Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations Future of Fishing

I've been gone for a while. Among other things I spend a week in the UK on business. I was curious to check out the sport of fishing there. Pretty sad state of affairs best I could tell. Upon inquiring about fishing I find that one doesn't just hop in the car and go fishing very much. In England it appears that most good fishing waters are either controlled by fishing clubs or the government restricts access by requiring special permits to fish certain areas. I stayed on lake Windemere which is the largest lake in England. I was told there was a few places that one could fish for free (just requires a fishing license) but the good fishing spots required a special access permit that apparently is very expensive and only clubs or resorts can afford them. For instance the place I stayed boasted about possessing a permit to fish some of the best areas of the lake or adjoining rivers and therefore guests could fish these areas. It appeared that rivers were totally controlled by either land owners or clubs. I am thankful that in this country we have a heritage of considering most large bodies of water as public property and state governments provide a lot of lake access. Here in MN all lakes of any size generally have a free public access. I do fear however that as fishing and hunting gets more and more commercialized we will eventually end up the same way. I for one think that fishing tournaments are bad for the sport of fishing. I know that's a controversial subject but as soon as you start allowing people to make money off a natural resource it ceases to be a public resource. Some of my favorite fishing lakes no longer have access to the average guy via the public landing because there is almost always a fishing tournament going on that will take over the access. So unless you are in the tournament or belong to the "club" holding the tournament you can't even got on the water. Agree or disagree?

I agree about the hunting. Here in KY if you dont want to get shot on public land while deer hunting you have to get a hunt lease. The days of knocking on a farmers door and asking permison to hunt are long gone.

As far as Bass tournys alot of them help grow the sport with the youth. Granted some acess areas may be jammed with cars, trucks and trailers making dificult to fish from the bank. But they are so many areas and lakes, that almost anyone can fish. Not to mention they are lots of lakes that horse power limits that almost never have tournys. Good topic...

Donnie

nice post bz, it smacks of elitism and socialism, and we'll be in a sad state of affairs once the feds or individual states clamp down on public access of inland waters. i see it in small measures just over the last 20 years around NorCal where once you could drive around to any State reservoir, drive around the shoreline, take yer dogs and enjoy the resource.....now these same areas are fenced off, restricted pay gates, restricted hours, leash laws...etc. etc.

my dad quips its all because of overpopulation and the few who ruin for the many.

and where is the post about chasing off every interloper, before they are interlopers, with aggressive signs? the PB board is public access but PB ponds are certainly not public access.

BZ,

There's a fine balance between public ownership (and rights) and property owner's rights. It's not perfect, but it's working pretty well.

If I'm not mistaken, it's illegal in most areas to profit from sport fish taken from public waters. I think it should stay that way, and even be expanded to other types of exploitation.

Sadly I think it's inevitable to some extent once the population grows and the pressure on the resource gets more and more intense. With more and more population growth and pressure, comes more and more regulation. I would hope the independent American spirit of freedom and access for all would counteract this a little, but I'm not optimistic.

I'm not a big bass tournament supporter either, but here in Indiana they have made it so tournaments can't block a public access, and must find additonal parking or they won't be issued a permit. I too dislike the commericialism of the tournaments but to each his own.

I have more of a problem with the unmitigated disaster of overuse I see on my local lakes. A regular fisherman has to compete with bass tournaments, jet skis, power boats, racing boats, sailboats, lake residents who want you off their lake etc. etc. I've actually been on some lakes where you fear for you life due to the massive boat traffic and idiots that don't have a clue. I've had my lines run over and came close to being hit by a high speed boat at night by about a foot with an official DNR decal on the site when I worked for the DNR! Addtionally it's not enough to have one row of year long residents around the lake complete with their concrete seawalls. Many of the lakes in my area have up to three rows of houses around the lakes, and some of the residents will have a cow if you fish too close to their pier even though these lakes have public access. Two large lakes in my area have such a large population on the lakes they have now been annexed as actual towns. It's literally like sitting in your boat on the water in a hurricane on some of these lakes and reminds me of being in the middle of a carnival. It's also hard to troll with all aquatic vegetation that has been clipped with outboard and inboard motor props.

I came up with a solution of a no wake time in the morning and evening to give the average boater a fair playing field but it was pooh poohed by the boating industry here that is very strong and those that don't want it.

