Pond Boss Forums POND CONSTRUCTION Selecting a site Boat launch and dock construction

Alright, I couldn't take it. The dang surface looked so good that I just HAD to do something with it before it faded out. We grabbed a gallon of Wolman deck and fence brightener and scrubbed the entire surface to clean it last weekend. We let it dry all week; no rain. We went back today with the cordless random orbit sander and knocked off the grade stamps.
I did some due diligence on finishes. I listened to the forum ideas and looked thru the stuff at Menards and Homey. It starts to get like buying a bed mattress. Before my head exploded, I assured myself that I'm doing it again...making too big a deal and creating more work. I went to Menards and studied the PPG products, utlimately selecting the most expensive finish they had. For about $22 per gal., the Pittsburgh Paints Ultra Advanced Semi-transparent stain looked good. It's a water borne oil (acrylic oil); cleans with soap and water. To be sure, I called the PPG stains cust service and quizzed them on all their products. The said that the solid color is the most durable; I hate solid color stains for decks. OK, then the product I was contemplating would be the next best for durability in a semi-trans. Done. (you bet, Rocky-T...natural cedar)

You can see the difference between new PT and older PT. The stringer supporting the decking of the approach dock was installed last summer; we did nothing to prepare it...just slopped on the stain.
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I figgered the dorky blue tarp roof needed some help, so I put's up da no-trespassing bucket. I've been working the neighborhood on garbage day to find a corduroy couch so's I kin take in da view.
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Seriously, I rolled the stuff on and REALLY tried to time the passing of the sun so it wasn't in direct sunlight. Well, let's say that most of it was done in the shade. It's not my best work; kinda blotchy where I re-rolled previous work trying to blend and cover. Tuff! I'll letcha know how it weathers and wears for future deck builders.

Honestly, Brettski - I swear I can smell that stuff drying over the Internet!

Dang...it has been awful dry in the midwest. Because nothing is growing that was planted on the perimeter road, we decided to lug over the balance of the decent 2 x 6's to the dock framing at the sand beach. Yeah, 92 degrees, humid, and one helluva helper. I hope she keeps me.
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b'ski, yer pond water looks well on its way to being green and fertile......it looks really fantastic.....hope the fishies are doin good.

i dont miss humidity AT ALL.

Bski it is looking beautiful, I love the color the trees cast onto the water. Let me know how the clips hold up. How far are you from Pool level now?

Brettski,

Great pictures. It looks great with the finish and very, very inviting!!!

I am curious where you stay when you are there? Do you camp out? An RV? Hotel close by? Do you bring your tools with you every time you work on a project?

Sorry for all the questions, I'm just curious.

Eddie

Thanks, Dave and Rocky-T...it has really gone through some growth in many ways. Unfortunately, tho, the pool level growth hit a brick wall about 6 weeks ago when the water works dried up. The highest measurement I got was 25" short of full pool. This was directly after a significant rain event. Since it is a new pond, whenever we saw those sudden bursts of 6" - 12" of new depth, it always receded a couple/three inches within the next week or two. I attribute that to saturating the soil sponge. I haven't taken an official measurement, but my guess is we are about 33" short of pool (8" down from peak). The interesting thing we are experiencing is the water clarity. The chocolate murkiness is all but gone and I'll bet I have 2' - 3' of clarity easily. We are getting alot of weeds growing in the shallows. True to form the new weeds are comfortable in gradual slopes, but go to the same depth on a 3:1 and find zip. The FA is extremely minimal...for now.
The FH population explosion is well under way; schools of hundereds of little 1/2" 'ers. Dski was getting into the fish thing right at the concrete launch. She was in a trance watching the FH fry trying to hide from one of the fingerling RES (this is a VERY good thing; does my heart good). The bullfrogs are singing bari harmony to the jungle yell of the pileated woodpeckers. When we pulled up to the project last weekend to do the beach dock, there was a whitetail standing at the bottom of the sand beach, taking a drink at the water's edge.
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Yep, so far this pond stuff suits us fine.
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ooops; Eddie snuck one in while I was daydreaming the above post.
Our days are VERY long when we do our work. It is usually a one-day round-tripper, starting very early and coming home later that night. Yeah, we're nutz. The only camping I would do would be in a trailer; I'm too old for tent stuff. A trailer would cost too much, tho, cutting into the thin budget and halting more important development. We carry the tools each way. I have already taken out a permit for a substantial shed (purt near garage), but time and $ probably won't allow that this year. The county we are in is pretty particular about controlling mobile housing units and related. I'm not totally sure on how we're gonna get the larger structures done, but I foresee pre-fab wall panels stacked on the utility trailer leaving the principle home at sun-up.

Brettski,

Thanks, I sort of remember you mentioning those day trips, but didn't realize you did all that work in a day AND drove there and back!!!

