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esshup #244204 01/06/11 08:08 PM
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Although this is not a directional feeder it serves my purpose. I use aquamax 600 and it has never clogged on me.

http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/moultrie-6-1-2-gal-econo-plus-feeder.aspx?a=552646



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The directional is listed under their fish feeders. I would think that with Aquamax 500 being small it would work fine. I sent them an E-Mail inquiring.

Bing #244213 01/06/11 10:18 PM
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Originally Posted By: Bing
Originally Posted By: Bluegillerkiller
From what I've heard/read that's kinda common.. My question is how are you suppose to know what's getting ate in 15 minutes if it's all sunk? Sorry to but in on your topic..


My experience with AquaMax is that it floats much longer than 20 or 30 minutes. I am sure some of it sinks, but even an hour or an hour and a half later some is still floating.

Bing



Thanks Bing..


I believe in catch and release. I catch then release to the grease..

BG. CSBG. LMB. HSB. RES.

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I bought the Moultrie Feedcaster. Unfortunately it wont be running until spring so i got no info for ya smile


I believe in catch and release. I catch then release to the grease..

BG. CSBG. LMB. HSB. RES.

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Originally Posted By: Bluegillerkiller
I bought the Moultrie Feedcaster. Unfortunately it wont be running until spring so i got no info for ya smile


Put a big trash bag over it and fire it up in the garage! grin


www.hoosierpondpros.com


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3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).
esshup #244223 01/07/11 07:06 AM
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That's a good idea.. I do need to run a couple test runs..


I believe in catch and release. I catch then release to the grease..

BG. CSBG. LMB. HSB. RES.

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Originally Posted By: Bluegillerkiller
That's a good idea.. I do need to run a couple test runs..


Let us know how much a second

armednfree #244232 01/07/11 08:39 AM
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I'm moving the pond into my garage tonight aswell.. smile


I believe in catch and release. I catch then release to the grease..

BG. CSBG. LMB. HSB. RES.

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Hair and feathers are not digestible. Although, they are protein. I wouldn't feed that stuff.


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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You are what you eat. I don't want hair and feathers on my fish! grin


www.hoosierpondpros.com


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3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).
esshup #244347 01/09/11 10:01 PM
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Well, it's not actual hair and feathers, it's an amino acid extracted from those sources. There is also fat, no mention of the source. I would think that fat would act like an attractant and its source important. If it is say chicken fat than one would think it less attractive than fish based fats and oils, which are natural to the fishes environment.

But just speculating.

Last edited by armednfree; 01/09/11 10:01 PM.
armednfree #244349 01/09/11 10:19 PM
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I thought I would copy and paste this from Doc Griffin from this thread on fish feeds. http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=117414&fpart=1


Typical BG food




Catfish feed






MEG

Feather meal as a fish food protein source. There are two primary factors of protein quality for monogastrics (fish for this discussion) - 1) Amino Acid profile and 2) Amino Acid availability. The amino acid profile of feather looks pretty good if you look at the Total Sulfur Amino Acid content. It has a high content of cystine - a sulfur amino acid (SAA). SAAs can be limiting in monogastric diets and tend to be expensive to formulate into diets (they are relatively low in many inexpensive plant proteins). Unfortunately, the reason it is so high is because feather is a structural protein. The di-sulfide bonds between two cysteines make the protein very tough. This is what gives the keratins their structural rigidity - like our hair and fingernails. Unfortunately, this serves to make them very hard to digest. Therefore, as a rule, the availability is not so good. To increase the availability, feather meal is often hydrolyzed, this is an attempot to break down the disulfide bonds to increase availability. Shoe leather analyzes at 85% crude protein, but it is not digestible.

A word on protein sources.... Most protein sources are available in different qualities. This is particularly true for the expensive animal proteins - fish meal, poultry meals, blood meals, etc. Quality and freshness of the raw materials and the processing are factors that result in this variability. As examples:
A) Quality of Raw Materials: Meat meals are often priced on protein content - simply put, it is the ratio of bone (ash) to meat (protein). Bones (minerals, ash) are not as valuable as protein.
B) Freshness of Raw Materials: The US commercial fishing fleet for menhaden now has all refrigerated vessel storage.... the season is in over the summer, primarily in the Gulf of Mexico. Obviously, if it is not refrigerated....
c) Processing: Blood has a good amino acid profile. If it is drum-dried (essentially scorched on a extremely hot steel drum) it has poor availability and is a fairly poor ingredient. If it has been spray dried under low heat - it is an excellent ingredient.

