Pond Boss Forums STOCKING A NEW POND Types of fish to choose What's the skinny on Logperch?

I did a search here and it only popped with two posts.

It seems to me that they would be pretty good smallmouth forage.

They make use of deeper water except when spawning and it looks like the feed differently than most other forage species.

They also spawn later in the year than other fish, which would put some more tiny food in the food chain during the summer.

Has anyone put these in their pond?

Never even heard of logperch. Interested to hear the responses.

Omaha,
They're a large species of darter. Top out around the 6" mark. They do survive and reproduce in lakes as long as you have someplace sandy with little gravel. They produce up to 3000 eggs per female and they bury their eggs in the sand. They spawn in late spring/early summer. They usually live in water deeper than 4 feet and they eat insect larvae that they find by rooting around on the bottom like a pig.

I keep my eyes peeled during research to try to find possible new forage species that stay under 8" full grown.

Is this a logperch?



I was intrigued and did some quick reading and looking at pictures and it sure looks like it could be. The top fish, of course. Bottom fish is a creek chub. Both were pulled out of my creek this past weekend.

I am not expert enough to confirm your picture.

Just doing some continued reading and while logperch do spawn multiple times in warmer temps, they don't reach maturity till 2 years of age. Could be a negative in considering them for stocking as another forage option.

Lake Chubsuckers don't mature for three years and they're great. Once the first clss matures its all gravy after that. They would go in before the bass anyway.

I don't see logperch as something that could add much to a pond.

To the best of my knowledge, they are restricted from capture and transport in most areas east of the Mississippi, without permits.

The females only lay about 20-40 eggs at a time, although they can spawn multiple times per year.

They may be available as aquarium fish in pet stores. I expect that few fish dealers are stocking and selling them as forage. They would have to be trapped and transported -- and that will require a permit.

I'd be glad to hear of success. But, with so many other good species and sources of forage fish, I'd be surprised if they would ever become contenders in pond environments.

Ken

Omaha, the top fish in your pic is a Johnny darter which IMO is a possible pond forage candidate. I have stocked and had successful reproduction of the closely related tessellated darter in a few different ponds. They spawn in much the same way as FHM, but only in the spring and are far less prolific.

There are several species of log perch. I guess you could experiment and see just how particular their spawning requirements are. I suspect they would struggle in all but the largest of ponds with extensive sandy areas. Even then I seriously doubt they would successfully spawn. Much like WE, I think you will find it takes more than just sand but also wind swept areas to keep the eggs well oxygenated. The fact that they only spawn a few dozen eggs at a time, known as fractual spawners isn't a downside to me. Over a spawning season, they lay between 1,000 and 3,000 eggs. Fairly decent numbers. I believe there are other species of non conventional forage worth giving more attention to.

Thanks Travis! Was hoping you'd see the picture and give me your thoughts. Are they more elusive than FHM? What would be the benefit(s) of possibly putting some into a SMB/HSB/YP pond?

I share the same opinion as CJ about the fractional spawning. The fact that they bury their eggs was also cool to me. Them occupying deeper water was also another plus.

CJ, when you have the time it would be cool to read your top 10 list of unconventional forage.

I read an article, I forget which state did this, but they were trying to repopulate the native area. They were breeding the logperch in tanks. I thought, if they breed in tanks they would probably breed well in ponds.

Every pond is different. Some species that may do well in one type of pond would do poorly in another. Most non conventional species are poor options in ponds with LMb, especially if less than 2-3 acres.

I'm only looking for forage for smallies at the moment. I'm trying to avoid putting any other type of predator in the pond, such as pumpkinseeds, redears, yellow perch, or anything of that nature.

The goal is to fill the pond with a very diverse yet very non competitive forage base.

With reproducing smallies the pond will need good and maybe even extensive refuge habitat so the smaller forage items that are less than 5" long will be able to avoid predaton for numerous small SMB. Lots of YOY and 1 yr old SMB can cause a lot of damage to small forage fish. You won't believe the extent until you experience it. The other options would be A. to remove lots of swim-up fry before the schools get skittish or B. remove fingerlings with traps and seines which is more difficult IMO and experience.

Limiting spawning habitat for SMB is another option. That is the plan I am shooting for, but it seems SMB will find a way to pull off a spawn, especially when LMB are not present. Limiting spawning habitat however should help limit their spawning success.

Limiting spawning habitat was going to be one of my strategies. I feel like limiting spawning areas will do two things. Not only will it limit the amount of young produced, but it will also encourage only the largest fish to spawn. I would figure that the available areas would be dominated by the largest most aggressive fish.

I hadn't thought of removing fry. That is something that I will have to consider in management strategies.

Watch them feed.

They certainly would make use of food that would otherwise go unutilized in your pond. I am a big fan of converting unutilized food into SMB forage.

http://youtu.be/J9lpyBJWOyE

The challenge is getting the right habitat in a pond. Few if any ponds will meet that requirement. They are neat fish, but have been extirpated from a number of areas where they were native and predatory fish were later stocked, indicating they don't handle predation well.

CJ,

The only thing that I can say is, "we'll see".

I don't pretend to be an expert at this, and the only thing that you can really do is give it a shot and see if it works. What's the worst thing that happens. I end up watching my logperch population get exterminated when smallies hit the water?

I grew up on a farm, and have always enjoyed animal husbandry and will still have a good time finding a few and spawning them and establishing them in the pond. If the SMB eat them all then so be it.

I won't cry about it. It will just be another story in a long line of stories that I can laugh about when it's all said and done.

We only learn by experimenting. It's how I have learned about other non conventional forage fish... Where do you plan to source the logperch from?

I have only found them for sale at online aquarium suppliers. These are fish that are sold in groups of maybe half a dozen or so, and at ridiculously high prices.

However, that being said, if I can manage to get just half a dozen females to spawn successfully I should get enough logperch to grow out and be able to stock several thousand when the time comes.

That is the plan anyway.

Like I said, if the smallies eat the all so be it. LOL. Heck, for the prices that aquarium shops charge for these things I could make a small fortune LOL.