Have you started mowing yet? Do you have a way to mow, or do you trailer something there?

I just upgraded to a used 7 foot finish mower for my tractor and it's the smartest, greatest, easiest and nicest thing I've come across. The four wheels on it follow the ground and all I have to do is steer the tractor. No messing with deck height or scalping the ground with my bush hog.

My concern is that the weeds were getting too tall and crowding out my grass. The more I keep it mowed, the better my grass should do. So far, it seems to be working, as my grass is really starting to take hold in some areas.

Eddie

The only mowing equipment we have is a garden tractor with a 50" deck. It is absolutely perfect for the walking trails thru the woods and the 26 gal pull behind tank sprayer is the icing on the cake. It is, tho, pretty labor intensive for open spaces with anything deeper than a foot or so. If it ever rains again and the 5 some acres of native grasses and wildflowers that we drilled begin to grow, this will have to be maintained. It ain't gonna be garden tractor work. I've mentioned a very good neighbor and friend that farms in the area. He has already warned me to avoid use of a bush hog or any type of rotary mower when the time comes. Rotary mowers create clumps and windrows that can choke the grasses and flowers underneath. He highly recommends use of a flail mower. He can handle either mowing situation for us, but will use the flail for the grasses/forbs. I chalk this stuff up as paid lawn maintenance and gladly accept the invoice. It's a nice break in an already fully loaded development schedule.

Brettski:

I mow my prairie grass with my rotary mower...just need to do it often enough that it doesn't "windrow" too bad. Doesn't seem to bother the wildflowers, either...

Given possible wildlife habitat & preservation aspects, how many times a year are you going to want to mow?

Regarding the 5-some acres of grasses and forbs, the first mowing can't be before something like July (pretty sure it's July; based on making sure all the hatchlings have left the nest). The NRCS guidelines have it defined...I'll double check. Anyway, I doubt that it would be much more than once a year. I don't fully understand all of it, but I rely on trustworthy dialogue with not only my farmer pal (who happens to manage a 400+ acre hunting preserve) but a super relationship with my NRCS agent. All this, and I still get nervous when they talk about the prescribed burn in a couple of years...

Once a year mowing will take heavier gear than weekly; where your 50 inch cut garden tractor could handle 5 acres if you spent the time to get it regularly, IMHO it sure wouldn't handle the growth through July. You might see what kind of an hourly (or better, per acre) rate you could get from locals for mowing it off, IF a once a year mowing will be your only use for the equipment.

OTOH if you will have (and why wouldn't an enterprising guy like you indeed have) other uses for a 24-40 hp tractor, the cost of a mower to put on it wouldn't be too prohibitive. Plus you could use it for mowing around the ponds, paths through the woods, etc., more often.

Brettski:

Here's how it works.....

General pasture grasses are "cool season" grasses (brohme, etc.) and grow tall and quickly early in the spring. You have to keep it mowed back to less than 8-10 inches or so. This allows sunlight to penetrate to the soil, as your prairie grasses, forbs, flowers and such NEED sunlight to germinate. Natives are "warm season" grasses...

After 2-3 years, if you keep up with it, the natives can outgrow the coolseason grasses, but if you let the brohme go, it chokes out the stuff you planted.

After 2-3 seasons, the root system of the natives are established enough to take SEVERE heat (from burning) and if you wait late enough in the spring, fire can help to kill to stuff you don't want, but won't hurt the natives. Timing is critical...around here, the counties burn in mid-late May or early June. One 80 acre patch is burned every year and they put in the local paper beforehand. It's done at night and folks drive a long way to watch - pretty spectacular...wind put the kibosh on that this year.

NRCS can really help you with the timing. I'll burn my first patch next spring, probably. Watch for the smoke...

Thanks, Matt...
Details of the exact plantings are on this thread at the bottom of the page . The vast majority of this new planting is warms mixed with forbs. There are 3 much smaller pockets of cools that will be overplanted with bird-friendly deciduous bushes next spring. I'm told the warms and the forbs may not be very impressive this year at all, but I will have to cut back to help keep the weeds at bay. My farmer pal is the neighborhood firestarter. When the time comes, I'm workin' with him.

I don't think I've added my compliments yet. That's a very nice pond Bski.

Wonderful Brettski. Don't be shocked if they do better than predicted.

Planted mine last spring (early) but I had BILLIONS of wildflowers last summer. Hope they do as well this year...don't know, but we got 5.5" of rain day before yesterday, so hope all's well at home...I'm in Orlando, at a conference since Wednesday, and won't get home til week from tomorrow.

