Pond Boss Forums GENERAL QUESTIONS Help Help - he's pumping out and won't stop!

Hi, I found your site by doing a search on "water rights on shared pond Texas" - the posts I read would have helped a great deal but that was "then" and this is now.

My elderly parents and my husband and I bought a 10 acre property that has a small pond/stock tank on it, it is oblong running east and west and our north/south property line goes through the middle of it. We are told it is "spring fed" somewhere from an underground source.

As you may know, here in Texas we are having a significant heat wave and drought. I just discovered that my neighbor has set up a pump and hoses into his side of the pond and is pumping for hours at a time (2 - 3), early morning and late evening. I placed a marker at the water edge 5 days ago and today the water has receeded from that marker by 13 inches. That is way too much for just evaporation, the temp isn't THAT hot! And he continues to pump. I can't manage to find him at home to ask him when or if he plans to stop. It also seems that if he sees me or my dad out and about down by the pond the pump sort of just happens to "turn off". I went back 45 minutes later and it was back on.

Does anyone know if a joint owner of half a pond has the right to pump it dry? or even to pump it until it is so low that it kills the fish? Yes, there are fish in it, catfish, some small bass and either little perch or crappie (not sure which). I'm not the fisherman, dad is. He caught a really nice cat out of the pond the first week we were on the place.

Any information would be a great help. Oh, my elderly parents and I are on "fixed" income so hiring a lawyer is pretty much out of the question. I'm just hoping someone knows if we actually have any rights to back up asking/telling him to stop!

Thanks

Kelly:

Welcome to the forum. I wish it was under better circumstances.

I don't have an answer for you, but there is a significant number of members here from Texas that can point you in the right direction.

It might be a until Monday before everybody checks in, but many check in during the weekend.

Lets see what they have to say.

Unfortunately, many times "sharing" a pond leads to problems.

Absent trying to NICELY talk to the neighbor...a lawyer is your only other option irrespective of ANY rights that may or may not exist.

It is VERY expensive if lawyers get involved, that is why I suggest trying to be as nice as possible even if the neighbor is a jack ass....if legal, you may want to tape record any and all conversations without his knowledge...just in case.

Why is he pumping? Farming or grass?

Thanks.

I have just today begun my photo record with my digital camera, so the pics are time/date stamped, to show the predations.

We have been here for about 7 months now and this neighbor seems to be a really nice fellow. Our only indication to the contrary is that he offered, without our asking, himself and his 18 yr old son to help build a fence down our common property line along the south 8 of 10 acres which we needed to continue to qualify for our AG exemption, and since I'm 60 and sort of crippled up with arthritis (besides being a "gurl") and my dad is 84 and in a lot worse shape than me, his offer was such a blessing that we readily accepted.

However, as our deadline drew closer and closer, the neighbor and his son were simply never available to help. Dad and I put up over 600 feet of field fence and another 700 feet of strand fence and we did it in 2 1/2 weeks of 101+ degree weather.

I have a small micro cassette recorder with a very powerful/sensitive microphone. Good suggestion to carry it in a pocket when I go to visit. Again, thanks.

I will check back regularly to see what other suggestions might be offered.

In reply to RAH's question: He is not farming on his property, and while I can't see where his hoses are going, about the only thing he could be using it for is to water his lawn around his house and buildings. His horses (2) have a metal trough with a pipe to it and his goats (3) have the same in their enclosure.

We have about 4 acres in coastal and have only taken one cutting, feeling that with the high heat and no rain, to cut it now would leave it to burn.

We do not have a separate well for irrigation and are not willing to use the well for the house for irrigating the hay lest we risk running it dry. It is supposed to be 285 ft and on the deeper, more abundant aquifer, but we are new here and just don't want to take the chance.

It is more than a little annoying to think that he is willing to sacrifice the pond, the fish, the ducks that nest there and our livestock that water themselves at that pond just to keep his grass green.

I asked to understand if you neighbor may need the water for his or her livelihood and/or to produce food. I think that, as others have said, it is worth sharing yoir concerns before exploring other alternatives. We irrigate our market vegetables out of our own irrigation pond which was built for this purpose, but wildlife habitat improvement is the prime objective on most of our property. I sypathisize with your situation.

I believe I would make it a point to catch him and have a talk.

I do not know the law regarding this type of situation. However, if this continues, it is apparent that he is harming you. You might contact your County Attorney just to get some sort of opinion.

You are both correct, thanks. I have my camera, my recorder and my walking stick and my most friendly, neighborly "hey how's it going? Was just wondering how far down you were thinking about draining our little fishing hole here?" (with a SMILE)

It's sad to see that type of event happening. Just for the heck of it I googled "water rights in Texas." I'm sure you have done the same already. The only way to get a complete answer would be to pay for a consultation with an attorney that specializes in water rights in Texas. I found several in my google search. Given that your property line runs through the pond and that he is using the water for livestock (goats) it looks to me like you may not have any legal method to stop what he is doing.

