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#565907 04/04/24 11:50 PM
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Does anyone have a lead or supplier of Pumpkinseed sunfish??
Not afraid to drive to pick up 100-200 fish, even trade fish of some sort???
My RES are not doing as well as I think they should and am wondering if I'm high enough and cool enough the PSS would be a better choice.

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Snipe #565911 04/05/24 07:10 AM
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"... am wondering if I'm high enough..." -If you have to wonder.....

"....and cool enough....." -Very subjective....


Excerpt from Robert Crais' "The Monkey's Raincoat:"
"She took another microscopic bite of her sandwich, then pushed it away. Maybe she absorbed nutrients from her surroundings."

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Snipe #565913 04/05/24 07:25 AM
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What is you elevation?

I was surprised to find that Kansas varies from 472 to 4,272 feet above sea level. Back in school we were taught that all you needed were a stick, six gopher holes, and a dozen rocks to shoot pool anywhere in Kansas.


"Live like you'll die tomorrow, but manage your grass like you'll live forever."
-S. M. Stirling
[Linked Image from i.pinimg.com]
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Snipe #565915 04/05/24 08:26 AM
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I have 6,000 gopher holes on my property. I guarantee your rock will find a hole with every shot!

Snipe is probably back to work, but the elevation at the airport near him is 3645'.

(He can give us the correct answer when he finishes his daily Frankenstein task of sewing walleye heads onto the bodies of sauger.)

Snipe #565916 04/05/24 08:45 AM
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I could not find any suppliers in our multi-state area. There are some in the northern U.S.

Keystone Hatcheries (Richmond, IL). Smith Creek Fish Farm (upstate NY) has PSS on their current price sheet.

Good luck! If you find good genetic stock, then maybe you could be the regional PSS provider!

Snipe #565920 04/05/24 09:41 AM
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Adult PS won't grow big enough to avoid predation by WAE or Saugeye. Keystone won't sell to anyone outside of Illinois. Smith Creek Fish Farm stopped shipping fish a number of years ago.

Keystone got spanked by the Feds a while back for selling fish out of state from a facility that they couldn't sell fish out of state from. Now when you purchase from them the sales invoice that you sign is actually a 4-6 page contract to cover their butt if you take the fish out of state. Last time I talked to Smith Creek they said NY changed the regs so it made it financially impossible to ship out of state.

Let me see what I can do. I might be able to trap enough out of a pond.


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3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).
Snipe #565929 04/05/24 11:22 AM
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3650 is the official..
Mt. Sunflower is 20 miles south of me at 4039.

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Snipe #565930 04/05/24 11:24 AM
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esshup, thanks for interjecting some actual expert information into the thread.

Any idea why there are no PSS suppliers in the Midcontinent and South? I just looked up the geographic distribution, and their natural range is from the states surrounding the Great Lakes down to South Carolina. Would they be a good fish in the Arkansas, Missouri, Kansas, Oklahoma, Texas arc of ponds, or is it too warm? (It would be nice to have a sunfish in the RES niche that is easier to catch. I think they also eat snails?)

I thought we caught a few in a reservoir in SE Kansas when I was a kid. Seems odd since that is not in their range and no one supplies them in the area. Is it more likely we mis-identified a different type of sunfish? Pulling up the watershed fish map suggests that we were probably catching Orange-Spotted Sunfish, but my memory better matches the images of Pumpkinseeds - and that is how they identified in our fish picture book.

Snipe #565932 04/05/24 12:31 PM
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Haven’t seen a gopher hole in years. You guys must have a coyote shortage. Also have run out of ground squirrels.


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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Originally Posted by Dave Davidson1
Haven’t seen a gopher hole in years. You guys must have a coyote shortage. Also have run out of ground squirrels.

I have no shortage of coyotes. When I do a burn, there are a lot just beyond the edges of the burn at night.

Do the hogs rooting allow the predators in Texas to more easily eat the gophers and ground squirrels? (We don't have hogs at my place yet.)

