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It doesn't come up in a search for "acronyms"...

Also some people don't know what acronym means.



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Okay not GW but George1.

You pointed out something I never noticed before, and I am still sleepy and confused. See below:

As a result of the break up of the Chickasaw Indian Nation and the formation of the State of Oklahoma from the Indian Territory, she received an individual portion of land in what was a part of Marshall County, Oklahoma. Later, when Lake Texhoma was planned and then built, this land was to become a part of the lake bottom. The federal government bought her land from her. (But not the mineral rights which have now desended to her heirs.)

When I did a search for Texhoma I got Texhoma and Texoma. Another example, and they go on and on.

Here's a view of Roosevelt Bridge where it crosses Lake Texhoma, looking east toward Durant, Oklahoma. And here's the "welcome" sign at the entrance to Lake Texhoma Lodge just west of Roosevelt Bridge.

I grew up on the Okie side and always called it Texhoma, now after the search in the Tx and Ok panhandle there apparently is a new "Lake Texhoma". Beats me. I sure know where the Roosevelt Bridge, Marshal County, and Durant are, and they sure aren't in the panhandle.

But I stand corrected at least on this side of the river. The thing is there are no bridges across it (with signs) from Oklahoma to Texas except for the one south of Madill on the upper part of the lake where it starts to form and it says "The Red River". Go Figure.


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GW it bothers the hell out of me. At 55 to find out you were calling a lake you grew up on and fished and boated all its rivers and creeks, etc, etc, is to say the least disconcerning!

I am about to have to go somewhere, but I get back I am going to make some phone calls about the history of this.

Okahoma and Texas has fought over oil wells in that lake and the river. Went to the Supreme court and they traced back to old Spanish French treaties, and all the river is Oklahoma's, but then again the river changes course.

In the 20's or 30's a bridge was built accoss the river and the Ok Gov. wanted a toll bridge, the Tx Gov. wanted a free bridge. The Ok Gov. had state troops posted on the hwy where no one could pass and then had part of the hwy plowed up. I dont remember my history well enough if that was the same Ok. Gov. that had state troopers posted around the Capitol where legislatures couldnt meet and impeach him. They finally rented a hotel conference room and impeached him anyway. The watchful eye of the Fed's made sure he vacated. But it was all around the same time period the lake was built too.


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 Originally Posted By: GW
It doesn't come up in a search for "acronyms"...

Also some people don't know what acronym means.


The most common mistake I make doing a search here is not expanding the time frame big enough. Maybe you did that. Or maybe the search function was acting flaky (I swear it does that).

Anyway, it will show up in a search for "acronyms" (but not "acronym" - singular {curious}) and now (drum roll) also in a search for "abbreviations".

I suppose one of our Okie friends will want it spelled "acrhonym". ;\)


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Theo, I just ran searchs for "acronym", "acronyms" and "abbreviations" for the previous year. The thread did not show up for any of those terms.

As important as these abbreviations are for understanding the dialog here I wonder if it would be wise to make the acronym thread stay at the top of the archives section. This is know as a "sticky" thread and it is a feature of UBB forum software.

That's my story and I'm stickying to it.



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I noticed a cool feature on this site http://www.ohiogamefishing.com/community/showthread.php?t=81062
If you scroll to the bottom of the page there's the acronym for Cesears Creek "CC" if you hover your mouse pointer over the the abbreviation, a box pops up and tells you what it means.




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 Originally Posted By: Bill Webb
GW it bothers the hell out of me. At 55 to find out you were calling a lake you grew up on and fished and boated all its rivers and creeks, etc, etc, is to say the least disconcerning!

I am about to have to go somewhere, but I get back I am going to make some phone calls about the history of this.

Okahoma and Texas has fought over oil wells in that lake and the river. Went to the Supreme court and they traced back to old Spanish French treaties, and all the river is Oklahoma's, but then again the river changes course.

In the 20's or 30's a bridge was built accoss the river and the Ok Gov. wanted a toll bridge, the Tx Gov. wanted a free bridge. The Ok Gov. had state troops posted on the hwy where no one could pass and then had part of the hwy plowed up. I dont remember my history well enough if that was the same Ok. Gov. that had state troopers posted around the Capitol where legislatures couldnt meet and impeach him. They finally rented a hotel conference room and impeached him anyway. The watchful eye of the Fed's made sure he vacated. But it was all around the same time period the lake was built too.




Bill, warn’t GW – it wus me…

The Red River War
This IS about fishing – really….
We launch our boats on the Red River to fish for stripers below the dam at Lake TEXOMA, the site of the Red River War.





Lake TEXOMA was built in the early 1940’s during WWII, using German POW labor with mules and slips.


