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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 181
Lunker
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Lunker
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 181 |
Sandman, in response to your question about the invasiveness of yellow water iris: my experience of probably 18 years with yellow water iris is that it does not invade out into the lake to a significant degree. What it does do is claim shoreline by spreading laterally. It has been pretty slow to cause problems at my place although we have had to spray glyphosate a couple of times where it took over. It outcompetes some of the plants I prefer as marginals such as pickerel rush, thalia (American water canna) and Louisiana swamp iris (I have a big stand of Black Gamecock that it tries to invade). On the good side it stabilizes shoreline like a concrete wall so I have it planted where the Oklahoma winds try to erode my shore. The mature root system is like a network of interlocking 2"x4"s.
Layton Runkle
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 5,712 Likes: 3
Moderator Ambassador Field Correspondent Lunker
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Moderator Ambassador Field Correspondent Lunker
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 5,712 Likes: 3 |
So over 20 years you would expect just under 40% of the fish to die. I added the situation with all the fish surviving to show an exception to the rule for a VERY unlucky pond owner . These numbers are for diploid fish though (thanks for filling in that gap Dr. Willis). You should try to find out if your grass carp are diploids or triploids to determine if these numbers even apply. Guys this is totally contradictory to my experience and education. I have always been total they live no more than 10 years. Well we proofed that wrong back in 2003 with some that had to be 18 years old, but total major exception to the rule. 100 years is just insane. Maybe it is due to being triploid as required in GA maybe it is due to warmer climate thus not living as long. I have literally stocked 100’s of ponds with grass carp. The natural mortality is very high, within 3-5 years the number is always half of what was stocked. We make sure to use 10-12 inch but sure of them may be expensive bass food btu this does not explain this low of a number.
Please don't take anything I'm about to post as anything but the questioning of conventional ideas and teachings. I'm an electronics engineer, not an aquaculturist. But, if researchers didn't challenge what I learned in college in the 1960s regarding electronic data transfer theory, we wouldn't be posting on PondBoss.com today. The 300 baud modem would still be our maximum data speed for DSL. From the data presented by csteffen, I think we can safely assume that over 60% of diploids can live longer than 20 years. That puts us back into the 1980s when diploids were still in fairly common distribution in the US. [I really love the picture of the big "minnow" hugging csteffen! What a classic picture!] Warden Lake, the WVDNR lake I mentioned above that is near me, and with a serious overpopulation of very large grass carp, could easily be filled with diploids that are now in excess of 30 years old. I don't know what is in my pond -- diploids or triploids. As far as I can tell from old receipts, six "grass carp" were stocked in 1993 by the previous owner. When we bought this place about four years ago, I was pretty certain that there were four grass carp in the pond. Two years ago I removed two of them. To the best of my knowledge, two were still living in the pond as of this past October. So, I can only assume these two are at least 15 years old. From my viewpoint, we just don't know how long grass carp really will live in ponds. I think it is considerably longer than 10 years, diploid or triploid. I also don't believe it is anywhere near 100 years. In any case, I plan to stock on the far more conservative side when I replace the two grass carp left in my pond. I plan to remove both of them this spring. I'm now thinking that I will replace them with two grass carp and two koi (I have one huge tiger-striped orange-and-black koi now, which I plan on keeping -- it is a true friend that follows me around the pond). I hope to at least outlive the new grass carp. Good fishn' Ken
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 16,059 Likes: 278
Moderator Lunker
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Moderator Lunker
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 16,059 Likes: 278 |
Didn't I see a post here that they are often badly injured by electrofishing?
It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.
Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.
Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,973
Ambassador Field Correspondent Lunker
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Ambassador Field Correspondent Lunker
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,973 |
Dave it seems due to size and shape they shock well. We have broken the backs of very few fish over the years overall but on much higher % of grass carp. The one in the pciture I posted above had a broken back due to electrofishing.
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 16,059 Likes: 278
Moderator Lunker
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Moderator Lunker
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 16,059 Likes: 278 |
Maybe JHAP could do some fine tuning on the GSF Society's Death Star. ZAP!
It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.
Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.
Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 10,458 Likes: 2
Ambassador Field Correspondent Hall of Fame Lunker
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Ambassador Field Correspondent Hall of Fame Lunker
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 10,458 Likes: 2 |
Personally I am a fan of breaking their backs with an arrow over electricity, but that's just me... HAHA
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 129
Lunker
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OP
Lunker
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 129 |
LR, Thanks for the info on the yellow water iris. I'm still undecided as whether to get some. I already have a full compliment of marginal plants, mostly in the form of smartweed and cattails. The grass carp don't seem to like them that much. I noticed that smartweed has a distinctly hot, peppermint-like taste. Maybe they're too spicy for the GC.
But, I no longer have any weeds where the water exceeds 6" or so. The GC ate 'em all. The shoreline vegetation doesn't seem adequate in competing for nutrients. That seems to be the reason why my water tends to be so murky green in the summer. I don't miss the algae mats but I do miss some of the American pondweed and the chara. Chara (although a bit of a nuisance when fishing) especially seemed to make the water clear. Now there are only traces of these plants in the shallowest places of the lake where the GC can't reach.
I guess I better exercise and eat more healthy so I can outlive those 20 + year old GC. For sure I'll be fishing for them this year to hasten their demise.
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Moderated by Bill Cody, Bruce Condello, catmandoo, Chris Steelman, Dave Davidson1, esshup, ewest, FireIsHot, Omaha, Sunil, teehjaeh57
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My First
by x101airborne - 05/04/24 10:21 AM
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