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Thank you sir.

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Russ I think some 3" yellow perch will swim through 1/2" plastic mesh esp if they loose some body weight. I would trust 1/2" mesh to contain uniform sized 3"BG but not 2" BG which have a body height of 15mm +/-. 1/2" mesh on the diagonal runs about 15mm and assuming there are NO gaps in the cage seams. I have measured a skinny 3.1" YP as having a 14mm body height.

Last edited by Bill Cody; 07/19/08 03:11 PM.

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As always, thank you for the information Bill. I should be receiving an aquaculture sample pack(netting) next week. By the end of the week, I hope to have my order in. As an FYI, I measured up some of the neighbors kid's hoola hoops and they were a convenient 3' diameter. For top frames, I thought about doubling them up to add some rigidity that is until I found some 1" i.d. black plastic well pump pipe I had lying around. With a plastic barb fitting, the black pipe may become the top frame of choice. I will post the outcome.

Russ

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Russ - the 1" dia black plastic pipe will provide a more rigid hoop than a hoola-hoop. At times getting 1" plastic pipe to form a 3ft dia circle without kinking can be a challenge. Warming it in the hot sunshine may help it bend to a small circle.

Last edited by Bill Cody; 07/19/08 09:40 PM.

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One man's meat is another man's poi, son.

I have a bunch of used 1" black plastic pipe in my back yard in 3' - 5' circles that I need to get straightened out! \:D

Last edited by Theo Gallus; 07/19/08 11:07 PM.

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I need to revisit this thread with a question for Bill, Cecil or anyone using cages. Some quick pond vitals.. 0.13 acres, avg depth 10' aerated nightly april/may to october, NY zone 5. Well water available.

Bill, in reference to your articles in PB magazine, I have yet to locate any polyethylene twine for stitching up my cages. All the local hardware/farm supply stores have polypropylene. Is there an equal substitute to polyethylene that anyone can recommend?

2nd question is one that pertains to water temps and lends itself to precaution on my part. I will be experimenting with raising YP in one cage, low density 20-25 fish, fingerlings. I do not have a temp profile for my pond in the 3-4' depth range (cages will be 3' diameter x 4' deep). Betting on a normal summer as far as temps go, can I expect to see a problem with water temps mid-summer that may result in stress/death for the YP? As noted above, I do have access to a well within 30' of where I intend to locate the cages.

All thoughts are appreciated.

Thanks

Russ

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Russ - any of the poly twines should work okay. Cecil does not use twine he uses plastic wire ties to assemble cages. All the younger perch up until they are about 12"-14" seem to tolerate warm water (to 90F) well. Young YP 3"-8" long will or should eat well all summer long in cages, at least I never had a problem with mine. It is just the biggest ones that don't tolerate temps above 82-88F real well. Send me a PM with your address and I can send you some twine, just you pay the postage.

Last edited by Bill Cody; 02/05/09 05:34 PM.

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I concur with Bill the wastebasket model cage king. I had perch up to 10 inches in two cages last summer with no problems. However typically once I can sex them for sure I release the females into the pond.

Yours truly,

The one that prefers the dumpster model cages.



Last edited by Cecil Baird1; 02/05/09 09:43 PM.

If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.






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 Originally Posted By: Bill Cody
Russ - any of the poly twines should work okay. Cecil does not use twine he uses plastic wire ties to assemble cages.

Bill, how about plastic baler twine? That's readily available at farm-supply places and dirt cheap if you need anough of it to buy the 16,000 feet minmum purchase.

When I build cages (I need to get my deepwater docks finished first to have good places to anchor them), I plan on using insulated 12 gauge copper wire to hold the webbing on. But I have lots of it left as residue/salvage from wiring jobs.


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Plastic baler twine does work. I think it has a little different chemical composition than what I normally use becasue it does not melt as easily to make it so it does not unravel. I suggest that you use anything that works well for your needs. I think the most important feature of what you use is that it holds up well in the water and when exposed to UV light. My twine has been in use for 10-12 yrs and it still is in good shape.


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Thank you all for the replies!

Cecil, have you noticed any degrading of the cable ties over time?

Russ

Last edited by Russ; 02/06/09 03:32 PM.
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IME white cable ties break down when used outside. The black ones are supposedly UV resistant, but I only have about 6 months of experience with them so far.


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Theo is correctamento. I have run many a coaxial cable on ships, and the standard practice is black, UV resistant(or, stainless). White ones will get brittle and break in short notice.


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 Originally Posted By: Russ
Thank you all for the replies!

Cecil, have you noticed any degrading of the cable ties over time?

Russ


Not really and I use the black and the white colors. However every year I go over the cages with a fine tooth comb before I put them in the water. If I find any damage or weakness it's replaced. I have found out if their is a hole fish will find it! I also try and change out the fish into a newly cleaned cage once a year and clean the old ones with a power washer for the next change out.