I used to be an avid fisherman that went to all the lakes in the area, but for the last two years the boat has stayed in the garage and I even sold my outboard. I have more fun on my ponds anyway and my blood pressure stays calm too. The quality of experience on the public lakes is just not there anymore.

I've heard that argument before and frankly it doesn't fly for me. There's difference between a trespasser (nice word is interloper), and one who asks permission. I have allowed numerous folks that ask me for permission to fish my ponds, and I know many others on here probably have too. In fact, I sometimes can't get enough people to help me fish out the ponds upon harvest time.

One also has to keep in mind that the UK is so small area-wise when compared to the USA.

Whatever you do, please don't start singing that "Signs, Signs, everywhere Signs.." song. It would make me have to blow chow all over my computer, and that won't make a good start to the weekend!!

I think the main difference is that in the U.K. game (and I presume fish) have always belonged to the Crown, and their designated associates among the titled aristocracy. In America, the game belongs to everyone, in care of the state.

I kind of liked that song!

I had a similar experiance. Here in NC, Lake Norman. I set out to go fishing for BG, I had heard there was CNBG in the lake. I grabed a UL pole a few worms and set out. I went to the public lauch, started fishing and just about got arrested. OH ya if you dont have a boat your not welcome at the lauches..any of them. You cant even go in to the parking lot unless it is to launch a boat. So I set off to find a little spot to fish. 3 hours of serching, up every road down every corner I could find. There is no place someone from foot can fish. Every single bridge is posted and every inch of shorline is either owned private ot posted. Bottom line if you dont have a boat, your not welcome is the feeling I got. The Sherrif sent me to the state park and painted this great picture of fishing and everything, it was a Paved road with forest on both sides and to fish you had to track threw the woods down huge mountains to even get close to the water.

Yep so much for public water eh? Here too if you don't have a boat you're screwed. Private property all around the lakes. I saw a young couple make the mistake of tip toeing across the corner of a guys property to get to a spot that was public once while I was sitting out in boat. He came barreling out of his cottage and called them every name but a white man. Teh SOB doesn't even fish like many of the cottage owners! I was so mad I was in tears. I really felt sorry for them. If I would have had room I would have been glad to have them join me. Here you can fish from the public launches but they are usually shallow and the fishing sucks there. Of course that doesn't keep the DNR public relations from making it sound like a the greatest spots to fish since cracked ice.

In KY you can fish around any of the boat ramps, the state owns the land. As long as your not swiming or fishing from a ramp your ok.

What sucks is the hunters and fishermen support the access areas and all Dept of Fish and Wildlife owned land, then the out of staters come in. Many of them bring thier $100,000 race boats and cuddy cabins then clog up the ramps. Some of them go as far as anchoring at the entrance of a cove and block other boats from entering. Don't even get me started on the jet skiers that run up a creek and do circles around my boat and they laugh the whole time. For the money I spend for liscence each year Fish and Wildlife could put a few more bodies on the water.

DonJovi, There is a good way of stopping them. It cost about 4 or 5 bucks and I almost can guarentee they leave and dont come back. They are smart, they stay just outside casting distance. A RATTLE TRAP can reach them. Lead them good and let it rip.

I was thinking more along the lines of a DD-22 for the extra thud.LOL But the Rattle Trap would be able to go for distance.

Yup, one thing you must do first. Put on a few Gamkatzu hooks on just to be sure you catch what ever decides to bump the lure.

There is an inner city Fort Worth Lake that is, I believe, about 80 or so acres. It has been leased to a water skiing Club. They have exclusive right granted by the City. I don't live in Fort Worth so I can't gripe about it.

This is a great thread. An alternative title could be "Why Keg wants a pond". I hardly fish in New York anymore because for me it just isn't fun in a crowd.

Last year I'm casting for fluke on Long Island and land a keeper. Five minutes later there are a couple of other people casting right on top of me, tangling lines, etc. It's frosting my petunias until one guy doesn't see the powerboat cruising down the channel and sets his pole down... splash... dang, what a shame.

Around here, fresh water is a bit better than salt - there are some electric-only (or low HP) lakes which at least keeps it a little quieter than NASCAR. Long term, my only hope is to become a pond boss!

