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#18014 07/06/03 09:18 PM
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Don't recall seeing any discussion on freshwater shrimp on this board. Has anyone used them for forage? Are they available commercially? When we duck hunt in North Dakota some of the potholes are literally full of shrimp. They coat the bottoms of our decoys. I would think that they would be tremendous forage for bluegill perch and other small fish. Is there a reason they don't work?

#18015 07/07/03 06:18 PM
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I have had grass shrimp in my ponds for many years. They are great for all fish including fingerling bass. They are my #1 bait for all panfish. The only problem I have had is it is hard to get them established in smaller ponds. They get eaten so fast it is unreal. If your going to stock them in a pond i recommend you stock ahead of the bluegill by 2 months. This gives them some time to spawn and get established. Then proubly every year 2 to 3 times a year go dip net some from these holes you say and put them in. Once you get them going in larger lakes its hard to get rid of them. Make sure that your pond has brush and water plants for spawning and protection.


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#18016 07/07/03 08:46 PM
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I would be very intrested! Maybe Shawn, Greg, Bill, Jb, Dave, know of a source? Anyone?
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#18017 07/08/03 11:44 AM
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Here is a link with some good information. I'll continue looking for a source.

Scuds

#18018 07/08/03 02:45 PM
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I've got a friend that know a ton about growing shrimp in fresh water. contact Steven Patrick at stevep@uga.edu

he is the aquaculture specialist for the extension service here in Georgia. real smart guy, knows his stuff

#18019 07/08/03 03:09 PM
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SHan is right. Here is his link to tons of info on freshwater shrimp. http://county.ces.uga.edu/habersham/aqua/prawn.html


Greg Grimes
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#18020 07/08/03 08:36 PM
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Shan & Greg, thanks for the information on the shrimp, my original post was asking a question regarding scuds (less than one inch) for fish forage. Most of the information I've found relates to prawns for human consumption, which would probably not be viable in Michigan. I believe that hyella and gammarus are different species. I'm curious if the reason we find the high populations in North Dakota potholes is due to a lack of fish in these waters. Has anyone successfully introduced them to a pond as a forage source? Thanks again, I'll review the above information thoroughly.

#18021 07/08/03 08:54 PM
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Steve,

Not sure the reason they are so common in potholes is the lack of fish. I icefished Devil's Lake North Dakota and it was full of them too. But then again the large water may allow many to survive predation. It seems Dave Willis should know something about them as he is from South Dakota. Dave?


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#18022 07/09/03 09:23 AM
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I have some very small freshwater shrimp that are not hyella shrimp or gammarus shrimp. They only grow to about 1 inch and look exactly like the saltwater shrimp you eat.

Anyone know the exact Scientific name for these shrimp? I would like to look them up and find some more info on the web.

I have seen this kind of shrimp mostly in East Texas lakes. I have caught them in my minnow nets at Caddo Lake and Lake Fork.







#18023 07/09/03 05:11 PM
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GHi Cecil. I'm not an expert on the Gammarus, but I'll pass on a few comments.

We do find a lot of the Gammarus in the wetlands up here (SD, ND, and MN). The more fish in a wetland, the fewer the Gammarus.

In our fishing lakes, they do persist with sport fish populations, but not nearly in the same numbers as in the smaller wetlands. However, our food habits studies with yellow perch certainly showed that the perch will find and eat the scuds!!

In sport fishing lakes, I'd say the most scuds (Gammarus) that I see are in the lakes with some submergent (rooted) aquatic plants. I suspect the plants provide some refuge from predation, and that keeps the scuds at a more moderate level. Lakes with a 15 or 20% vegetation band have more scuds than the lakes with 0% vegetation (lakes that tend to be more shallow, windswept, and/or have lots of common carp).

I'd say that in a pond with submergent vegetation, scuds would be a good supplemental food source, although they wouldn't support panfish by themselves. I'm sure that small bass, bluegills, and yellow perch would love them (hopefully not so much that they disappear from the pond).

I have never specifically stocked them into a pond without them, and then tracked it to see what happens. Which, of course, makes me wonder right now why I didn't do so!! :-)

Dave


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#18024 07/09/03 09:21 PM
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I have the same shrimp as Al Kohutek. I guess they are just in in texas because that is the only place i've heard of them at.


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#18025 07/09/03 09:23 PM
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For Lk Vilbig; Al K.: There are two freshwater glass or grass shrimp and two marine/brackish water small 1"-1.5" shrimp that could be in your area. Most likely you have the fw Palaemonetes kadiakensis. Other possibility is P.paludosus both the fw forms. P.paludosus is common in FL.

