planted 8 bald cypress near my lake 7 years ago. Although they have all survived, they haven't grown well. I planted them in East TX red clay, and they don't seem to like that as well as the black clay here in the Dallas area.

Knowing what I know now, I probably would have planted them during the fall water drop, and then had them semi-submerged for a greater part of the year.

Ok thanks. I'll try this.


If you ain't gonna fart, why eat the beans?
.
RES,HBG,YP,HSB,SMB,CC,and FHM. .seasonal trout.
John Wann #312538 11/19/12 09:45 PM
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Jwwann,I planted quite a few Bald Cypress in and around my pond about 12 years ago.The secret in my opinion is to plant them directly in the water instead of next to it,they will do much better this way.I simply started with some 4-5 foot specimens ,placed them in 1-2 ft. of water then placed rocks around the root balls to anchor them in place, they will root themselves in place in about 6 months.They provide fair shade but they are slow growers I just love the way they look.Weeping and regular native willows around the edge of my pond provide a lot more shade than the Bald Cypress ever could and they grow 10 times faster.One word of caution if you plant Bald Cypress in an area where the water level fluctuates and they are in the water one day and out the next and so on they can weaken and die on you especially before good establishment.I included a photo of one of mine at 12 yrs,Ryer.

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John Wann #312543 11/19/12 10:21 PM
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Thanks Ryer. That tree looks awesome!


If you ain't gonna fart, why eat the beans?
.
RES,HBG,YP,HSB,SMB,CC,and FHM. .seasonal trout.
John Wann #312562 11/20/12 07:44 AM
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Yes it does look awesome. I planted 15 around the pond in the spring of 11 at the edge of the water at that time, which was 2 - 3 feet from full pool. Early in 11 we got a lot of rain and they ended up in 1 -2 feet of water before the drought started in July '11. Now they are a good 20' from the waters edge. They are all alive but not growing a ton. Hope the water comes up and they look that good in a dozen years.

Thinking of planting more of them closer to the water but how deep of water can they survive in? At full pool this could be 5 - 6' deep (if I ever get there)

FYI these trees where purchased from MDC.

Last edited by lassig; 11/20/12 07:46 AM.

John Wann #312566 11/20/12 08:09 AM
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Lassig,my older trees are in 3 ft. of water and early this spring I had 3 that were slightly out of water that were doing poorly,
I transplanted them into 2 ft. of water and they are thriving now.These 3 trees are only 6 ft. tall and they are in 2 ft. of water so they are pretty tough little trees,Ryer

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John Wann #542878 01/11/22 03:59 PM
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Since it appears my 'renovated' pond, Crescent is going to hold water, I'm planning to plant Baldcypress along the Eastern bank in clumps of 4 or 5.

Found this thread and just thought I'd add to it. If others have had good luck starting them in water or otherwise - I've love to hear the techniques/results.


Note: in the fall the burnt red needles of the deciduous conifers (Pond Cypress in this case) hold longer than almost all the other deciduous trees in OH.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

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Last edited by Stressless; 01/12/22 12:23 PM.

8 Ponds in Mid-East Ohio, three streams that merge to 1.

Fishbowl Pond - 1.5 acre, family swimming hole, 22'
Figure 8 Pond - 1.25 acre, 12'
Crescent Pond - 2 acre 11'
John Wann #542879 01/11/22 04:45 PM
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I started my small bare-root seedlings on the water's edge and then raised the water level 6" per year for 2 years using a water-control structure. This worked well for me, but beavers cut a few down over the last 2 years. Beavers are gone for now and the stumps appear to have sprouted, but not sure how they will survive or grow after being cut off. Had no beavers for over a decade after building the pond, but then had some get in each of the last 2 years. Maybe the 2021 beavers could smell the past occupants?

FireIsHot #542880 01/11/22 05:08 PM
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Originally Posted by FireIsHot
I planted 8 bald cypress near my lake 7 years ago. Although they have all survived, they haven't grown well. I planted them in East TX red clay, and they don't seem to like that as well as the black clay here in the Dallas area.

Knowing what I know now, I probably would have planted them during the fall water drop, and then had them semi-submerged for a greater part of the year.

