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Guys, I have a 2 year old pond which is around 1.5 acres in size and 12 ft. deep at the dam. A few months ago I started noticing these weeds growing around the edges of the pond only in the shallow parts. I was told to purchase 3 grass carp for the size of the pond and they would take care of it. First, I want to know what is the weed I have by looking at the photos and secondly what do I need to do to treat my pond to get rid of it? Someone told me the geese travel from pond to pond and bring these delightful weeds. Don't know if it's true of not. Can someone please look at the photo's on the link below and help me out? Thanks a ton!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/kellyjernigan


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You will get my standard, I'd like to help you out but response. Take a stem or two or the greenest or most live sample you can. Place that on an 8 1/2 X 11 piece of copy paper for background and size reference. The two water photos are impossible, and the tangled mess is tough. Just one stem or two crossing the paper. Once Id'd, I can give you an action plan or treatment steps.

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Ok, I can certainly get you some better photo's. Thanks for the quick response.

KJ


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Ok, I have some better photo's for you on 8.5 x 11 white paper. Hope this helps to identify the weed.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/kellyjernigan


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Take a look here, under submerged plants: http://aquaplant.tamu.edu/

Does anything look familiar? Are those globs on the plants part of the plant or globs of algae?


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3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).
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Looks like Southern Naiad (Bushy Pondweed) the most. All of the globs are part of the plant.

Last edited by KJernigan; 08/03/10 05:06 PM.

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Anybody got any ideas on what the weed is I have and how to treat it?

Thanks,
KJ


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KJ,

Is the weed really delicate and almost falls apart when you touch it ?

Our weeds look very similar and grows in huge masses then when it breaks the surface it starts to die off and decay but only the portion that breaks the surface.

I have found that if I rake it I can remove enough to make the pond visually appealing still but it leaves enough cover for the forage fish to hide. I personally like having them in the pond but they become a little unsightly when they break the surface. They provide excellent cover for forage fish and they will only grow until they run out of sufficient nutrients.




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Yes, you are correct. It is very delicate and some is really green and some is brown. I thought about raking it out of the pond and I also noticed the small fish love hiding and hanging out in it.


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I'm gonna go with bladderwort. It is actually carnivorous. It uses the small bladders to trap and digest aquatic organisms. It can be tough to control. More info here:

http://aquaplant.tamu.edu/database/floating_plants/bladderwort_mgmt.htm

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I was thinking ours was Naiad but not sure if it grows in our region. It looks an aweful lot like KJ's clump masses. Ours does'nt flower once it breaks the surface and is rooted. I believe Bladder is freefloating and flowers ?




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Yeah, it's doesn't look like bladderwort and doesn't bloom at all. The consistency is almost net like when you try to pull some out of the pond. It gets really thick and heavy to remove by hand. It is rooted and the closest picture I have seen yet is the Southern Naiad, but not 100% sure.

Last edited by KJernigan; 08/04/10 10:48 AM.

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Pond Frog can you help?


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Well I am in agreement that it is Southern Naiad (Bushy Pondweed)for the most part. Now the next step is how to get rid of it? What treatment option? Rake and manual labor, maybe?


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That is a very good way even though labor intensive. The reason is it removes the excess nutrients trapped in the weeds while grass carp and chemicals do not. The web links above have treatment options.
















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Ok, thanks for all the good feedback. Looks like I have a fun weekend ahead of me. Sure beats being at work! LOL


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As Bryan75 indicated, the specie shown in your pictures is definitely a bladderwort. Although similar in appearance, bladderworts are completely unrelated to, and differ considerably from southern naiad in regards to growth-habit and control-options.


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Thanks Kelly !!! Glad you are watching over us.

Guys you can count on Kelly's advice. Here is a control options page.

http://aquaplant.tamu.edu/database/floating_plants/bladderwort_mgmt.htm
















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I thought bladderwort eventually produces little yellow flowers? There must be over 200 species but Ultricularia are flowering.

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That is correct; small yellow blooms usually appear at some point in Utricularia's life-cycle. But, the bloom's presence may be short-lived - and often missed. The bladderwort specie shown below-right has a particularly unusual structure - which also displays the characteristic yellow-bloom; while the specie shown on the left is more commonly encountered (at least in my area).


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But this guy says it never blooms. If there was that much of it I Would think he could not miss every single bloom. I'm not there of course, but from my experience, you see it bloom.

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I am very curious and always wanting to learn new tricks of the trade. However I have learned identifying aquatic plants over the internet is not an exact science. How could you determine it is bladderwort for certain from those photos? I have a quickie pond dye and a turtle island resched to Sunday so I'll check back later.

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KJernigan - please email to me your images identified as "IMG_2679", "IMG_2675", "Algae 2" and "Algae 4" (I'm unable to extract them from your Flickr site).

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Thanks Eric. But, I wanted to download and enhance the images.
"All rights reserved by chanjernigan. The owner has disabled downloading of their photos"

I had to do an end-around to clip the below excerpts from the images in KJ's photo-storage site.
PF: Joseph DiTomaso, at UC-Davis, is a good source for all types of plant-IDs. He also has a great ID BOOK available.
It might prove interesting to email this composite image to him and see what he thinks.



