Pond Boss Forums GENERAL QUESTIONS Pond Boss Finding someone to hay a field

My place is 22 acres. No house yet. My wife and I and I won't be moving there for 3-5 years and we are still in the planning stages (house, horse barn, pastures, fencing, etc). In addition to pastures I was considering putting in some hay fields but don't want to spend the money on hay equipment (I do have a 50 hp tractor) since a) I don't know what I'm doing and b) 5 or 10 acres of hay wouldn't justify the expense of the equipment.

There is an Amish farmer down the street who may be interested in cutting and baling the hay for me. Anyone ever had someone else hay their fields for them? Any ideas on what would be a fair split if I were to offer some of the bales to him for doing the work?

I give my bales from 60 acres to my neighbor, and in exchange he has offered to do the following tasks.

1. He controls my thistles.
2. He mows when I want him to.
3. He doesn't fertilize above my ponds.
4. He built me a bridge across Cheese Creek.
5. He improved my fence gate.
6. He watches over my property and contacts me if something suspicious is going on.
7. He sends me a Christmas gift certificate to a sporting goods store (I don't require this. )
8. He helped me burn and eradicate 20 acres of unwanted green ash trees.

I've found that by not charging him for the hay that I've developed a great, mutually beneficial relationship with a neighbor that will benefit me for years. If I charged him then it would be purely business. I'm not saying you shouldn't charge your Amish neighbor--just that there are some things better than money.

Just a guess, but I'll bet if you didn't charge him he'd make it right in his own way.

I don't want to charge him. I was thinking of letting him have all of the hay until we move there with the horses. Then I would split the hay with him. I thought it would be a win-win proposition. I wasn't sure if this was a common arrangement or what an appropriate split would be. If I couldn't strike a deal like this I would just bush hog the fields to keep them under control and not bother with the hay.

Sounds like you're on the right path. I've been criticized for giving away my hay, but I'm thrilled with having a happy, loyal neighbor.

Let 'em criticize - you may not be getting paid $$$ for the hay but you are getting other things in return.

Rob:

I have been a part of and aware of several hay sharecropping agreements.

Sometimes the landowner just gave away all the hay in exchange for getting the fields mowed. If the landowner has use for some hay, I have seen arrangements where they get as high as 1/4 of the bales.

I have been making hay on 2 fields totalling 8-10 acres next door for about 20 years now. The consideration provided for this privilege has evolved from 1) free, but I mowed off another field that wasn't fit to bale, 2) no extra mowing, but provided 100 fifty pound square bales of hay for the pony kept for the neighbors' grandkids, 3) renting the field for $200 per year (negotiated at the time from the nominal value of 100 square bales), to currently 4) no charge, but I provide evidence of maintaining the long-term health of the soil from fertilizing, liming, reseeding, etc. as needed. This current method encourages me to avoid "nutrient mining" and keeps the yields up for my own benefit; it is far and away the most expensive deal I have had for the land but the increase in hay quality and quantity is worth it to me. Long term haymaking without putting back nutrients does lower hay yields (and the value of the land, at least for haymaking) substantially over time.

Arrangements in my part of the World for non-irrigated hay are as follows:

Tenant – Receives 60 % of baled hay crop
Landowner – Receives 40 % of baled hay crop.

You may want to sell, negotiate or barter your 40% to your tenant. That way you always have control of your share when you eventually move onto the property.

Ed

I have no experience in hay or such, but I do know that the Amish, in general, are great builders as I'm sure you know.

Perhaps a deal could be struck where the farmer and his clan will build your barn for you in the future, or maybe the fences.

You guys are great. Not only do I get pond advice here buy I can get farming advice too!

Ed: 60/40 would work for me. We won't have more than 4 horses so I am not looking to get a lot of hay from this but anything will help. (by the way I'll be in Wyoming this time next week with the family. Other side of the state though, going through Grand Teton Natl Park on the way to Montana)

Sunil: I live 35 miles from Philadelphia but only 30 minutes from Lancaster, PA. Fortunately I'm in a more rural part of SE PA - Chester County. Where my property is there are many Amish farms. They may not treat their animals the best but I like them. Honest people, good at what they do and their prices are fair. So far I've hired an Amish barn builder for a tractor barn, an Amish cupola builder for the cupola on top of the barn and an Amish deck builder will be building my dock as soon as the pond renovation is complete and before the pond fills back up. Bartering is a gret idea. I'll have to think about that. Fencing ain't cheap!

I've never messed with planting hay.

I have, on occasion, leased the grazing rights but that's pretty tricky. I have found that I am the only one who cares about the long term well being of my land. Most cattle owners will overstock and move on when the native grasses are over grazed. I've posted here about the predator/prey relationship that can occur if you're not careful. Like the Godfather said, "It's just business.".

I do know guys who have their coastal bermuda pastures baled on a 50/50 split basis. I would want to be there when the bale count was made. Obviously, on larger pastures, there is more interest than on small places.

I've not been fortunate enough to find anybody like Bruce has.

RobA,

We go 50/50 around here. I would advise against buying the hay equipment not only because of the investment but also the maintenance is very high on hay equipment. I'm a DIY kind of guy but hay is one thing where I draw the line. You are fortunate to have Amish folks around, most fortunate.

One word of caution from a practicing rancher...if you don't fertilize or add nutrients back into the hay fields, you will soon deplete them. Your Amish friends know this full well and probably would be very agreeable to adding some natural fertilizers to your fields from time to time.

I only bush hog ~7acres, but feel terrible about wasting the good quality hay. I would gladly give it away. 1-3 free mowing's a year would be a nice bonus too.

I hear ya Burg.

It's a shame you almost have to go to Amish country to find someone willing to work for food.

Not to highjack, but one of the few movies I never tire of is "Witness" Movie Review . I love to watch those wonderfully independent Amish people. Sometimes I feel like giving up everything and joining them, but I cuss way too much.

Ah, yes. When I first fell for Kelley McGillis.

And remember, as Homer Simpson pointed out, "Who knows more about electricity than the Amish?"

D'oh!!

And you can't forget Homer's best advice:

"The three little sentences that will get you through life. Number 1: Cover for me. Number 2: Oh, good idea, Boss! Number 3: It was like that when I got here."

So what is a big round bale of hay worth anyway?

Around here, $15-$25. Square baled, the same amount of hay is worth about 4x as much.

These round bales are really big. The guy said they weigh close to a ton. Is that really all they're worth?

The 5' round bales were going for over $100/bale last year during the drought here in east Texas. The year before, I heard they were about $45/bale.
My BIL in south Texas(40 miles S of San Antonio) is getting about $80/bale for the 5'ers. I am pretty sure they weigh over a 1000 lbs, anyway.

Bruce:

I was pricing 1200 pounders. They are about 5' in diameter and about 5' wide.

Maybe $40 for a one ton bale here??? OTOH, that hay could be put in 40 50-pound square bales bringing $3-$4 each.

RobA, For the last 20 years I have let my loyal neighbor cut hay on apprx:85 acres of pasture. He supplies oats/wheat, all equipment and I pay for the fertilizer. We have never charged him a red cent. I have not filled a fish feeder, they just seem to be full at all times, my kids get to eat with a 75 year old rancher for free and also get to listen to all kinds of good advice from an honest man for free,as well as some good stories. What goes around comes around. Just my two cents. Cody

Cody, that's the way it ought to be. The Kids will be the beneficiaries.

We all need , and need to be , neighbors like that. Society is the beneficiary if there are enough good folks like that around.