Snipe #565946 04/05/24 03:34 PM
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FishinRod, most likely supply and demand. They don't reproduce as much as Bluegill, more similar to RES. Few(er) hatcheries up North in their native range vs down south where RES grow.

Yes, they also have the pharyngeal teeth to crush snails, but they don't get anywhere as big as RES. Most sizes that we see here are 6", an 8" one is a true MONSTER. They do NOT colony nest like BG or RES, males make a nest that is roughly 3x the size that a male BG of the same size would make. If I can find one in a local lake next month that is spawning I will try to get a picture. A 6" male PS will make a nest that is 24" dia or a wee bit bigger.


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3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).
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Snipe #565953 04/05/24 08:36 PM
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Rod. They don’t dig holes, just wallow around a little. Haven’t seen a ground squirrel in years.


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
Snipe #565961 04/06/24 09:33 AM
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Thanks esshup.

I thought if PSS were half way between BG and RES on size, fecundity, etc. then they might be another nifty tool for more southern ponds.

They apparently are not! Which explains the lack of fish suppliers. That is what I expected, but I still ask my questions anyway.

Snipe #565967 04/06/24 12:42 PM
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Would a RES X PSS be doable?


Bob


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Bobbss #565985 04/06/24 10:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Bobbss
Would a RES X PSS be doable?

I don't know if it would be worth while with the cold intolerance of the RES. I have seen naturally occurring BG/PS hybrids though up in Wi.


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Snipe #565991 04/06/24 11:01 PM
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I wonder if this would result in a big % or male off-spring? Seem to recall ewest had a chart showing the crosses and MRESxFPSS may result in lower ratio males than MPSSxFRES, can't remember but seems ratios were different.

Snipe #566094 04/09/24 05:04 PM
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Not much info on RE X PS as they do not naturally live in the same area to cross.
See this link
https://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=449213#Post449213

Last edited by ewest; 04/09/24 05:06 PM.















FishinRod #566109 04/10/24 09:26 AM
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Fishin Rod,

You could have caught Longears, Many people in KS call them "pumpkin-seeds".


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Donatello #566111 04/10/24 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Donatello
Fishin Rod,

You could have caught Longears, Many people in KS call them "pumpkin-seeds".

Thanks. Pretty sure you nailed it. Those images match my memory.

The Boy Scout leaders at the lake called them pumpkinseeds. When I was a young scout I was pretty sure all of the leaders were omniscient on every outdoors topic. Then I myself became a scout leader and realized how much stuff I DIDN'T know despite being outdoors every chance I got. grin

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Snipe #566130 04/11/24 12:53 PM
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Luckily I have a few local waters that supply any species I want 4 species of sunfish included.
I just wish I could catch & stock more green sunfish.

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pumpkin.jpg pumpkin1.jpg
Last edited by SENKOSAM; 04/11/24 12:54 PM.
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Snipe #566131 04/11/24 01:00 PM
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YOY PS

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ewest #566139 04/11/24 02:46 PM
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Originally Posted by ewest
YOY PS

I apparently cannot correctly identify Pumpkinseeds as adults, and you can identify them at that size. Not fair! grin

Snipe #566160 04/12/24 10:28 AM
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Not that good !!!!

The pic was from a tank with only a few adult PS in it to spawn. Put some yoy in small glass aquarium and took pics. grin

It's easy when you know the answers in advance.

Last edited by ewest; 04/12/24 10:30 AM.















ewest #566162 04/12/24 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by ewest
It's easy when you know the answers in advance.

I knew that you knew the answer ahead of time. However, sometimes after making all of my bad "Dad" jokes, I have to throw out a few self-effacing jokes to balance things out.

Since you are back in this thread, I did want to ask: Are those Pumpkinseeds you (or a buddy) have all of the way down in Mississippi? Or are they pics from a more northern location?

If MS Pumpkinseeds, what is their pond situation?

Snipe #566229 04/15/24 01:32 PM
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Friend (fisheries science guy) in NY.
















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