I can't believe I'm quoting myself from 10 years ago, but I was wrong. The 8 I planted near the pond have grown extremely well, and have turned into beautiful trees that have survived several extremely rough droughts. I've since planted another 7 in the water, and those are slowly growing at the same pace as the first bunch, so I expect them to well also. 4 of the 7 were planted in the pond, and they were planted with the water line just below the bottom limbs.

RAH, I've now had 4 of the cypress stumped by beavers, and all 4 survived. One, which was one of the original 8, has recovered and is approximately 70-80 percent of the size of the others. One in the pond has grown split trunks, and I decided to leave it alone. I've never seen one with double trunks, so we'll see how it goes. I wound up loosely wrapping all the cypress trunks with chicken wire, and all damage stopped. Very little effort saved them all.

Stressless and others, bald cypress do draw a good bit of water out of ponds, but for me, they're worth it. Beautiful trees.


AL

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FireIsHot #542885 01/11/22 07:29 PM
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Al, that is encouraging. I'd like to add a couple of cypresses, but have worries about beaver damage. Chickenwire sounds like a cheap, easy solution.


7ac 2015 CNBG RES FHM 2016 TP FLMB 2017 NLMB GSH L 2018 TP & 70 HSB PK 2019 TP RBT 2020 TFS TP 25 HSB 250 F1,L,RBT -206 2021 TFS TP GSH L,-312 2022 GSH TP CR TFS RBT -234, 2023 BG TP TFS NLMB, -160




John Wann #542906 01/12/22 11:15 AM
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Doing some research on the Baldcypress family - Pond and Bald Cypress, or Taxodium ascendens and Taxodium distichum.

It appears that Pondcypress - Taxodium ascendens grow better than Baldcypress when actually planted into the water/ past the ponds shoreline edge.

Quote
Native to stream banks, moist woodlands and seasonally flooded lowlands across the southeastern United States, the bald cypress (Taxodium distichum) is well-known for developing protruding "knees" or angular roots in mucky soil. The U.S. Department of Agriculture notes that seeds do not germinate under water and young seedlings eventually die if they are submerged longer than 30 days, according to the University of Florida. Therefore, plant young bald cypress trees at water's edge on firm soil or wait until a dry period lowers the water level. The seedling must establish in the moist soil with natural seasonal fluctuations of flood waters; only trees used to wet conditions over time readily survive constant submersion of their roots and lower trunk in water.

Wait to plant until weather and climate conditions favor the establishment of the newly planted tree. The USDA recommends air temperatures between 35 and 75 degrees Fahrenheit and winds less than 10 mph. The University of Florida suggests planting when the trees are dormant (no leaves present) such as in fall or early spring. Alternatively, wait until the water level drops so you can plant the tree in mucky or damp soil rather than submerged water.

Put on waterproof boots, such as rubber wader boots, so you can maintain sound and comfortable footing in the wet soil. Also wear rubber gloves since they help with grip and traction when handling the shovel or tree.

Dig a hole deep and wide enough to house the root ball of the bald cypress tree. Dig the hole deep enough so that the root collar -- the transitional area where the trunk widens/flares out into roots -- is at or just below the soil level.

Remove the bald cypress tree from the container and place into the planting hole. Wedge the mucky soil back into the hole and press it up against the root ball with your gloved hands. If you plant bare-rooted seedlings, you may need to make the hole slightly deeper and wider to accommodate all the roots since you don't want to bend or cram the roots into the hole. Make sure the tree is upright in the hole.

Water the planting area to saturate the soil. This helps eliminate air pockets in the soil around the tree's root ball and brings soil particles in direct contact with the roots. If the tree is flimsy and rocks in the soil after watering, add extra soil and tamp it down gently with your hands so the seedling stands upright.

Tips for Planting Bald or Pondcypress trees in water/to be in pond past shorline.

I am planning of putting a 8' 3/8" rebar just off the rootball to securly hold the tree upright utill it is established. 1-2 years. After that I'll either cut off or pull the rebar. My plan is to establish and have the root collar at the established High water line/overflow limit. and be a couple feet out from the shore's edge to provide shade and cover to the critters in the water.


[Linked Image]

As for Beaver - we've had beaver in the Fishbowl pond (with established Pond cypress) above, two different beaver lodges, and never had beaver gnaw any of the cypress. Which is astonishing as they chew on almost anything -- those big rodents seem to prefer the other trees I leave around my ponds... like yellow poplar.