RED RIVER BRIDGE CONTROVERSY. The Red River Bridge controversy between Texas and Oklahoma (sometimes called the Red River War) occurred in July 1931 over the opening of a newly completed free bridge, built jointly by the two states, across the Red River between Denison, Texas, and Durant, Oklahoma. On July 3, 1931, the Red River Bridge Company, a private firm operating an old toll bridge that paralleled the free span, filed a petition in the United States district court in Houston asking for an injunction preventing the Texas Highway Commission from opening the bridge. The company claimed that the commission had agreed in July 1930 to purchase the toll bridge for $60,000 and to pay the company for its unexpired contract an additional $10,000 for each month of a specified fourteen-month period in which the free bridge might be opened, and that the commission had not fulfilled this obligation. A temporary injunction was issued on July 10, 1931, and Texas governor Ross S. Sterlingqv ordered barricades erected across the Texas approaches to the new bridge. However, on July 16 Governor William (Alfalfa Bill) Murrayqv of Oklahoma opened the bridge by executive order, claiming that Oklahoma's "half" of the bridge ran lengthwise north and south across the Red River, that Oklahoma held title to both sides of the river from the Louisiana Purchase treaty of 1803, and that the state of Oklahoma was not named in the injunction. Oklahoma highway crews crossed the bridge and demolished the barricades. Governor Sterling responded by ordering a detachment of three Texas Rangers,qv accompanied by Adjutant General William Warren Sterling,qv to rebuild the barricades and protect Texas Highway Department employees charged with enforcing the injunction. The rangers arrived on the night of July 16. On July 17 Murray ordered Oklahoma highway crews to tear up the northern approaches to the still-operating toll bridge, and traffic over the river came to a halt. On July 20 and 21 mass meetings demanding the opening of the free bridge were held in Sherman and Denison, and resolutions to this effect were forwarded to Austin. On July 23 the Texas legislature, which was meeting in a special session, passed a bill granting the Red River Bridge Company permission to sue the state in order to recover the sum claimed in the injunction. The bridge company then joined the state in requesting the court to dissolve the injunction, which it did on July 25. On that day the free bridge was opened to traffic and the rangers were withdrawn. Meanwhile, a federal district court in Muskogee, Oklahoma, acting on a petition from the toll-bridge company, had on July 24 enjoined Governor Murray from blocking the northern approaches to the toll bridge. Murray, acting several hours before the injunction was actually issued, declared martial law in a narrow strip of territory along the northern approaches to both bridges and then argued that this act placed him, as commander of the Oklahoma National Guard, above the federal court's jurisdiction. An Oklahoma guard unit was ordered to the bridge, and Murray, armed with an antique revolver, made a personal appearance in the "war zone," as the newspapers labeled it. No attempt was made to enforce the Oklahoma injunction, but on July 24, with the free bridge open, Murray directed the guardsmen to permit anyone who so desired to cross the toll bridge. On July 27 Murray announced that he had learned of an attempt to close the free bridge permanently, and he extended the martial-law zone to the Oklahoma boundary marker on the south bank of the Red River. Oklahoma guardsmen were stationed at both ends of the free bridge, and Texas papers spoke of an "invasion." Finally, on August 6, 1931, the Texas injunction was permanently dissolved, the Oklahoma guardsmen were withdrawn to enforce martial law in the Oklahoma oilfields, and the bridge controversy was laid to rest. The bridge was dynamited on December 6, 1995, to make room for a new one. BIBLIOGRAPHY: Keith L. Bryant, Jr., Alfalfa Bill Murray (Norman: University of Oklahoma Press, 1968). Dallas Morning News, July 17-25, 1931, March 22, 1953, December 8, 1995. William H. Murray, Memoirs of Governor Murray and True History of Oklahoma (3 vols., Boston: Meador, 1945). Sherman Daily Democrat, July 2-August 6, 1931. William Warren Sterling, Trails and Trials of a Texas Ranger (Norman: University of Oklahoma Press, 1968). Lonn W. Taylor (http://www.tsha.utexas.edu). Copyright ©, The Texas State Historical Association, 1997-2002Last Updated: June 6, 2001





Last edited by george1; 11/06/07 12:14 PM.


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Original george #173 (22 June 2002)




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I stand corrected on all counts. Been thirty years since I lived up there, and even more time since my Oklahoma history class. But the 1803 treaty, as far as the river went, was tied back by previous agreements between France and Spain. In the 1803 treaty the U.S. was also granted disputed rights to Texas, but relinquished the rights to Spain as part of the purchase of Florida.

Know what Gov. used the national guard to keep the legislature out of the Capitol Blg?

There was also a dispute of what branch of the Red River was the border in the southwestern part of Oklahoma. Texas was trying, if I remember correctly which as we have seen is questionable, to lop off a big chuck of SW Oklahoma.

But the esssance of my memory was correct. There was a lot of crazy nutzy behavior going on between OK and TX over bridges, oil wells, and territory in general in the early days of the state of OK. Third to last of the lower 48 to be admitted to the Union in 1907.


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Y’all forgive me for hi-jackin’ your thread, but after all it is all about gar and they are big ones in the Red River...

Red River by Guy Clark

From Palo Duro Canyon outside Amarillo Texas
The prairie dog town fork of the Red River flows
Headed cross the plains along the coast of Oklahoma
To the Mississippi River and the Gulf of Mexico

Red River I know you I know you of old
You have filled up my pockets with quicksand and gold
Susanna oh Susanna when it comes my time
Bury me south of that Red River line

My great grandfather came to that Red River line
And camped on the north side until it was time
To cross or to stay to be sooner or not
He headed south to San Antone they said he liked it hot

Here's to Charlie Goodnight and Mr. Loving too
Here's to Coronado, the Comanche, and the blues
Here's to the bootleggers and the oilfield crews
Here's to the one and all of us Red River fools



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Original george #173 (22 June 2002)




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Always good to hear of Charlie Goodnight, george.


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