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Artificial fish cover questions...
#533533 04/06/21 07:20 PM
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After swinging all the way from too many bushy pondweeds in 2020 to, after herbicide treatment, hardly any pondweeds this year, I'm considering some artificial fish cover designed to protect the little guys, particularly the yoy BG, CNBG, and RES.

I know that Mossback and other manufacturers make designs specifically for this purpose. Any thoughts or experiences on this subject? I'm also interested in LMB structures, but in general more concerned with forage fish as my predators (LMB, HSB, RBT seasonally) seem to do okay if there's enough to eat.

Last edited by anthropic; 04/06/21 07:22 PM.

8ac, full 3/16. CNBG, RES, FHM 10/15; TP 5/16; FLMB 6/16. 100 12" NLMB & 1k GSH 10/17,L, 150# TP & 70 HSB 5/18. 1k PK 11/18. 100# TP 4/19, 200# RBT 12/19, 10k TFS 3/20, 100#TP 5/20, 25 HSB & 250 F1 9/20,L,180# RBT 12/20, 206, 7k TFS,100#TP 5/21, 185



Re: Artificial fish cover questions...
anthropic #533543 04/06/21 09:30 PM
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I am covered up with the underwater variety of slender spikerush and it’s a real pain to fish in ..... wonder if grass carp would eat that CR..! Probably good habitat for YOY tho

Re: Artificial fish cover questions...
Pat Williamson #533549 04/06/21 10:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Pat Williamson
I am covered up with the underwater variety of slender spikerush and it’s a real pain to fish in ..... wonder if grass carp would eat that CR..! Probably good habitat for YOY tho

Yeah, that's the tradeoff. Hard to get it in balance, even harder to stay in balance.

Did you have slender spikerush from the start, or is it more recent? My bushy pondweed, southern naiad, seemed to come on strong in just the last few years. Before 2020, I thought it did more good than harm, even though I didn't plant it.


8ac, full 3/16. CNBG, RES, FHM 10/15; TP 5/16; FLMB 6/16. 100 12" NLMB & 1k GSH 10/17,L, 150# TP & 70 HSB 5/18. 1k PK 11/18. 100# TP 4/19, 200# RBT 12/19, 10k TFS 3/20, 100#TP 5/20, 25 HSB & 250 F1 9/20,L,180# RBT 12/20, 206, 7k TFS,100#TP 5/21, 185



Re: Artificial fish cover questions...
anthropic #533560 04/07/21 06:51 AM
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Do a forum search for "structure". There is a large archive-type thread showing a large assortment of artificial structures (cover) that ewest recently listed the link to.


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Re: Artificial fish cover questions...
anthropic #533568 04/07/21 07:47 AM
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As I understand it all, the lmb and hsb will grow faster if there is little to no plant life in the pond. That's providing there are good numbers of forage fish for them to eat and gain weight. A few years back, after Todd Overtons electric survey at the pond, he concluded that I was short on 3 to 4"cnbg and suggested I add 5 dense brush piles along the shoreline. I built 9 out of cedars and other brush I gathered up. We also added 50 lbs of FHM's to take the pressure off the cnbg fry. And it was not long before I had 3 to 4" cnbg everywhere in and around the pond. Brush piles are cheap with just a small amount of labor. I am doing it again this spring.


Do not judge me by the politicians in my City, State or Federal Government.


Tracy
Re: Artificial fish cover questions...
anthropic #533575 04/07/21 09:29 AM
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Tracy,

I am constantly clearing brush at my farm, so the first half of the "labor" is already done.

How did you anchor/bundle your brush piles to keep them dense and in place?

Re: Artificial fish cover questions...
TGW1 #533582 04/07/21 01:13 PM
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Originally Posted by TGW1
As I understand it all, the lmb and hsb will grow faster if there is little to no plant life in the pond. That's providing there are good numbers of forage fish for them to eat and gain weight. A few years back, after Todd Overtons electric survey at the pond, he concluded that I was short on 3 to 4"cnbg and suggested I add 5 dense brush piles along the shoreline. I built 9 out of cedars and other brush I gathered up. We also added 50 lbs of FHM's to take the pressure off the cnbg fry. And it was not long before I had 3 to 4" cnbg everywhere in and around the pond. Brush piles are cheap with just a small amount of labor. I am doing it again this spring.