OK...enough of the vegetation stuff. Let's talk lumber.
This is the first time I have worked with pole barn type stuff; CAKE. Fortunately, the trusses were small, so they were easy to handle. The rest of it is mostly a matter of lining and squaring everything up, then kick it into production mode. You pole barn guys know the story.
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The rake and the the eaves will be PT 2 x 6. I was too danged tired to concentrate on that stuff, so it'll have to wait 'til the next trip. Besides, it's gonna be a pain getting to the pond sides; still not sure of my plan.
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As mentioned in a previous post, there will be a 24" overhang around the entire perimeter of the 14' x 16' deck.
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I just love that wooden roller coaster look...

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The only questionable engineering decision I made was to use a standard galvanized hurricane rafter tie plate to secure each of the trusses to the supporting beams. Those beams are made of that new PT lumber; AC2. I did use 1-5/8" stainless screws instead of nails, but I wonder if the actual plate surface will be negatively affected by the PT lumber? I had a bunch of those rafter tie plates left over from another job, so they now have a new home. I figger if I have to, I can run the SS screws out and replace 'em later, down the line.

BEAUTIFUL diagonal bracing on the bottoms of the tops of the trusses, Brettski. Have you considered adding another set of diagonal braces on the tops of the bottoms?

Very nice Brettski. I can't wait to see the roof on it.

Is there going to be soffit underneath?

Interesting framing on the roof. Are you putting a metal roof on it? The purlins are for metal roofs, but there's no reason for so many trusses, or them being so close together. Did you do this for the ceiling?

Are you sure about the preasure treating on the beams being the new formula? The last I heard, they only switched over the 2x6's and smaller lumber, but left the larger stuff original.

I'm suprised that you'd put in a flat ceiling. Is that correct?

How are you going to light it? Will there be a ceiling fan?

It's an interesting look with the gable ends on the sides. Will you put gutters on with downspouts to keep the water away from the walkway?

Thanks for the update and pics,
Eddie

...once again, thanks for the moral support, guys!
Theo notes and asks: At the risk of potentially biting on a rubber worm made by the Gallus incredible edible machine, I will respond. "Huh?"...Do you mean a diagonal across the tops of the ceiling rafters?
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Mr Freeze queried:
It's not part of the immediate plan, but the option remains available.
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...and of course we can always count of the president of the Texas chapter of DIY Intl to buzz a passel of questions ( ) as Eddie asks:
Nope, no ceiling...same as the soffits. Just another mega-structure from the president of the Illinois chapter of Over-engineered LTD.
Yeah, all the Menards PT is AC2.
Ah yes, the same issues Franklin and Edison faced. There is no power to the property. I am working on a massive kite as we speak.
I will probably pass on gutters, or even a short section directly over the entrance dock. I believe it's function will provide less value than the clean look of it's absence.

Yes - diagonal bracing on the tops of the bottom boards in the trusses.

You may want to add the ceiling Eddie was talking about after you see what all ends up living in the open truss space. Or maybe birdlime is a favorite encounter for birders. You are building heavy enough to hold it up no problem, IMHO.

Brettski,

I'm going to build a gazebo next to my lake and have the same problem of not having any electricity. I'm optimistic that one day this will change and will build the gazebo with lighting, a fan and electrical outlets for the day it actually happens. I might even use my generator if I can put it far enough away to be quite and still run an extension cord to the gazebo for power.

It's always easier to include the wiring when your roughing in the building then to add it later.

Eddie

Man, can I lay out a great 4th of July vacation or what! I mean, what could possibly be more fun than framing and covering a roof? Guys like Theo, Eddie, Jeff Gaines, and Ahvatsa know exactly what I mean. Who needs the Polynesian resort when ya gots nails, screws, PT wood, and sheet metal? (more evidence that payback will be a b**ch)
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We opted for the snap lock metal roofing panels from Menards. The cost was about 20% more than their premium screw on roofing. It made more sense since the job is so small. Besides, the panels are 17" wide; cake to handle. They showed up at the store in a killer wooden 2 x 4 crate. Very impressive shipping container. There were 30 of 'em, all pre-cut to length. We spent alot of time keeping the roof framing square. It paid back big dividends. One roof ran perfectly true; the other ran off by .250" at the opposite end. The only fasteners that are exposed are the 2 screws at the eaves in each panel. All the others are covered by the snap seam and the ridge cap (oh yeah, there is a row of screws that run each side of the ridge cap at 16" OC, buzzed thru the snap seams and into the framing below...and a row securing each of 4 rake pcs). Anyway, the snap locks are very cool; very easy.
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The gable ends overhang by 24", but I was still concerned for driven rain hitting the outside truss members at each end of the framing. We covered those opposing, outside trusses with 1/2" OSB and sandstone colored vinyl siding. We selected Forest Green for the metal roofing color. It's a few shades lighter than the ever-popular emerald green and D-ski picked it out. Hey, works for me.
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These pics are at the end of another very long day. The sun is just setting behind the trees, so this pic is almost dramatic. D-ski says it looks computer generated for the blue reflections. I kinda like it.
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...send rain; need about 3 more feet of depth.