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I was wondering if it's possible to use a submersible pump to move some water around in my pond? Since mine isn't very deep, (measured it at 7ft deepest part) I was thinking of piping some PVC so it's a foot above water level. As long as it can generate enough head pressure, it should help some? Yes? no?

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Can't answer the pump question (lets go Forum engineers). I can tell you that all aeration is based on the concept of moving water around so that more of the water volume reaches the air-water interface so it can pick up O2 . So your question/idea is not silly.
















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 Originally Posted By: sullpond
I was wondering if it's possible to use a submersible pump to move some water around in my pond? Since mine isn't very deep, (measured it at 7ft deepest part) I was thinking of piping some PVC so it's a foot above water level. As long as it can generate enough head pressure, it should help some? Yes? no?


It should help. I'm considering the same thing. Since I don't have electrictiy at my pond, I was considering a 100W solar panel and an old trolling motor to circulate the water. I guess anything is better than nothing.

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That's a good idea too. I've got the old Ted Williams trolling motor in the garage.

I can get power down to the pond luckily. I just have to get my butt out there and do it. I'd like to put a little floating deck out there so I can use that as an excuse to spend the $ on the wire.

"Honey if you want a deck you have to have a light!!"

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Sullpond, I like the idea for a DIY project, and yes it should help aerate. However, (and I hate to sound like a broken record) water (8.34 lbs/gal)is a lot heavier than air. It is much more energy efficient and therefore less expensive to move water by way of pumping air. It is also a lot less expensive to run PVC air conduit from where your electricity currently is rather than running copper wire.

P.S. If your looking for an excuse to spend some money, give me a call. You can give it to my wife to go shopping with so that she'll let me go fishing this weekend. Talk about money well spent.


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Pumping water around will indeed help aerate the pond, especially with well thought out routing. I could see it being used for horizontal aeration, a spray, or both.

Clogging with plant matter might be a big problem with a submersible pump. If it is located near a dirt bottom, wear from suspended clay would probably cause accelerated wear.

What is the intended original use of the pump you have? That might clue in how susceptible it would be to the above (or other) complications.


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That's a good point WW, PVC is a lot cheaper than copper, and air is easier to move. I wonder If my wife will let me hook up to the exhaust of her milking machine? That puppy puts out some air.

I'd like to contribute to your worthy cause, but my money is already spoken for. The wife or the college student are pretty good at the old dollar disappearing act.

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Oh well, I guess I'll just have to make her mad.


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 Originally Posted By: sullpond
and air is easier to move.


Air is easy to move in air. But once under water, you still have the weight of the water to deal with. You can't avoid it.

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 Originally Posted By: bobad
 Originally Posted By: sullpond
and air is easier to move.


Air is easy to move in air. But once under water, you still have the weight of the water to deal with. You can't avoid it.


Stop! my heads hurting. Good point though
I've decided to run the power since I want a light there anyway.
Bobad, I saw you mention your floating deck in another thread. How many barrels did you need for the size dock you built?

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 Originally Posted By: Theo Gallus
Pumping water around will indeed help aerate the pond, especially with well thought out routing. I could see it being used for horizontal aeration, a spray, or both.

Clogging with plant matter might be a big problem with a submersible pump. If it is located near a dirt bottom, wear from suspended clay would probably cause accelerated wear.

What is the intended original use of the pump you have? That might clue in how susceptible it would be to the above (or other) complications.

Hey Theo,

It's an old submersible sump pump. I thought I'd find some way of putting it in a five gallon bucket and add medium size gravel to protect it somewhat. I'll have to experiment with what will work.

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Maybe you can play around with it in a 55 gallon drum or bathtub (outside) first.

I just realized maybe everyone doesn't have bathtubs setting around outside for experiments


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I've got two empty stock tanks, so I'll probably use one of those. We've used bathtubs before no problem with that whatsoever.
I'll have to make it a covert operation though. If I turn my back it'll get filled with goldfish or Koi.

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Two test tonight. First one with a short 3ft piece of 1/2 PVC .
Then a test with a 7 foot piece of 3/4 PVC.

At 7ft I get about a foot above the pipe, and if I put an ell on it, I get a 3 foot stream before it goes crazy and falls over.
I think this might work if I can make sure it stays unclogged.

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Yes Bobad, there is always the weight of water. However an air diffusion style aerator/mixer actually moves a lot more water with a lot less energy. For instance, one style of our diffusers will pump about 12 MGD with 4.5 CFM. The 1/3 HP Thomas Wobble compressors can deliver this amount even at 15 PSI. Now, I'm not 100% sure, but I don't think that there are any 1/3 HP water pumps that can come anywhere close to pumping 12 MGD. This becomes important for us because when our aerators are used in an agricultural/industrial application (especially waste water) we can save our customers a lot of money (up to 50% of capital costs)by qualifying the customer for energy credits from our local energy company (PG&E) simply based on energy savings. The largest rebates seem to come from when a customer switches from a system that pumps or moves water (i.e. paddle wheels & aspirators) to an air diffusion style aerator in which the bubbles do most the work or to a solar mixer. Sorry to throw more into the mix sullpond but I have a bit of a passion for energy conservation. I'll be awaiting the hippie jokes.


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WW,
I understand, I hate the thought of consuming any extra power. If I had it my way, I'd run the entire farm from solar or wind, or gophers on a wheel. One day that will happen,(maybe not gophers) but at the moment I'm stuck with the time and funds available. Sooo I'm trying to utilize what I have on hand, and make-do.
I appreciate all of the info, even if I don't use it at the moment. It's alway available for future reference.
Peace Man



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It is an excellent demonstration of what could be used by many as emergency aeration.


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I totally agree with Waterwizard. If you have electricity at the pond, you will move many times more water with air than with water(and cheaper). Emergency aeration, to aerate the surface when fish are piping may be done by agitating water.

Last edited by burgermeister; 06/13/08 07:52 PM.

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Been running my contraption since July, and no longer have an anoxic situation on the bottom. Secchi readings are now 16" up from 6".
While probably not the most efficient, or expedient, I believe it did succeed in turning the pond over. Of course in the absence of data showing how it would have turned out without the pump, I can't say definitively.

The pond is better and that's a good thing \:\)

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Sullpond, glad to see it worked for you, I agree when the money isn't there you make due with what you have.
Last summer I did the same thing, I put a submersible pump I had on a small platform to keep it off the bottom, and attached a pipe to it. I had it run only at night to help cool, and aerate.
This year I have a small Linear compressor aerating which uses alot less power, but again use what you got when funds are low.
good luck.



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 Originally Posted By: sullpond
Secchi readings are now 16" up from 6".


I'm a newbie--what is secci rating and how is it measured? My pond has not been evaluated and I'd like to figure out if my aeration is doing anything.


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Secchi depth is taking with a disk with white and black on alternating quarters. The disk is lowered in to the water until you can't see it. This tells you how far sunlight penetrates into the water.

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See the Archive Thread on Secchi Disks for a picture and a link to a great Cary Martin post on them.


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I just came across a rather clever and comical new style of secchi disk. It's called the "sneaker index" See below.

http://www.ecolve.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=434


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The Marine Science teachers here use Mr Fowler's sneaker index. Kids like it a lot more too.

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