My cable ties aren't really at stress points though. The only real stress points are where the jugs are attached for flotation and I use nylon rope for that. The nylon rope also does not cut into the cage material like the cable ties would where the jugs are attached. I do know however the nylon rope will eventually get weak over time if it is continuously submerged.

Last edited by Cecil Baird1; 02/07/09 01:03 PM.

If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.






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There is a UV resistant grade of cable Tys available at our home centers. Cheap insurance.
I haven't seen this for a long time, but there is a type of cable ty that has a tiny steel clip embedded into the wratchet joint. I don't know that it is stainless steel; kinda doubt it. If it's plain old carbon steel, uh oh.
All the cable tys I see now are using nylon wratchet mechanisms molded in.

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there was a time when there were only a few brands and quality of ty wraps. Thomas and Betts with stainless inserts for holding strenght were the best. They were made of nylon. Not cheap.

Now it is a roll of the dice as to what you get. I have gotten some that would break with just hand pulling to tighten. If you find a good one, stick with it.


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 Originally Posted By: burgermeister
there was a time when there were only a few brands and quality of ty wraps. Thomas and Betts with stainless inserts for holding strenght were the best. They were made of nylon. Not cheap.

Now it is a roll of the dice as to what you get. I have gotten some that would break with just hand pulling to tighten. If you find a good one, stick with it.


Wouldn't surprise me if they are all made in China now. Probably bad quality control.


If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.






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Aside from building the cages, I've got a question pertaining to feed. I'm going to approach the local Agway dealer about ordering a bag of Aquamax, since it is not an item they normally stock. With the number of fish I plan to grow out, 20-25 BG and YP fingerlings (seperate cages), could someone recommend a pellet size that would cover me for the feeding season, April-October. I would guess that if I start with a small pellet, I could make a bigger nugget, as the fish grow, by mashing the pellets together.

Thanks

Russ

Mods, if this question is more appropriate someplace else, please move it.

Last edited by Russ; 02/09/09 03:07 PM.
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Russ, it depends on the size of the fish when you get them and how big you expect them to get in the cages. If they are 2 inches long, I think Purina Game Fish Chow would work.

If they are 1 inch, Aquamax makes some fry pellets. However, some of them sink, so would be lost. That shouldn't be a problem with that small number of fish. There are an awful lot of tiny pellets in there. Actually, my larger BG like them pretty well.

BTW, I know nothing of YP but figure they would eat the same pellets as BG.


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

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Dave,

Relying on the advice mentioned in the PB articles, I'm going to stick with Aquamax for the high protein. I'm hoping to serve both fish from the same one item menu. As for fish size, its open right now until I get a better handle on what will be available this spring.

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If you get 2-3 inch BG & YP fingerlings, they should be able to eat (floating) Aquamax 500. That's 40% protein. IIRC some of the smaller, sinking sizes are a little higher %.


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Thanks Theo

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Match the size of feed to the size of fish. YP have larger mouths than the same length BG. A good rule of thumb is to feed a pellet that is the same size as the fish's eye. If you soften the pellets then the next larger size pellet can be fed. If you are only feeding a total of abt 50 fish it would be best to see if a Forum member would sell you a few pounds of appropriate sized Aquamax to get you through the late spring /fall. 50# is a lot of food for 50-80 juvenile caged fish. Try to maintain relatively fresh food on the shelf for caged or captive fish.


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Thanks Bill. Using the YP chart from Purina's website, I figured 10-12 lbs for the season, for both the caged YP and BG. The remainder I will use to feed the BG that currently reside in the pond.

Russ

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Finished two cages this past weekend of the basket type as shown in Cecil's post on page 1. If I bought all the materials used in the construction, each cage would of cost about $50 to build. This cost does not include the top cover or stitching twine. Each cage measures 3' diameter x 4' deep.

Materials:
(1) Top and bottom hoops(bottom one is not necessary) were 10' pieces of 1" black poly well pipe. Pipe price is around 50 cents/foot. $10

(2) Netting (with shipping) ran about $2.45/linear foot. 14'/cage. (10' for the side piece, 4' for the bottom piece.) $34

(3) To give some rigidity to the cage, I cable-tied three pieces of 1" x 4' PVC pipe(sch 40) between the top and bottom hoops. $3.50

(4) Cable ties and plastic barbed nipple. $3

(5) One saturday morning western movie.

Priced a 36" x 8' piece of metal roofing at $31. Cut into pieces this would be more than enough for 3-4 cages, my guess. So add another $7-8 for a top.

Many thanks to Bill Cody for the twine and detailed build instructions!!

Russ

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