Looks like my neighbor must of sprayed his roundup ready beans in the last 4 or 5 days, weeds and grass in his field are just turning yellow. Not sure if it was overspray of if it came in during the last rain but it looks like it also also caused a very sudden die of the algea bloom in my pond and a DO sag. I picked up two dead SMB yesterday, then another eight more fish today. Biggest one was 20-1/2" which might be one of the wipers I got from LovinLiving, seven SMB in the 17" to 18-1/2" size range. It must have been a bad DO sag, I have found several large dead Golden shiners as well. Thoughts?
I am fortunate in that the farmer running the crops in my water shed used GE crops which are designed to be used with pond friendly herbicides. No SMB or any any other fish kills in my pond. The entire watershed is his fields. Sorry for your issue, but find out what is in your water before drawing conclusions, Hopefully, your state chemist can help.
Excerpt from Robert Crais' "The Monkey's Raincoat:" "She took another microscopic bite of her sandwich, then pushed it away. Maybe she absorbed nutrients from her surroundings."
Found two more 16" SMB when I got home, niether were floating, both were laying on the bottom in shallow water. Also found a huge 10 1/4" golden shiner.
Roundup has no residual and breaks down almost immediately with soil contact (edit - after doing some looking it is tied up and rendered ineffective but not broken down. That takes a little longer). Even dirty water in the spray tank will deactivate it. Not saying it couldn't do it because I do not know for sure but I would be surprised if it was the problem. Now atrazine or some of the other residual soil applied herbicides are a different story.
At any rate good luck and hopefully your smaller SMB will make it.
I'm not sure what was sprayed, I just know that the bloom die off happened at the same time weeds in the field next to the pond started to die. There are patches of beans that yellowed up a little bit. My pond is close enough to the field, 25 yards, that on a windy day out of the south the pond would very likely get some drift from spraying. In past years spraying has been hired out to the local coop.
Roundup has no residual and breaks down almost immediately with soil contact (edit - after doing some looking it is tied up and rendered ineffective but not broken down. That takes a little longer). Even dirty water in the spray tank will deactivate it. Not saying it couldn't do it because I do not know for sure but I would be surprised if it was the problem. Now atrazine or some of the other residual soil applied herbicides are a different story.
At any rate good luck and hopefully your smaller SMB will make it.
POEA is toxic to aquatic species like fish and amphibians. As other surfactants as well, it can affect membrane transport and can often act as a general narcotic.[4]
In laboratory experiments POEA has a half-life in soils of less than 7 days. Washout from soil is assumed to be minimal, and the estimated half-life in bodies of water would be about 2 weeks. Field experiments have shown that the half-life of POEA in shallow waters is about 13 hours, "further supporting the concept that any potential direct effects of formulated products on organisms in natural waters are likely to occur very shortly post-treatment rather than as a result of chronic or delayed toxicity."[4]:96
A review of the literature provided to the EPA in 1997 found that POEA was generally more potent in causing toxicity to aquatic organisms than glyphosate, and that POEA becomes more potent in more alkaline environments.
No more dead fish today so far, water is still a brownish tea color but looking slightly better, my aerator is still running 24/7. This morning at sunrise I had a 16" SMB sitting in less than a foot of water in the shallow end of the pond away from the aerator, he spooked off but returned within a minute and just sat there until I moved but it looked stressed. I checked later and it was no longer sitting shallow. I have had some weather related DO sags in the past where I have observed some of my SMB sit in very shallow water next to the bank while while DO was low, basically parked next to the bank sitting there moving water through their gills. The two dead SMB I found yesterday weren't floating but laying on the bottom in the shallow end of the pond. This mornings observation tells me that my current diffuser isn't quite covering all of my pond, plans are to install a second diffuser in the shallow end in the next week or two.
Shorty, I wonder if SMB may be more sensitive to low DO than LMB. SMB are adapted to cooler water, which can have more dissolved O2 and other gases than warm water.
My recollection is that SMB are more sensitive to low DO than LMB. I'm seriously thinking of stocking some LMB this fall for that reason and to get my GSH numbers down.
Shorty, I'm very sorry this happened. I always enjoy seeing your brown beauties, and I hope the additional diffuser stops all this.
Just an afterthought, but do you have any neighbors that would have been downwind also? If your grass is dying, then maybe theirs is too. At least that might help confirm what happened.
Last edited by FireIsHot; 07/07/1806:08 PM. Reason: afterthought
Let's not jump to conclusions. Pesticides are detectable in water if present. No need to speculate. Get a water test if you are convinced they are the problem. If you are correct, then others will likely need to pay for the tests and compensate your losses. If you are wrong, then you will pay for the tests. That is how things should work.
I am absolutely positive this was from the herbicde application, I have seen a handful of summertime DO sags and a strong cold front wasn't the cause of this. So far this has been limited to 11 dead SMB, 1 dead wiper, and a half dozen dead golden shiners. Is it worth filing a complaint and paying for testing over a dozen dead game fish? Seriously? Had the whole pond gone belly up I would be screaming and hollering and you bet I would get after the cash renter farming the land next to the pond, but on the grand scale of things this ranks as a "bummer" and not worth the time to make a major issue out of a minor fish kill. This isn't the first time I have personally seen herbicide applications drift way outside of the area where they were applied around here, some guys simply don't wait for the wind to die down before applying chemicals.
I'm a bit shocked at your overabundance of golden shiners.
I would think an 18-20" smallie would clean up on shiners 8" or less in size.
Excerpt from Robert Crais' "The Monkey's Raincoat:" "She took another microscopic bite of her sandwich, then pushed it away. Maybe she absorbed nutrients from her surroundings."
Just an afterthought, but do you have any neighbors that would have been downwind also? If your grass is dying, then maybe theirs is too. At least that might help confirm what happened.
Nope, no nieghbors within a 1/4 mile, it's just the grass along the edge of the field that got burned, my yard is fine. In years past it is not uncommon to see some of the small wild Chinese elm trees along our driveway on the property line die after they spray. That doesn't bother me, but if they get part of my alfalfa field I will raise hell about it.
In Indiana, I believe the state chemist will do testing on their dime if a suspected herbicide drift is reported. No real need to speculate in my neck of the woods. Once results are in, the state will follow up with the applicator if warranted. This just helps prevent further problems.
I'm not sure what the process here would be, Nebraska does not have a state chemist. We do have locally elected NRD boards (Natural Resource Districts) and the Nebraska Department of Environmental Quality. I will ask around and be better prepared just in case it happens again.
Many who live in the cities don't know their neighbors but I have found it not to be the same in the country where most of us have a pond. If it were me, I would be talking to the neighbor who is suspected of spraying. I would not be a jerk but would ask him not to spray when the wind is from a certain direction. I am not saying he would do what I asked but he might. If he is an ass, then I might carry things a little further. It Depends! I have one neighbor who if he set's foot on my place the local Sheriff will get a call about trespassing. He started it by being an arse! lol
Last edited by TGW1; 07/08/1806:01 AM.
Do not judge me by the politicians in my City, State or Federal Government.