The scuds Hyalella and Gammarus are not only different species but they are different genera. The two most common species are Gammarus fasciatus and Hyalella azetca. There are nearly 100 species in this group of amphipods. Hyalella is about three times smaller than G. fasciatus. I typically see Hyalella in nonchemicalized ponds but rarely see G.fasciatus in ponds with high fish numbers. I think that G.fasciatus is easier prey than Hyalella due to size. I've tried to introduce G.fasciatus into a weeded pond twice and so far no noticable survival. Whereas Palaemonetes have survived well in the pond.
ARE THERE ANY READERS OF THIS THAT HAVE ENOUGH NUMBERS OF GRASS SHRIMP TO SELL A FEW? Please provide a name and contact information for those that would be interested. Thanks a lot.


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#18026 07/14/03 10:34 AM
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Thanks Bill. I looked these up and the Palaemonetes kadiakensis looks like what I have caught in my minnow nets.

Thanks again,

Al







#18027 07/21/03 05:44 PM
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Anyone have an idea where to obtain some for stocking a new pond in Illinois?


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#18028 08/17/03 04:14 PM
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Back to the top... My 10-12 acre pond will likely be completed within a couple weeks. I'd like to stock it with shrimp, crayfish and fathead minnows. I can get the fathead minnows lots of places. Anyone know of anyplace that sells the shrimp and crayfish?


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#18029 08/17/03 07:38 PM
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Rangersedge,
Don't know about the shrimp .. I would love to have some too. Hope you'll post any leads here!
Cecil Baird had a post Jan 2nd 2003 under [Questions and Answers] Topic [Crayfish dealer in Ga.] he lists several dealers.
Ric


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#18030 08/19/03 12:29 PM
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I think that Ken's fish farm sells them.
www.kens-fishfarm.com
Dont see them on the website, but I still think they were in his book.


Nick Smith
#18031 08/22/03 11:59 AM
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I went to that website and called Ken's, but the person answering the phone indicated they got out of the shrimp business a couple years ago...

Still very interested and looking if anyone knows of a source...


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#18032 08/27/03 11:18 PM
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Well... I may have discovered a source. Are "Ghost Shrimp" the same thing? If they are, my local WalMart supercenter has them in the aquariums / fish department for 28 cents each. The label said 74-78 degrees. If they are the same, is it safe to assume that they would survive the winters in South Central Illinois and in the slightly muddy water of a new pond? Also, how quickly do those rascals reproduce? I'm thinking they'd better put rabbits to shame if I hope to have an adequate supply for forage in my pond without going broke.


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#18033 08/28/03 05:22 AM
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Here is the guy who put Ken out of the shrimp business. www.gafreshwatershrimp.com

#18034 08/28/03 02:42 PM
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Bill: Thanks, but from the pictures and weights, I think he is talking about prawns that get fairly large and are sold for human consumption vs. the 1" to 1.5" grass shrimp I was wanting for fish forage. Of course, I may be and often am wrong... ;\) Jeff


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#18035 08/28/03 08:25 PM
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I am pretty sure that ghost shrimp are the adult stage of brine shrimp. Brine shrimp are not the same as grass or glass shrimp. I will try and check this out on Google and return later.


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#18036 09/02/03 09:21 PM
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WOW! Be careful what you get from the Wal-Mart pet shop. On Googgle I found at least five different genera (scientific names) of shrimp that had common names of Ghost Shrimp. The small fish food shrimp you want for pond stocking have the genus name Palaeomonetes as noted in the above posts.

Also, I found that adult brine shrimp do not appear to be called ghost shrimp.


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#18037 09/03/03 05:12 PM
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I found this posting for "glass shrimp" on e-bay. Bill Cody is this the type folks are looking for?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2344367378&category=20759

kevin b

#18038 09/03/03 09:35 PM
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The eBay glass shrimp was Palaemonetes pugio. P.pugio and P. intermedius are marine and brackish water glass shrimp. I "assume" these are also native to the deep south.

The glass shrimp most common in waters from southern Ontario to northeast mexico is: Palaemonetes kadiakensis. I have these growing in one of my ponds in NW Ohio but I don't have enough of them to sell. The fish population keeps them thinned out too much.

Macrobrachium ohione - River shrimp:
This is also another freshwater shrimp which would live year-round in ponds from Eastern Texas north to southern Michigan. They occur mostly in shallow wetland & backwater areas around the Mississippi drainage system. This shrimp is bigger (3"-4"long) than than glass shrimp (1"-1.5"). At 3"-4" long these would get big enough to clean them and have "popcorn" shrimp. These larger shrimp are called Macrobrachium ohione or "river shrimp". Since they are larger they may not do well in ponds with a large fish population; fish would probably prey hard on them.


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