Background: Water Rights in Texas
The legal issues of water rights can be very complicated and difficult to understand. The following information does not provide all of the details involved in water rights, but does provide an adequate general overview. The “rules” regarding water rights depend on whether you are discussing groundwater or surface water.

Groundwater – Historically, the laws for groundwater have allowed the landowner to pump as much water from their wells as they choose. This is allowed even if the pump captures groundwater from other landowners. In 1949, legislation was passed that created Water Conservation Districts (WCDs). These WCDs generally attempt to conserve water through limiting the minimum spacing of wells,but many have the authority to actually limit well production.

Surface Water - Unlike groundwater, all surface water in Texas is owned by the state. Section 11.021 of the Water Code states: “The water of the ordinary flow, underflow, and tides of every flowing river, natural stream, and lake, and of every bay or arm of the Gulf of Mexico, and the storm water, floodwater, and rainwater of every river, natural stream, canyon, ravine, depression, and watershed in the state is the property of the state.” The state grants the right to use this water. With the exception of use, such as, domestic and livestock use, appropriated water rights must be obtained from the state before surface water is used.

If it were me I would call an attorney or two see if a one hour consultation would help you clear up your rights regarding the water use. As others have mentioned meet with the neighbor and discuss your concerns and hear his concerns. Perhaps you two can come to a mutual agreement regarding the pond.

Unless he has a farm business or uses goat milk or meat, the goats are not livestock, but rather pets.

That's why I suggested (twice) in the post above that an attorney be contacted. It seems as though Texas water rights laws are complex and confusing. Just look at this sentence... With the exception of use, such as, domestic and livestock use, appropriated water rights must be obtained from the state before surface water is used.

So does this mean that if the use of the water is "domestic" the water rights do not need to be obtained from the state? I don't know, I'm just a bean counter.

There is no substitute for a consultation with an attorney that has expertise in this area. All of the internet searches one can conduct and all of the amateur interpretations of this this law are simply not a good substitute.

That's what my point was.

And if I read the post on Tx rights correctly, it only pertains to stae waters that occur or are accumulated in NATURAL settings...it does not even pertain to UNNATURAL bodies of water such as a dug out tank, pond or lake.

Only and excellent lawyer will have a clue on any set of circumstances, but from all we have gleaned here before, iy GENERALLY seems a commonly owned body of water is available in it's entirety to all owners provided the land not owned by the user is crossed or touched to gain that access. You can own one foot of waterfront on a 100 acre lake and usually fish the entire thing freely if you enter the water on your foot of land...but as has been said...every state, locality and situation seems to be unique.

As many recall, Missouri constitutionally guarantees the access to a persons property, yet after spending $70K+ on a lawyer, 6 years in the court system and countless anger control management sessions, we are LEGALLY land locked in a state where land locked property can not exist.....go figger...Oh and as an aside, we only paid $55K for the 60 acres I am currently charged with trespassing on.....gotta love our legal system sometimes!


Kelly, I briefly give you a breif history of my land issue for this....You HAVE rights, but think long and hard about how important they are to enforce as there will be a price to pay, in friendship, effort, anger, frustration or huge amounts of money...Ask yourself, is my right worth the risk and cost...any outcome is NEVER gauranteed...as you see in my case the law was blatantly ignored, appealed, affirmed, and is now closed.

Old saying in Texas ranching: Whiskey is for drinking and water is for fighting over.

On my property I have found that the only rights I have are the ones I am prepared to defend. Once you realize that, everything changes and you start losing "friends" and gaining respect. Good fences make good neighbors and some now think I'm now an Ahole.

Naw! You remind me of a movie sheriff from an old dusty Texas town. Maybe you need to hire out your curmudgeonous attitude, and go help Kelly. It could be the start of a new and exciting career -- with lots of tall tales for the forum.

I have found that I can get my hands on all of the trouble I can handle right here at home. It's best that I don't stray. That way, I don't get "the look" from my old squaw.

Is there any nearby oil/gas development? If so, perhaps he is selling water. With water at a premium in drought-stricken areas, selling it to oil/gas companies for use in development or production is BIG ($$) business.

Well the owner of the pond and water sure as hell ain't getting rich! The drilling outfits don't pay squat for water! I should know because I'm dealing with this right now.

In my opinion, I believe the best start to resolving this would be to politely talk to your neighbor and perhaps the answer to the reason he is pumping out the water will surface. Sometimes we don't understand the circumstances surrounding someone elses actions unless we communicate. Perhaps his well dried up and needs the water for their use. In this case, is it the neighborly or right thing to make a stink out of the water missing or is it better to hold your words and lend a helping hand. As to the rights of the water, that's obviously going to be a delicate subject and a potential good neighbor or enemy could be the result depending on how large the issue becomes. I would talk to your neighbor and once you understand what the circumstances are, offer your concerns about the decreasing water levels and perhaps reach a fair and mutual agreement to benefit both sides as well as protect the water source. Best of luck!

I have had excellent service from the Texas States Attorneys Office in Austin. They are tax supported so you won't have a fee. They will point you in the right direction.

Good luck.