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Thanks, Sir. You make sense. Lord willing, there will be fewer "hogs" at the trough next year!!! smile


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Grab a mower or other piece of machinery that needs to be winterized and head over to Total Outdoor Power in Freedom, Indiana and bend Tonys ear. wink grin


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3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).
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When it comes to fish or ponds...bend away. If I can help, I'm happy to do so. I don't mind getting wet, muddy, or cold, I like it when my hands and clothes smell like fish, I'm happy to bait your hook AND take your fish off, and I don't mind getting out to open and close the gate.

One thing though...if Rainman or esshup pay you a visit, and/or if future plans call for a shock boat, I want a piece of the action. I would hate to miss out on an adventure of that caliber.

Thanks for the shout out Scott! cool


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Originally Posted By: Tooger Smith
I am new here. This site seems the best place to get help.

The lake is located in Greene Co, IN, near Bloomfield, which is about 80 miles southwest of Indianapolis. I built the lake in 1998. It is about 30 acres. It was built in a flat valley so the average depth is about 5-6 feet. There is about 4-5 acres only 1-3 feet deep. Near the dam it is about 10 feet. I stocked it with the usual large mouth bass, crappie, blue gill, red ear, channel catfish and pounds of minnows.

It worked wonderfully. For years it was incredible fishing. Catching several large bass was normal. We ate some of the fish. Then about 3-4 years ago, we got coontail in the lake.
It took over except in the deep part. We put amurs in and they cleared it nicely. However, now we are catching bass but seldom any large ones. (The record bass was 9 lb 2 oz caught about 6 years ago.) Periodically we will catch a 4-6 lb. now. I also now realize that the decline was over a period of time, not suddenly. Over the years, there has never been caught a really large blue gill. The largest crappie was 2 lbs, last year. The cat fish are about 7 lbs, tho we seldom catch one since we do not fish for them. Several hang around the dock where I feed them every few days. They get the filet fish left overs.

Can a lake that age and size be restored to its "youth" when it produced so many large bass? I had not fished before I built this lake. I realize now that I have been spoiled!!!
When it was at its best, I once caught 2 four pound LMB on a single cast with my chug bug lure. Really, the preacher and my son were with me! smile

Thank you. Tooger Smith


I don't know why but I've never fed my CC's fileted fish carcasses (sp). Will the CC's eat everything you give them?

I'll tell you one thing though..... we've got some of the fattest coons around here from me throwing fish carcasses out in the fields laugh laugh laugh....

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My catfish fight over them. However, it dawned on me (a little late) that I should have been throwing the carcasses to the crawfish in my crawfish ponds. Being a Cajun from birth and 18 years in the SW LA, I did build two little ponds to raise them up here. Up here you use them for bait, but down there we eat them!! I've gotten three "messes" this year. The full meal deal requires about 15 lbs....I am getting hungry even as I type. Lord willing, in about a month they should be ready in LA. (15 lbs live weight!!)

Speaking of catfish, we had stocked them as scavengers... was this right, or should be try to remove them? Do the turtles do the same either harm or good?

Again, I appreciate this site. Maybe next year some of you can come help me rebalance the lake. Sounds like a dirty job, but someone has to do it!! smile

Take care.


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Since fish really don't typically have mouths to tear fish apart, they have to eat the fish whole (at least the ones that are usually found here in North America). Once catfish (I'm talking about channel cats here) reach about 3#, they compete directly with LMB for food, switching their diet over to mostly live fish.

So, it all depends on your goals on whether to keep them in the pond or not!

If your goal is to raise as large of a LMB in the pond as possible, then they are taking up space, and eating food that the LMB could utilize better to meet your goal.


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Turtles will scavenge. Any live fish they take are already near dead....or just really stupid.



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Larger bass (over 1-2#) that are relocated rarely do very well in a new environment. Most likely because they do not have a hiding spot staked out or know how to stalk/hunt well in a new environment.



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Rainman
Nobody told the bass that were "dumped into my pond" that they wouldn't do good,fact they are doing to good! Eating up everything in sight. Lol laugh to keep from crying.

Pat W

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Originally Posted By: Pat Williamson
Rainman
Nobody told the bass that were "dumped into my pond" that they wouldn't do good,fact they are doing to good! Eating up everything in sight. Lol laugh to keep from crying.

Pat W


Quite a bit of difference putting LMB in where none are established over adding adults into an area with other established adults...sux your water got "helped out", Pat!

Last edited by Rainman; 11/09/14 01:27 PM.


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Just a little bump in the road . Every one I catch is 10# CNBG that will feed other stuff. So I will pick at them till I get a handle on this problem. Plus gonna put 1000 CNBG more into the mix


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Greetings everyone....I am back from La. Actually 5 weeks now, but have been busy building a house with my son.

