Pond Boss Forums POND CONSTRUCTION Selecting a site So you want to build a pond??

First off, what a great site. I am running through all this great info trying to take it all in at once...what a vast supply of knowledge (and humor).
I am going to accomplish my dream, even if it kills me. (typed with a smile) Ponds were a big part of my youth (fishing, trapping, learning to swim)and I want a pond to be a big part of the other end of the scale on my life and the youth end of my grandchildren's. I may be the poster boy for how not to build a pond, and I am going to need much advice before this is through.
My pond is finished in terms of built and collecting water, but it was delayed enough that I haven't got all of the structure in place, or the dock for that matter. Come spring I need advice on how to begin the stocking to prep for an eventual LMB, BG, and Red Ear population. Instead of beginning this process in the fall I will now be looking at the spring thaw. My topsoil is not fully in place so nothing got seeded and I expect some erosion and silt accumulation in the spring.
My county requires all ponds to be approved by Soil & Water, and they develop the site plan, require test holes, do soil evaluation, issue the permit and check that it is finished according to their satisfaction. They are understaffed, hard to find, prone to cancelling appointments, and it took many weeks before they decided to deny the permit with no discussion of how we might fix their suspected problem. There was a 6" layer in one corner of the site at a depth of 6' that had 20% fine sand and 80% clay. It worried them. They refused to listen to possible solutions, clay packing, trenching and keying or anything. They turned it over to the Township who said it wasn't a problem and go ahead. With the pond 3/4 dug the Twp guy said no wait, I think you need a permit (requiring a civil engineer's approved plan) or you can fill it back in, or in a month I will turn it over to the County Prosecutor...... With 2 months of delays and an engineer and his expensive plan, and a clay packed trench dug through the suspect zone, I have my pond.
So now that I have fought through the red tape, I can finally start thinking about the stocking, the structure, and the finish grading and planting in the spring.
So the first of many questions, if I get forage fish in place early in the spring will I be able to stock the rest by the end of the summer, or will I need to wait longer to get the base of the food chain better established?
Thanks

Penny7, Welcome!

First off, how patient are you? While it might have been better to stock the forage fish in the Fall (it gives them a leg up over fish stocked in the Spring) you might be able to offset that with a slightly heavier stocking rate this Spring. One thing to consider in regards to the fish that you want to stock this Fall or next Spring is: Will they be available in the sizes and quantities that you want at that time? Usually the suppliers have a better supply in the Spring than in the Fall.

Welcome P7, what size is the pond?

A couple of steps to consider prior to stocking involve water quality. Without the grass, a good rain could bring in a lot of mud effecting fertility. I wouldn't stock fish until the environment is right for them. Not just regarding suspended clay/sand but until your planktonic base is right. When your pond visibility is about 18 to 24 inches, not considering debris of any kind, it is safe to stock. You still have time so keep asking questions.

In Ohio, your pond may be frozen over or not. If it is, and the ice is safe, you can pretty well lay the structure where you want it and wait for it to sink.

Wow Penny7 sounds like you were put through the wringer. I'm glad to hear that it worked out for you though.

I ,of course, want it all and want it now, but am very capable of being patient. I do not like wasted effort so I would rather proceed slowly and do it right rather than jump in and end up repeating the process.
The plan was to finish the pond early in the fall, sow wheat or rye to hold the soil through the winter, put structure in place, catch some water and get some forage fish in before the winter arrived. In the early spring I intended to seed tall grass prairie seed through the wheat. The delays meant that we didn't complete excavation on time. I got 2 pallet structures and several rock piles in place, staying ahead of the rising water. The topsoil didn't get replaced in time to seed anything. I have added some structure on the ice and will let it drop with the thaw so that is not really a problem.
This is a 2-3 year lead in to a retirement relocation so I was looking to have the pond functional for fishing, wildlife, aesthetics, recreation, and fire prevention, but I have a little time.

Dave,
Thanks for the info. The pond is 3/4 acre. The majority is 10' deep with a 30x30 "hole" to about 18'. There are benches and shelf structures at all depths with a broad flat along one side that is about 6-8' deep. Near the center is a small submerged island that will have about 6' of water over it. Once I get some artificial structure in place it should be good to go. It has water up to about 6' below outlet level, and we just got more snow. Now it is wait for the plankton I guess.

Thanks. When the stuff was crashing down and I wasn't sure I was going to be able to pull this off I looked at the photos of some of the ponds you guys have put together. It was enough to make me realize that it is definitely worth the fight and the hassle.

goals for the pond will determine when to stock predators.
I had to stock out of season as you. Similar sized pond, stocked with 600 bluegill and redear in March. I began to see BG beds in June.(in the southeast though) I stocked LMB in Aug. and HSB in Sept.
I didnt want the BG to get too far ahead of the bass so as they could not be conrolled, BUT, I was aiming more toward a better BG environment, and the bass as the controlling media.

If you want giant bass as many people do, then wait til fall for bass, or, even late next spring. Just remember that 3/4 acre will support only a small number of large bass.

Thanks BM
One of my pond goals is to fish for fun and occasionally for the table. I have no problem eating a bunch of BG as opposed to a couple bigger bass. I grew up fishing bass farm ponds and didn't learn to appreciate BG till much later. And BG smiles will be just as good as LMB smiles to the grandkids. I do still like to have a lunker on the line now and then but can easily downsize the gear and have great fun with nice BG. So nice BG population with a few big bass for control is just fine.
Were you starting from scratch or did you have forage fish in place for the BG to eat?
Did you go with 600 total or 600 each BG and Redear?
Is it likely that I will have enough phytoplankton in place to throw in a bunch of FHM in early spring after thaw and then follow in March/April with the BG/RES and then LMB in August/Sept?
Every bit of info I get leads to more questions..
I also have to account for the fact that I am close enough to the big temp moderator (Lake Erie) that my fall temps last long, but so do the winter ones. Everything gets shifted toward later in the year by a few weeks.
I appreciate the input.

I actually put in 600 BG(300 coppernose in mar. and 300 straight bg in apr.)this was in '08, and 100 redear; a little overstocked, but I knew I was also overstocking bass and HSB and wanted a good 1st gen. suppply of BG for the grandkids to catch. I stocked a few # of fatheads for the B G to forage on their spawn. But, I also immediately started on a feeding program.(1/8 then 3/16 inch 46% feed) The BG, HSB and LMB have all responded well. I will harvest quite a few LMB and HSB before the LMB spawn to get the biomass # down some. I also aerate so as to be able to feed and keep water quality good. I will fertilize only once and then allow the natural fert. to keep a moderate bloom going into summer.

Thanks. Good stuff to think about. I am hoping to have pretty good control as this should have drainage from my land only. Don't need to worry about fertilizer run-off from fields, etc.
I have a small creek within 500' that I could pump from if I need extra water, but it definitely catches the run-off from the surrounding farmland. There are several vernal pools nearby that should provide a natural source of frogs, salamanders and so on.
Any advantage to coppernose as opposed to straight BG? Also do coppernose do well in my area (N. Central Ohio)?

Coppernose BG will not survive in your area of the country. Northern BG will be the only option...

Thanks, Wasn't familiar with coppernose at all. So much to think about. and it seems, never enough time. Right now I hope to have enough of a base of the food chain come thaw, add some forage fish early, get BG and RE in before summer starts and then attempt the bass late summer/early fall and hope they make it through. I don't want to be overly cautious, but I don't want to waste money either.
It's all good!
Would it be beneficial to "seed" some plankton, fairy shrimp etc from some of the vernal pools I have?

I don't think you have to worry about the plankton, but the neither would hurt the pond. The shrimp ia a great idea.