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UC Davis is my number one source for much of my pond advice. I never saw those above photos before. They don't look anything like what he posted. They look like bladderwort. Obviously. But I looked though the dozen or so photos he posted and not one looked like those above. And the never saw flowers ever observation had me thinking otherwise. Interesting.

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Guys, thanks for all the posts. I am here to tell you I am walking around my pond, cutting grass, feeding fish, trapping turtles and just hanging out daily. I haven't seen any blooms, but not saying it won't happen. Kelly I will be more than happy to send the images to you if you are still having trouble getting them. I also will be more than happy to take more if you like. Thanks for all the help!


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I just sent you an email Kelly Duffie. I will send you some larger cleaner images when I get back home this afternoon from work.

Last edited by KJernigan; 08/06/10 12:22 PM.

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This is a great thread for me, because it can help me better work with customers as far as photo identification of plants. Not exactly a strength for me right now. Of course when I get to a pond in person, that is a piece of cake. But as this business involves I do so much more over the Internet an E Mail. Going to have to breakdown and get web page savvy, photobucket and facebook. Hate for the ol Frog to go swimming into the tar pit of old relic pond managers.

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PF iding plants from pics is not my strong suit. Very hard for me and never sure until plant is in hand and I can compare with written and photo evidence. On the other hand Kelly knows plants.
















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The composite picture posted above is comprised of cropped-sections from four images on JK's Flickr website. So, you've seen them before - but not from the same perspective.

To paraphrase the old saying, it is sometimes hard to see the trees due to the forest.

Since I couldn't download those images from JK's Flickr site, I had to "print" a pdf of each image-screen and then crop the section of the pdfs that displayed only key elements necessary for ID.

I made my original ID-assessment based on the population's growth pattern (upper-left), the bladders (which are unique to Utricularia spp), the stems' branching-characteristics (top-right) and the absence of flattened leaves (which would have certainly confused the ID with Najas).

PF: I sent the composite image to Mr. DiTomaso last night. I'll forward his reply to you.

I'll concede that plant-IDs from digital-images are sometimes tricky - especially when image-resolution and perspective is lacking. Tell-tail features are always the "key". Sometimes, they're present - sometimes not. I can't make a positive ID all the time, even after lots of practice. But, images are usually much better than phone-descriptions.

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Yikes, what a load of work. I'm basically an old school fool. I like to reach down in the pond, pull a handful of plants or weeds out, look, feel and smell. With a free consultation I usually can accomplish that. If there is something I am even in the least bit confused on I take it to my local aquatic plant store where a employee with a botany degree works. Beginning to cross the line of my job not being fun with the photo work. Not that I don't appreciate the efforts and rewards, just not my lily pad.

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The load of work (all 5-min worth) occured after the question "How could you determine it is bladderwort for certain from those photos?" popped up. It would have been much more difficult to convey the plant's tacit traits without enhancing the posted photos.
Incorrect IDs can often lead to improper treatments or management practices. From a herbicide standpoint, bladderworts are MUCH more difficult to control than Najas.

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For you it was 5 minutes. For me I would struggle for an hour. It is pretty much documented at this forum I am basically incompetent when it comes to working with photos. But I agree without the photo enhancement and the missed flowers I was heading down the wrong path. But since I am not going to be treating the pond over the internet, as soon as I reached down and grabbed a handful of the material up, I would know how to treat it. My business is not predicated on positive ID of plants from a distance. If it was, I would be best served like yourself becoming an expert with photo enhancement. I have zero desire to go that direction. I don't like working with photos, I do like visiting ponds and my customers on site. That is where my rubber hits the road. Or my frontline. If I ever felt my business was not fun and entertaining, I would stop it tomorrow. Playing with photos is not fun to me. Playing with ponds is.

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When a plant like bladderwort masses up there's swings and roundabouts.

On the one hand, it will produce dense cover for desirable fish to hide beneath when dastardly Mr. Heron comes calling in the Winter months. It may well smother and destroy undesirable submerged aquatic plants when it blots out the light.

Its dense cover will help shade and cool waters around the mid 70's where in hot climates water temperatures would get excessive, beyond the mid 90's

If you were to try to establish waterlilies, you might gain from setting vulnerable starts where bladderwort will crowd around, turtles find bladderwort impenetrable but waterlilies will grow through it...

On the other hand, that dense living blanket will become a trap for every bit of gunk (pollen, pine needles, leaf litter) and algae to choke the surface with a dense, well, gunky funky mass

When it masses up, because it is a rootless plant, its fairly easy to yank the whole lot to shore and just leave it to bake in the sun...

You could choose to 'manage' the situation by letting it mass where its foliage is beneficial, and reduce it where you don't want it by dragging masses out leaving relatively clear and open waters where you want them

Regards, andy
http://www.flickr.com/photos/21940871@N06/
http://s93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/adavisus/

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You guys certainly know your stuff. I got out their this weekend and starting raking it to the shore and using a pitchfork and scooping it up and putting it in the boat. Guess what, after about an hour of scooping I saw a yellow bloom sticking up out of the water. I spent 4 hours raking and getting this muck to shore and only saw 2 blooms. You guys nailed it as Bladderwort! I promise I couldn't believe my eyes as I have never seen a bloom anywhere before. Thanks for all the responses and dedication to my posting and helping me identify what I have in the pond. I believe I am going to leave a little for the fish to hide in.


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