Pond Boss Forums STOCKING A NEW POND Types of fish to choose excessive fish loss in new pond?

So we just dug a new 1/3 acre pond at our house last August. It filled with water this spring so we debated abotu when to stock it, and we just did so last saturday (june 8) on the last fish day for spring in Columbus, Ohio. It seems like we are losing a lot of fish... maximum depth is 12 feet, with a pea gravel lined shallow end and a beach so it will be nice for swimming. We put in fish structures and we have an aerator/bubbler system running..water temp at the surface is 78 degrees--too warm? I'm really concerned why all the fish might be dying. It's mostly minnows and redear sunfish (33 since saturday out of 200), a few bass... anyone have any ideas? Am I doing something wrong?

Has the rate of death slowed down (perhaps indicating poor health or injury when stocked)?

Is the water still muddy from the fill?
If so, it could be the fish are having a hard time adjusting to the new environment, in addition to possible poor health at stocking

It did seem like less died yesterday, and I'll be able to monitor more today and this weekend... I hope it's slowing down. Yes, the water seems muddy still...

natureluverz: Welcome to the Pond Boss forum. I hope your fish do well and that you develop a successful fishery. I am a big advocate of sharing information here on Pond Boss and a big believe that the more we know about each other's ponds the better advice we can give. It would be nice to know a little about your pond and what your goals for it are: how old, how deep, how big, if you want big fish, a diverse fishery, etc. It would be nice to know what fish you put in, how many, etc.

natureluverz: Welcome to the Pond Boss forum. I hope your fish do well and that you develop a successful fishery. I am a big advocate of sharing information here on Pond Boss and a big believe that the more we know about each other's ponds the better advice we can give. It would be nice to know a little about your pond and what your goals for it are: how old, how deep, how big, if you want big fish, a diverse fishery, etc. It would be nice to know what fish you put in, how many, etc.

If you bought your fish from a fish truck, often they are battered around pretty good before you got you hands on them...

78 degrees is not ideal but not overly warm to stock fish. If by minnows, you mean FHM(fatheads) they are often really beat around. RES are a bit of a sensitive species as well.

What species did you stock and how many of each?

As CJ says: Fish from fish truck can get beaten up quite a bit before you get them and who knows how many times they were handled and how they were handled before loaded onto the truck. Lots of unknowns. RES are IMO rather intolerant to rough and extended handlings. Water above 70F for fish handling is also quite stressful to most all pond species in IMO. They could have been on the truck for several days before you picked them up at the delivery station. Expect a significant number of deaths and know that only about 1/2 of those that died will float. If larger fish are in the pond then most of the stressed out ones become fish food. This is why I would never buy fish off a truck. It is like buying your medicines frm out of the back of a car or truck. You have no recourse if fish die. Local fish farms will often replace dead fish - not fish trucks. I think it is always best to go get your fish from a fish farm or have them delivered directly. As you are learning, fish from an out of state fish truck is risky business. Buyer beware.

One aspect I don't like about fish truck fish in addition to that mentioned above is they are often on the truck a long time - days. Not good for survival. Short term stress can be overcome by well conditioned fish - long term stress is a killer.

I've had good results (as in 0 morts) when a fish supplier has driven directly to the pond and the fish have gone from the truck to the pond. I have had 95% Morts when that same supplier took fish off of the truck, bagged them and I drove 1 hr 15 minutes back to the pond. Maybe it's me, but I won't use the bag and transport system for anything over 1/2 hr. Maybe bagging them and putting them in a box where it's completely dark is the difference? I don't know for sure - the bagged fish that I transported were in bags in 5 gal buckets.

I have never lost a bagged and boxed fish from Overton and never heard of a loss from anyone. I believe Todd guarantees live delivery up to 5 hours IIRC

Email from Todd:
Sure. Those bags seem small though..

How many gallons of water can you put in one of these minnow bags? My guess is 1 gallon. This would accommodate 1 lb of fish. Double bagging good idea for these small bags.

I recommend the 15x15x31" square bottom bags available from boat cycle. They will accomodate 8lbs tilapia for that trip. Transport these lg bags in ice chests. A 40qt chest holds one bag. A 120qt chest holds two bags. Rubbermade tubs also work for these bags. We use 1 tbsp rock salt in each lg bag. Half dose of clove oil if you have experience with it. Otherwise not necessary.