Tracy:

Little to no plant life means more nutrients available for phytoplankton. I don't want anybody that reads this to assume he meant little to no cover. Without cover for the LMB to hide in and relate to, they are marathon runners, burning up tremendous amounts of calories to try and catch a meal.

Ask FIH about adding cover to his pond........


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3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).
Re: Artificial fish cover questions...
esshup #533614 04/08/21 12:24 AM
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Even before felling two more trees, I had lots of woody cover. Rip-rap all across dam, and some rock added on island points and right next to my dock. Also some brush around & under dock, which has resulted in lost lunkers.

My concern isn't with cover for predators like LMB, but rather for yoy CNBG and RES now that weeds have been wiped out. Fortunately, my forage pond CNBG survived the Big Chill, so I'll add them after my next electro harvest in early May. Just trying to see if anyone had used Mossback & similar products designed to shelter panfish, especially smaller ones.

I'm even considering cancelling TP order this year, as algae usually not bad in my infertile BOW and may provide shelter for little guys now that weeds are scarce. Definitely delaying grass carp!

Last edited by anthropic; 04/08/21 12:28 AM.

8ac, full 3/16. CNBG, RES, FHM 10/15; TP 5/16; FLMB 6/16. 100 12" NLMB & 1k GSH 10/17,L, 150# TP & 70 HSB 5/18. 1k PK 11/18. 100# TP 4/19, 200# RBT 12/19, 10k TFS 3/20, 100#TP 5/20, 25 HSB & 250 F1 9/20,L,180# RBT 12/20, 206, 7k TFS,100#TP 5/21, 185



Re: Artificial fish cover questions...
esshup #533618 04/08/21 07:19 AM
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esshup, I agree and did not intend for someone who reads this to think there is no need for cover for the lmb. The lmb do need those less dense places for cover. The fact is I have a lot of those types of places in my pond, maybe too many of them lol. But I was talking dense cover for the CNBG to hide fry to hide in. The brush piles I am talking about can be put in place and then removed when not needed. I thought Frank was asking about cover for CNBG and RES fry?
Esshup, ask FIH?


FishinRod, I would bundle them with rope and anchor them with cinder blocks.

Frank, are you seeing FA in your pond? I was told when I treat my pond with herbicide (Sonar) I will see a lot of FA because of the chemical treatment and it was suggested I use Tp to assist in controlling the FA. I am already seeing quite a bit of FA and don't want more of that slimy green algae, so I ordered the Tp a few days ago. I also wanted them to produce more forage for my lmb and hsb and take some pressure off my cnbg fry.

Last edited by TGW1; 04/08/21 07:42 AM.

Do not judge me by the politicians in my City, State or Federal Government.


Tracy
Re: Artificial fish cover questions...
anthropic #533633 04/08/21 04:17 PM
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Originally Posted by anthropic
Originally Posted by Pat Williamson
I am covered up with the underwater variety of slender spikerush and it’s a real pain to fish in ..... wonder if grass carp would eat that CR..! Probably good habitat for YOY tho

Yeah, that's the tradeoff. Hard to get it in balance, even harder to stay in balance.

Did you have slender spikerush from the start, or is it more recent? My bushy pondweed, southern naiad, seemed to come on strong in just the last few years. Before 2020, I thought it did more good than harm, even though I didn't plant it.


The slender spikerush came from a neighbors pond via birds I suspect

Re: Artificial fish cover questions...
anthropic #533635 04/08/21 04:35 PM
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Yeah, Tracy, cover for panfish is my biggest concern now that weeds are absent. LMB cover can always be improved, but I am less concerned about them than their prey. If I get threadfin shad that should help take off some pressure of CNBG, especially from HSB population. I go back and forth on TP this year.

Nice thing about artificial structure is that it doesn't deteriorate the way natural brush does. Bad thing is the cost! We'll see.


8ac, full 3/16. CNBG, RES, FHM 10/15; TP 5/16; FLMB 6/16. 100 12" NLMB & 1k GSH 10/17,L, 150# TP & 70 HSB 5/18. 1k PK 11/18. 100# TP 4/19, 200# RBT 12/19, 10k TFS 3/20, 100#TP 5/20, 25 HSB & 250 F1 9/20,L,180# RBT 12/20, 206, 7k TFS,100#TP 5/21, 185




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