Pond Boss Forums MANAGING AN EXISTING POND Evaluating and adjusting fish populations What ought not be there - a mussel

There has been former discussion of the possibility of birds, tornados, human intervention and whatever to bring fish and other creatures into a BOW that were not specifically stocked in the BOW.

Well I found this on the water edge of my pond. This pond was created new in 2013 so I would have to assume there is no possible way for this 4" long mussel to have came from growing in my pond. So some critter brought it there. I am suspecting it came from the small creek behind this pond. There is a resident muskrat that lives there and frequents my pond that I have yet had the opportunity to see to its permanent discouragement from being there.

So if a dead shell that size can show up in my pond, I have to assume live things can get there that way also. I'm guessing if the muskrat brought it there it does not carry dead shells around for the fun of it. I assume it brought it there live and ate it.

How far away is the pond from the creek? How far is the vertical drop for high water overflow? You might be shocked at what can swim upstream in some very turbulent waters....

Any chance it came from an upstream pond?

Muskrats are vegetarians.. However coons love mussels

Muskrats love mussels also. If you find shells further out in the water, it could be a 'rat. If the shells are at the water's edge, it could be a 'coon.

'Rats will tend to carry mussels to a fixed place where they can get out above the water, before consuming them. This spot is called a midden, and it will often have a pile of shells to identify it, rather than just a few.

From what I've read sprk they only eat meat or protien in times of desperation when no vegetation is present, not usually common in a pond situation.. and I thought a midden was somewhere close to there den or "territory" on bank? I could be wrong it's been along time since I read about rats but I read quite abit about them working my old job..


Also snrub are you concerned about the mussels in your pond?

I've always considered muskrats to be omnivorous and opportunistic. Perhaps the bulk of their diet is plant material, but they will not hesitate to take advantage of an easy meal.

A midden may well be on the bank, but ny no means does it have to be. They will search out, and sometimes even construct, a midden where they feel the need. It's usually right at the water, often just above the surface.

These guys are considering using muskrats to target Zebra Mussels!:
http://www.cazlake.org/pages/Misc/muskrats.html

I have them in my pond and that started me researching. I found that the mussels generally come from the fish hatchery. As tiny flukes, they hitch a ride attached to the fish. When they get large enough, they drop off.

Rainman zero chance from upstream ponds. We live on top of a hill and we had to bring a terrace in from our adjacent farm land field to get adequate watershed to keep the pond filling in a decent manner. No more than 15 acres total watershed for this 3 acre pond. That is a guess, I need to actually measure it some day. Would be pretty easy to do cause I know where the water breaks everywhere. That small watershed would not work if we did not get an average rainfall of 42 inches a year and some of it comes in significant rainfall events.

Water has not covered the overflow pipe on the back side of the dam since last year some time. Probably a year ago last spring. 8" Overflow pipe runs down at about maybe a 30 degree angle. Do you think bullheads or GSF could swim up my overflow pipe when it is running? I have been concerned about that, and have a large grate I could put over the inlet to the pipe. I know them little fish can swim against some pretty stiff current when they want to. During high rainfall events the small seasonal creek behind the dam will run high enough to cover the outlet of the pond overflow pipe, at exactly the same time water would be likely flowing out the pipe.

I have an already made 14" wide by 12" deep by 24" long 1" expanded metal box that I could cover the pipe with pretty easily.

In the picture you can see where the outlet is as what looks like a small patch of concrete rip-rap on the back side of the dam at the creek. On the pond side there is a tiny patch of concrete visable where I enclosed the end of the PVC pipe in concrete. About mid way along the dam on the portion that follows the creek.

Hmmmmm. Of course they do. Why didn't I think of that possibility? I also have done some reading about them brought about by my interest in RES. That makes perfect sense. I also wondered if fish delivery was a good way to get filamentous algae and other undesirable things in the pond.

But no way one could have grown to that size in a little over a year........ is there? My original fish stocking was March 2013. As I recall, mussels live many years and the ridges in their shells are kind of like rings are to trees, measuring their seasons of growth. This mussel must have been many years old I would think. We have lots of them in the main creek for our area watershed that is only a quarter mile away from this pond. The small seasonal stream that runs behind my pond feeds into this main creek.

Thanks guys for the discussion on muskrats. Interesting stuff. Could have been a raccoon also. have noticed coon tracks on and off since the pond was built and only had a puddle of water in the bottom during the initial fill. With rock all the way around the pond now, harder to notice coon tracks but we have plenty of them in the neighborhood. Coon hunting with hounds has been a local passtime for as long as I can remember and we see regular coon roadkill during mating season.