Regarding the lake.... I have come to the conclusion that the main reason my catching of large bass has diminished is that the channel catfish I put in (in the original stocking 17 years ago)have taken over. So the first thing I am doing is working on getting rid of the catfish. I have put in two troutlines. To date we have caught 46 of the big cats. They all weigh in at about 6-7 lbs. (We have also caught some 12 or so large snappers and at least that many little yellow bellies.) I am thinking of having church groups come and fish for catfish. Some one had mentioned boy scouts. Any suggestions?

Also, are the big catfish territorial? I started the troutlines near the dock. That slacked off, so I moved it across the lake to a new spot. The next morning, I had 14 big cats on a 24 hook troutline. The day after, I baited the line again. The next morning there was only one yellow belly. So, do the catfish tend to stay on one area of the lake? Another thing, those I use to feed at the dock, we have caught. And now, nothing comes to eat the feed. What do you think?

Again, thanks for all your input. Learning is fun.

Tooger


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What made you think it was the catfish taking over??? My conclusion was when u had the coontail u got some heavy successful bass spawns then when u put in those stupid grass carp (like they did in my 60acre lake here in Fishers In) they got rid of all the habitat now you have all this exposed forage and all those recent bass and they eat up all their food and start to stunt out. The catfish don't help but if you had enough forage it wouldn't matter cause there would be plenty of food to go around, still think u should shock and remove bass.

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Now that is a thought.
Wouldn't it still help to get rid of the catfish?
I am thinking about the shock route.
Thanks for your input. Any thought on the "grouping" of the catfish?
Interestingly enough, 14 was the number caught at the dock.

Tooger


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FWIW I read an article/or saw a video by Bob Lusk not too long ago that catfish send out some kind of warning signal when they get caught to the other cats. Maybe the others just stay away from that area for a while?


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Tooger-thats what happened to my lake in 2005-2007 my lake had lots of water stargrass (60acre gravel pit) fishing was good bass very fat, homeowners wanted all weeds gone enter 250 lovely grass carp + chemicals, weeds all killed. The next 2 years fishing was off the charts, why best guess was those bass had lots of easy meals as tons of black crappie, gizzard shad, bluegill had no place to hide people were catching 4-7lbers easily. This lasted 2 summers then all of a sudden no big fish just an occasional 5lber, now its 2015 tonight I caught 20 bass in an hour all 12-15 inches and kept them all. Having lake shocked next week to get this thing fixed, really sad.

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Actually Ive had grass carp ruin my favorite fishing lake as a child, a 30 acre lake in Terre Haute and now they have ruined my current lake, those fish are a complete disaster and should be banned.

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Grass carp are a tool that has to be managed and used judiciously. They don't have an off button so they have to be managed/eliminated as needed.

They're about like tequila. Ya gotta know when to apply the brakes.


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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I'm with Dave. Fish management is just that - management. If one is of the "dump em' in and forget em'" mindset, there will probably be issues. Grass carp absolutely have a role to fill in a great many ponds and lakes.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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200 grass carp are VERY difficult to remove, they are wary, smart, hook shy, and big. There is no science to them unless someone would like to show my a scientific journal article it's all anecdotal, but I could be wrong. Nobody can even tell me how long they live, I hear 5 years, 10 years, 15 years, 20+ years who knows. I hear they become less efficient as they age is that proven. I would like to know of some lakes where Grass Carp were introduced and the fishing got better for the next 10 years and how many were introduced, the BOW size and the type of weed they were put in to control, based on what you hear and when you talk to fisheries experts like I did hear with Indiana DNR they are a pure disaster.

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I personally believe that shotguns cure a lot of problems. But not grass carp.

I have used a 22 quite effectively with a fish feeder. When they come up to feed, pop them from a distance. I personally prefer calibri sans poudre.


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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I personally believe that shotguns solve a lot of problems. But not grass carp.

I have used a 22 quite effectively with a fish feeder. When they come up to feed, pop them from a distance. I personally prefer calibri sans poudre.


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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Not that I have ever seen.

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So I just looked up "how many grass carp to stock/acre" and found anywhere from 5-10, ok so in my 60 acre lake that would be 300-600 well listen I'm telling you they put in 225-250 and there has not been a single strand of vegetation for 8 years. So what is it? I'll tell you what it is it's a pure guess sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't, sorry but I'm a dentist and that's not how I treat my patients or in this case "manage" a lake. Grass carp are a way for hatcheries to make money.

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Dig through the archives here. Grass carp can be an effective, biological control for certain types of aquatic growth when used accordingly. I have absolutely noticed they slow down on control when they get older, which is why most recommend removing those fish and replacing with smaller, younger individuals.

As a fellow Hoosier, I too have had many a discussion with the officials in our IDNR. I would only say to be sure and seek out other, professional opinions. I wouldn't place all of my eggs into the IDNR's basket....my experience has been they seem a few years removed from modern practice.

I understand that you are angry, and upset. But you portray your opinion as fact, rather than opinion. I would suggest reading through the archives, and making an educated decision. Are grass carp for every BOW and every situation? Of course not, no more than a root canal fits the bill for every patient. But it remains an option in some cases, no?


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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