[Linked Image]

Also - FireIsHot - notice the multi trunk on many of the cypress trees above... they are doing just fine, but, I do plan to remove smaller diameter trunks to make a single or double trunk next winter. I need to remove some 20+" diameter silver maples that are shading out the cypress this summer.


As stated the pond cypress hold their beautiful russet colored needles past most other deciduous trees - here's one of my Fav's from this fall.....

[Linked Image]

Last edited by Stressless; 01/12/22 12:27 PM.

8 Ponds in Mid-East Ohio, three streams that merge to 1.

Fishbowl Pond - 1.5 acre, family swimming hole, 22'
Figure 8 Pond - 1.25 acre, 12'
Crescent Pond - 2 acre 11'
John Wann #542913 01/12/22 01:35 PM
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It appears that "pond cypress" may only be hardy to zone 6. https://conifersociety.org/conifers...xodium-species-finally-get-some-respect/

John Wann #542917 01/12/22 02:35 PM
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RAH - Thx for that. A bit more info on that subject to be specific. The farm in OH is in 6a - note this USDA data is from recorded temps 1976-2005 so if you subscribe to Global Warming it might shift Northerly over the lifetime of the trees - much longer than anyone reading this post....regardless the proof is in the trees living and thriving in ENE OH.

Pond Cypress Information from USDA. USDA Plant Hardiness Zone Maps

Quote
Pond cypress is hardy in U.S. Department of Agriculture plant hardiness zones 5b through 9b, and is native to North America. Pond cypress can live hundreds of years and typically reaches heights of 50 to 60 feet or more.

[Linked Image]

Last edited by Stressless; 01/12/22 02:40 PM.

8 Ponds in Mid-East Ohio, three streams that merge to 1.

Fishbowl Pond - 1.5 acre, family swimming hole, 22'
Figure 8 Pond - 1.25 acre, 12'
Crescent Pond - 2 acre 11'
John Wann #542920 01/12/22 03:10 PM
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Here's a pic of a 8' bald cypress I planted 2 years ago. I planted it in the middle of my CNBG fry playground, and it's doing fine. It was shocked from the summer heat, and dropped every leaf within a couple of weeks of the planting, but by fall, it was back to normal.

"If" you want to plant these trees below the waterline, this is what worked for me. First, soak the root ball as best you can. If the organics are dry, it's almost impossible to sink them. Always plant the cypress with the bottom limbs out of the water. When you dig the hole, make sure you account for the depth that you plant the tree. If you plant the tree even with the soil line in the bucket, then you're fine. If you want to sink the tree deeper in the pond bottom, then account for that also. Whichever you decide to do, know that it will take weight on the root ball to keep the tree from floating, or swaying in the wind. The clay you remove from the pond bottom works fine. The 2 best options for digging the hole underwater, are either a post hole digger, or a round point mud shovel. The mud shovels are around $65-70, and are worth every penny. I also use mine for transplanting hardy water lilies, water iris, etc. Keep the clay you dig out adjacent to the root ball, because you probably won't be able to see it once the water muddles. Mound the clay around the tree trunk, then pack it down by slowly stepping on it.

Once the tree is planted, you'll still need support to keep winds from pulling the root ball out of the hole. What I did is to set 2 t posts(north to south) just outside the widest limbs, and GENTLY pull down on the tree trunk with bailing wire covered in an old water hose. Then I wrapped the whole mess in woven wire fencing. After the tree settles in, I'll remove the posts, and re-wrap the tree with chicken wire. This has worked well. If I plant the trees on the shoreline, then I just use one t post, since the tree won't float.

Fertilize the tree when planted. I use tree pellets from Forestry Suppliers, but any sinking fertilizer will do. Add the fertilizer to the hole, and not on top of the root ball.

I don't know if this is the right way to do it, but it's sure worked for me. Zero trees lost.

[Linked Image]

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Last edited by FireIsHot; 01/12/22 05:03 PM. Reason: ADD

AL

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John Wann #542921 01/12/22 03:24 PM
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This makes me realize that it is important to consider what size tree one is planting. Mine were bare-root seedlings.

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