Am I concerned about mussels in the pond? Not really. I figure if they are going to get there, there is not much I could do about it anyway. So I try not to worry about things I can't control. With my interest in RES, stocking RES, and trying to grow RES in a forage pond for additional stocking as years go by my hopes are that the RES will keep the snail and mussel population under control (obviously when the mussels are small enough). Mussels are supposed to clear the water, so that could be a good or bad thing depending on the need and situation at hand. They can also be hard on the feet for swimming but I usually wear neoprene diving booties but my grandkids usually do go bare foot. I would probably like the idea of having them in the pond if they weren't a fish parasite for part of the portion of their life.

Heck I used to like to see GBH till I paid good money to stock a pond and the GHB look at my fish like a smörgåsbord.

My older brother is kind of a creek rat/native American enthusiast type (belongs to a tribe, flint knaps, built his own tee-pee, has tanned hides, teaches bow building, etc.) and has tried to eat mussels a couple times. Said he could never get them to taste like anything other than mud.

If you're swimming in your pond, be careful walking out. Those broken shells are like shards of glass sometimes.

I had mussel shells all close together with the pearl side up at the edge of my pond. I haven't see any signs of muskrats but had seen coon foot prints. A week ago my dog Dolly tied into a coon at the pond and it was all over with in a couple of minutes.

All over for the dog or the coon? A big male coon has the potential to kill a good sized coon dog that is used to fighting coons, especially if it is a one on one situation.

X2

I've seen big coons shot, fall through a tree crashing into limbs all the way down, and still manage to get up and put on a pretty good demonstration of how to whip a couple of large coon dogs waiting at the base.

Here's what you need to control varmints around you pond.
Great Pyrenees cattle guard dogs will be instant death for foxes, coons, bobcats and otters to boot.
Brutus took care of a pit bull that had one on Jeff's goats by her throat - grabbed the pit bull by the neck and shook like a rag doll until released the goat. Both goat and pit bull had to be put down.
Great dogs - gentle as house cat - they will run up to us and lay their head in laps to be petted.
G/

I second the Great Pyrenees. They will attack at coyote at the drop of a hat. We had a pair of Pyrenees that just about tore out the bottom of a wood frame house trying to get out from under it when a pack of coyotes came up to the field behind the house. We did not know these gentle giants would attach a pack of coyotes until that day. Both dogs were full of dried blood the next day, worried to death we washed them down not to find a single womb what so ever.

Sorry snrb, did not mean to run off with your thread....

I must agree on the Great Pyrenees. There is no other breed of dog I would trust more to protect a family, especially small children. They will protect whatever you give them to protect, be it animals, property, or family.

Is that a mussel or Asiatic clam?

I don't know, but it looks like to my untrained eye the same type of mussels I've seen for years in our local creek.

I looked up some information on mussels a while back and locally we are supposed to have a number of different varieties in this area. But that shell looks like something I've seen since I was a kid (and it has been a long time since I was a kid)

So I kind of doubt it is anything invasive or exotic.

The mussel in snrub's pond was very likely one called a giant floater (Pyganodon grandis) a common mussel in creeks and ponds in the Midwest US. There are other similar looking mussels that it could be. Most mussel species live in streams & rivers not ponds. Only a few are adapted to life in a pond.

I did not know native mussels could live in ponds. Thanks for the info!

Just a question about the Great Pyrenees, are both the male and female just as protective?

At one time my son had two male and one female Great Pyrenees livestock guard dogs. The female was as good or better than the males. Now only Uno and Brutus remain and they often fight when they get jealous over attention - it's not a pretty sight and they are kept apart right now.
G/

I did not think the mussel could have come out of my pond, as young as the pond is. Today was doing some installation of air lines and had the scuba gear on checking some stuff out. I followed one air line out towards the initially installed diffuser and while running my hand along the line I ran into something that felt like a rock in the mud bottom but it felt smooth. Picked it up and sure enough, it was a mussel that could have been a twin to the empty shell found on the bank on the opposite side of the pond.

So sure enough, I do have mussels. Don't know where they came from or how they got there, but finding a live one in the pond pretty well establishes that the other dead one also came out of the pond. Was in about 4' of water and about 4" long. I can't imagine it growing to that size in the less than two years since the pond was dug. That was the only one I found, but was not particularly trying to find more, and the water has only 2' visibility. I left it there.