Its an equation. Oxygen in water (concentration and volume) and use by the fish (respiration). Less fish + cooler temps + less time = better survival. More fish + warmer temps + longer time = poor survival. I have had good luck with bagged fish put in an oxygen-charged bag during early spring with a two hour trip (minimal losses). The hatchery that I used leaves a certain headspace to be sure the O2 lasts. I have also had fish delivered from a hatcher quite a ways off with excellent survival. I assume they aerate the water constantly.

Ditto. I've always had my best luck picking up the fish myself from the farm whether it be oxygen bags, coolers with mechanical aeration, or my larger tank I have mounted on the truck.

I used to get fish about 2 1/2 hours away in Michigan and at 25 per bag with oxygen never had any problems.

That said I hate hauling fish as it's stressful and wastes a lot of my valuable time running two businesses. I've moved toward producing all my fish with trout the final species to produce myself. I may produce my own tilapia which shouldn't be very difficult.

George, that's what the problem is - Overtons isn't up here!

Cecil, I got LMB from the same place, 6"-8", 25 per bag and the drive was only 15 minutes longer than yours. ALL the fish were belly up on the bottom of the bags, mouths open, and where their gill flaps come together at the underside of the fish it was colored blue. The supplier (you know who) had me run to the local store and put 4" of ice on the bottom of each 5 gal bucket, then the bags with fish/O2 went on top of the ice.

The fish were stiff like boards. I slowly warmed up the water, and bent the fish back and forth to get them limber. 110 of 125 uprighted themselves and after 1/2 hr in a cage swimming around I released them into the pond. They swam off, but I have no idea if they actually survived - I will know more in the next few days.

I've never lost fish using the bag-box system and a drive 3.5-4hrs although I used a different fish farm which can make a world of difference as to how things are done. Cool air temps (50F-60F) with cool hauling water makes a big difference in fish survival. Lower air temps and water temps allow for higher percent saturation of DO in the hauling water. The next important item is to not crowd fish in the bag. As some are learning, it is much better to have fewer fish per box and arrive with healthy fish compared to crowded fish and arriving with stressed or dead fish. Hauling fish is a science and an art.

Yeah you told me about that. Never had any problems myself.

One aspect I did not see mentioned (unless I missed it) is a difference in water temps from the water in the delivery method to when the fish were introduced into the pond.

Were they acclimated correctly?
What was the difference in water temps between the delivery water and pond water?

I'm new at this but I think I remember my fish-guy being concerned about the difference in temps from the tanks in his truck and the temp of water in my pond, and he was delivering from only 40 miles away with only one stop before reaching my place. He based his delivery of my fish on the time of day our water temps would be similar. He then took a lot of time acclimated them to my pond water. I had no morts, unless they sank of course. Even then he gave me 10% more of each species just in case.

Do I remember correctly that even a 5 degree difference could be stressful?

Just a thought.

Different species are more sensitive than others. My experience is HSB are very sensitive as well as trout. CC are probably least sensitive.

George1,

[I have never lost a bagged and boxed fish from Overton and never heard of a loss from anyone. I believe Todd guarantees live delivery up to 5 hours IIRC]

Actually Overton's guarantees live delivery up to 7 hours. I have actually hit 6.5 hours after acclamation before releasing into my pond with no morts.

Couppe

I would go to the bank on anything Todd Overton says!
Thanks,
George

Testimony. Here is a thread of pond owner that hauled juvenile LMB in Mid June with no problems. Outdoorl247 - How far of a drive was it? It can be done when everything is done correctly - starting with very healthy fish.
http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=340255#Post340255

At work so kinda quick read thread...

Google had my drive time fishery at 2h 48m....LIARS...

Okay back to what matters...I picked 40 5" to 8" LMB (most 8"+), 115 2" to 4" RES (most on the 2" side) and 10lbs of FHM.. All were bagged as I waited because of the drive time...3 bags for LMB, 3 bags for FHM and 1 bag for RES...

I hauled them in 35 gallon rubber made tubs in the cab of the truck with the AC on all the way home..Took about 3.5 hours of drive time...

Threw bags in pond for maybe a half hour to equalize water temp..Hauled one bag of FHM to Dianes pond to introduce for forage and survival...

Released fish and as of this morning no signs of morts except a few FHM that were not looking well when released..