Keg

The Electric only lakes are the ticket for unpressured public water and peice and quiet. I use to go to NY eletric only lakes right over the boarder of NJ. We always hit the Newark Watershed Electric only lakes but even those got pressured pretty good after the word got out. Those you can have the big motor on the boat so the bass boats came, the NY lakes there not even allowed to be on the boat so the places were pristeen. You need a pass but it is worth every cent. My original reason I bought the Pond Prowler.

Guys,

We had real situation like that on one of our musky lakes here. A kid on a jet ski was harrassing a guy casting for muskies and even though the guy repeatedly warned him to back off the kid kept egging him on. Finally the guy lost it and snagged the kid in the head with a big musky plug. Have you ever seen the size of the hooks on those big musky plugs? Yanked him right off the jet ski. Ouch! Pretty bloody I heard! Anyway it went to court and the judge fined the guy good, but he did scold the kid and tell him, "you had to to be pretty close to this guy for him to reach you."

Had another case where jet skier was harrassing two bass fisherman. Unfortunately for the jet skier was the bass boat had a big motor and the jet ski ran out of gas in a backwater area trying to get away with the bass boat in pursuit. The two guys gave the jetskier a good thrashing!

I know someone that shoots bottle rockets at them when the fishing gets slow. Another person throws rocks at boats that get too close. And one ol'timer I know carries a surf casting rod with a 3 oz. weight on the end. He says when he breaks that out they scatter.

Well, as far as criticizing pond owners for having private ponds I think there's a big difference between my pond funded by me and the "public" waters that we all own via our tax money. I might mention on lake Windemere in UK where I stayed and almost all inland UK waters there is a 10 mph speed limit. That has solved the speed boat and jet ski problem I bet. Do we need more regulation? But guess what, there is a water ski club on that UK lake. They only go 10 mph using big giant skis! Funny! I've been almost run over by jet skis too, not fun. As to the comment about tournaments getting kids into fishing. If you want to teach kids how to fish for greed I guess the tournament might help. The bass fisherman I've seen in tournaments aren't really sport fishing anyway, they're just thrashing the water as fast as they can to maximize time with a wet line. It is illegal to make money off of wild game and that's a good thing, but if so, why can tournament anglers win big bucks for catching fish? Cecil has a good layed back attitude with his "to each his own" but unfortunately when you allow all this stuff some people don't get to excercise their "own" at all if they can't get on the public lake. Oh well, I've vented. This has been a hot topic lately here in the local MN outdoor papers. And now let's discuss fish mortality after tournaments.

Well you can go the other way, no access restrictions, no restocking, no government intervention, no license, no limits, no equipment restrictions, no size restrictions, no seasons, no bait restrictions, no one cares. You can fish almost any where, any time with anything, trotlines, a 100 poles, cast nets, sienes, dip nets, pumps to drain the water, catch as many as you can for as long as you wish, my neighbors all do.
The downside? so few fish and so small.

I was the one who made the comment about fishing tournys getting kids interested. My club sponsers a kids tourny where every kid walks away with new rods, tackel, and other donated stuff. The prizes are donated from club members and local shops. Most clubs, like mine, are not about the money you win at the end of the day. If thats was what it's about then bass fishermen would all be rich. Gas, meals, tackel, and ect cost alot of money, I have never made a profit in two yeaars of tourny fishing and most others do not either. There is no way a BASS casting kids contest or local club have a take a kid fishing day is teaching young anglers to be greedy fishermen. After all fishing will keep them off the couch playing thier PS3 and out of trouble.

Donnie

Yeah DonJovi, you are right. I'm sure there are a lot of good clubs that help things a lot. I was just venting, sorry. I gotta agree its a great thing if we can get kids fishing instead of many other things they could be doing. I sure don't have the answers but like I said, this has been a hot topic around here lately and guys are getting tired of no room at boat launches, and some of the tourney fisherman that have no courtesy, and the studies we're seeing that fish mortality is high. I suppose it's like most things, there are a few that spoil it for the rest. The complaints seem to be with the really big events not necessarily the smaller fun events. I still gotta ask though why anyone can make money off the natural resource and why we have to put up with the wastefulness of high mortality. Now that I think about it I have fishing contests in my pond. I invite kids over and we fish with a prize going to the biggest fish. Prizes however are usually something like a fishing lure or candy bar. You gotta admit though that the Pro tourney stuff is driven by money and I'm afraid that once money gets big enough then it all goes down hill fast.