High quality fish meal is the gold standard - it has the best Amino acid profile for fish (fish protein to grow fish protein)and is highly digestible. Further, it tastes great to fish (fish meal based diets are much more palatable to carnivorous fish) and it contains about 10% fish oil (high in omega 3 polyunsaturated fatty acids). Many other proteins can be used as long as they are formulated properly into an overall dietary amino acid profile.

Holler if you have questions. MEG

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ewest

Doc G can you give us some guidance on lipids (in pellets and or forage fish) as a necessary part of what carnivorous warm water fish (BG, LMB and HSB) need for winter survival ? Do most of them come from the fish meal (or fish oil in live forage) or elsewhere ?

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
MEG


Well, today I see that Yahoo has a story on the importance of omega 3 fatty acids for us humans. For most of us, the source is fish - salmon, tuna, sardines, etc. I have not seen the data - but, for winter survival, the idea is that fish oil is a fluid. This enhance membrane fluidity. This is often cited as a reason for the role of PUFAs with brain function/development. When the water gets cold, the fish get cold. Therefore, it stands to reason that these fats benefit the animals in cold conditions. If the overall fatty acid profile has too much saturated fat, their fat reserves will solidify in cold water - like tallow in cold water. These PUFAs are important in many other aspects besides the physical properties....

Predatory fish get these fats from the smaller fish they consume. They do not synthesize the long chain PUFAs. The source is from algae and these fats are passed on to algae-eating zooplankton and fish and move up the food chain. Menhaden are excellent sources of the omega 3 PUFAs, because they are fatty fish and about 25% of their fatty acids are the long chain PUFAs. So, in a prepared diet, you need either a significant amount of certain marine algaes, or fish oil or meal (approximately 10% of fish meal is fish oil - as a side note... this is because fish meal is mechanically expressed, so it does not get all the fat out. In solvent-extracted meals - such as soybean meal - there is vurtually no fat left).
















ewest #244355 01/09/11 11:44 PM
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I understand that but I have to question the percentage of available protein in that food. From what I read, the Aquamax 500 is far superior for predatory fish than just about anything else on the market. The feed I gave last year was more of a general feed and not targeted at a specific class of fish. The Aquamax 500 is targeted for optimum results at a specific class of fish, predators.

armednfree #244356 01/09/11 11:52 PM
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Originally Posted By: armednfree
Looking through the Nutrisource web sight It seems to indicat a mostly plant base. The only animal products listed are a protein from feathers and hair. That and maybe some fat with the source not listed.

It seems like the protein components are from a chicken processing plants scrap pile.

I bet when I start feeding the Aquamax 500 they go nuts over it.


Protein from feathers and hair, while protein, is not digestible!

Greg2010 #244371 01/10/11 10:04 AM
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armednfree and others for better understanding of the above post I made - AM is a Purina product. Doc Griffin (Mark Griffin PhD , MEG above) was the head nutritionist for Purina (fish foods). One of the products he created was AM Largemouth (it is based on RT [chemical mimic] as a top nutrition source for LMB). He has a few posts here which you should read very good info on fish foods.



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armednfree #244393 01/10/11 12:26 PM
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Here's my issue:

Quote:
To increase the availability, feather meal is often hydrolyzed, this is an attempt to break down the disulfide bonds to increase availability.



How successful is that attempt? D they really care how successful it was?


I'm looking at what I was feeding. It looks like dog food with just a few more feathers tossed in.

armednfree #244411 01/10/11 05:38 PM
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I would suggest not worrying to much on the fillers (feathers etc)and focus on the fish meal/oil as the fats/lipids/protein source for BG, LMB , HSB , YP etc.. I like Purina products and trust Mark to give good info. AM also includes feathers just as most do but the key is top quality fish meal/oil. There is a fish food links thread in the archives to many producers to compare. Have read and digested (no pun intended) quite a few studies on fish food/nutrition.
















ewest #244489 01/11/11 10:51 AM
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The problem with "off brand" feeds is finding out just what the protein is composed of. There is a feed mill about 60 miles North of me that sells very high protein fish food at a ridiculously low price. I called Mark about it and asked questions. Although he was very careful to say nothing negative about a competitor, he did tell me that his ingredient cost was higher than their retail price. That raised a red flag for me and I chose to stick with Purina.


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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