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Russ
Do you think the BCP would be able to be Pellet trained in open water (without cage)?

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Originally Posted By: Bill Cody


Ok - for all you doubtors, I took 6 hydrated pellets and lightly formed them together to minimize air between each of the 6 pellets. I squeezed the enlarged pellet under water. Low and behold at least 5 or 6 small bubbles came out of the larger pellet. Now I suppose you want to see the video as proof.


No video as proof needed. I believe you. Perhaps you are right that the mechanism that causes the pellet to sink is removing the air.


If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.






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Tums -

Good question but unfortunately my experience (very little experience I'll add) is limited to caged BCP. I will defer to others with more background in this area however my opinion is that given open waters and a natural food menu, I suspect BCP would be difficult to pellet train.

- Russ

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Originally Posted By: Russ
I'm not exactly sure (and quite frankly scared) what direction this post will take next so I'm going to post quickly and retreat.

Referring back to Cat's post, my intent is to never release the crappie into my small 0.13 acre pond. The whole experiment was to see whether or not I could get black crappie to accept pellets. In my case that answer is yes. Your comment about flesh mass of BG vs BCP is interesting.

I'd also like to address a note I received concerning feed. From the date that I introduced pellets to the last week of October I figure that I used 16-17 lbs of feed.

With cooler temps of Fall and Winter moving in, I'm shifting my focus from BCP to the RBT I picked up from the hatchery yesterday. Barring any significant changes, I will update this post after ice out next spring.

I now return you to your (ir)regularly scheduled debate.

For all those that have commented, thank you !

- Russ


Russ,

I really am sorry I hijacked your thread. I didn't think it would cause the raucous it did!

Personally I believe any fish can be pellet trained if:

1.) They are crowded when small to make the feeding response competitive and there is nothing else to eat. (Raising water temps helps too).

2.) The feed starts out as soft, sinking, and palatable just like in nature, and there is something in the feed to stimulate the feeding response as in initially mixing in fish or krill products.

This can be enhanced through a selection process over a few generations and beyond, and those that are genetically predisposed to not feed train well are eliminated from the equation.

I also believe feed training fish that have come out of winter in a low or nonfeeding state is easier from my experience.

I have old aquaculture texts that say largemouth bass are next to impossible to feed train. Feed trained bass are the rule not the exception now due to economic reasons. More recently I've also heard others say redear are the same way, but at least two posters here have, or are, doing it. Bill Cody knows a fish producer that did also.

Bill Cody has had success feed training even adult fish which many say is next to impossible.




Last edited by Cecil Baird1; 11/06/12 04:08 PM.

If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.






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Hi Cecil -

As I'm sure you will agree, the hijacking that occurs on PB from time to time leads to some pretty interesting discussions. Your posts are greatly appreciated !

- Russ

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Russ,

Glad to hear there are no hard feelings.

One other thing to add about feed training that I've learned: Grade cannibalistic fish well and grade often! Even though I graded into two groups the 700 plus smallmouth fingerlings I started out with ended up being 123! Beautiful young of year fish with some in the 7 to 8 inch range but not a lot of them!

Next year I will be producing two or three times more and feed training them in 55 gallon drums! At least three gradings many four.

Last edited by Cecil Baird1; 11/06/12 04:13 PM.

If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.






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The larger sized fish that I've pellet trained were adult BG, GSF, and the others were not really mature adults but were 6"-8" LM and SMbass. I used basically the same methods that Cecil noted above.


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I just hope you can figure out a way to train the crappie so we all can have them eating pellets. That would sure make for a nice pond if you have pellet trained crappie to catch and eat.

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Within the next few weeks, I hope to have open water once again on my ponds. I'm very curious to see how the crappie did these past months while under the ice. My priorities are (1) weigh the fish and (2) try to get them back on feed.

In reference to question (1), weighing the fish will obviously require some handling. I would like to hear opinions on how to approach this while subjecting the fish to minimal stress?

Thanks

-Russ

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Originally Posted By: Russ
Within the next few weeks, I hope to have open water once again on my ponds. I'm very curious to see how the crappie did these past months while under the ice. My priorities are (1) weigh the fish and (2) try to get them back on feed.

In reference to question (1), weighing the fish will obviously require some handling. I would like to hear opinions on how to approach this while subjecting the fish to minimal stress?

Thanks

-Russ


Handle them when air/water temps are under 60 degrees or morts will be near 100%. Weigh a bucket half full of water and add several fish at a time, then subtract your starting weight (if your scale can't do tare weighing) unless you want individual fish weights.

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I'll second that! For some reason crappies are really sensitive to handling and very prone to fungus. I've even heard of folks only handling them after dark! Definitely use salt!

Last edited by Cecil Baird1; 03/20/13 08:19 PM.

If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.






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Thank you gentlemen.
Cecil, they will get salt but I suspect not the manner you are thinking.

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Originally Posted By: Russ
Thank you gentlemen.
Cecil, they will get salt but I suspect not the manner you are thinking.


???


If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.






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Cecil, I think he means after they're cooked.

Using salt in the water when handling them stimulates the slime coat and helps minimize stress.


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Also since your fish are already caged, try to minimize crowding and mover the dip net slowly so the BC won't get to agitated...be prepared for sudden jumping as they realize they are trapped.

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Cecil - I can't believe that one got by you but esshup covered it.

I will update this thread with the results.

Thanks

- Russ

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Originally Posted By: Russ
Cecil - I can't believe that one got by you but esshup covered it.

Agree, Cecil is usually really sharp.
For some reason, he's been a little dense in this thread.

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Originally Posted By: Yolk Sac
Originally Posted By: Russ
Cecil - I can't believe that one got by you but esshup covered it.

Agree, Cecil is usually really sharp.
For some reason, he's been a little dense in this thread.


shocked grin

My problem is if a thread is so long I usually don't bother to read the entire thing. wink

Last edited by Cecil Baird1; 03/22/13 08:03 AM.

If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.






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Good luck Russ. Take a few pics if possible.
















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Originally Posted By: Cecil Baird1
shocked grin

My problem is if a thread is so long I usually don't bother to ready the entire thing. wink

You've been a bit busy the past few days trying to coordinate seining too! 14.7F here @ 6:20 a.m.


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No seining today or tomorrow or for at least several days! The ice may be thick enough to ice fish again!


If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.






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Everything is still frozen up here.

Sure sucks for being this late in the season.

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You just got spoiled by the warm weather last year.


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Last year was nice..


I believe in catch and release. I catch then release to the grease..

BG. CSBG. LMB. HSB. RES.

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Originally Posted By: esshup
You just got spoiled by the warm weather last year.


We have another week of cold and snow coming up eek

Usually things are thawed out quite well by now, and the ground is soggy, which makes it easier to push trees over and rip the roots out of the ground at the same time.

Big problem tho, the ground is still frozen. I have not seen the ground freeze like this in many, many years.

Today was supposed to be really nice, but that didn't happen. Two of my brothers wanted to do some shooting today. I have a sand backstop to absorb projectiles, and that is still frozen mad

Kill the groundhog laugh

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