Pond Boss Forums GENERAL QUESTIONS Pond Boss Is Pork Meat bad for Dogs?

My sister had to take their dog to the vet after it devoured a ham bone. I guess it tore up her inside. It was quite scary for them as they lost another dog (her brother) to a similar incident when he found a deer gut pile and bones and gorged himself. The dog could not be saved. (Lovely neighbors we have)

Anyway, their vet told them that they should never give any type of pork meat to a dog as it causes pancreatitis. (sp)

I have not been able to find any concrete evidence of this on the internet. Also, many diets are formulated with pork for sled dogs, hunting dogs etc... because it builds up muscle mass.

I also ran across some info that indicated that lean pork was the best choice of meat proteins for dogs.

My Luna, Black Lab, loves the little piggies (she knows what piggies means) and I always cook it up specially for her without all the crazy things I put in mine. These are just treats, she has a balanced diet.

The only possible link I can find is the increased use of antibiotics within the pork industry (that is only a guess). But it is also within the beef, chicken and lamb industries as well. I got my head chewed off yesterday for even making any of these suggestions.

I'll be talking to Luna's vet this week, but I thought I would post it here, as there are many dog owners present.

Thanks

Oh Anna!!!!!

FWIW, venison isn't bad per se, there is the possibility of transmitting some nasties to the dogs when the dog eats raw venison that hasn't been frozen for over 30 days, which kills the buggers.

Anything is bad for you in excess, especially if you aren't used to eating it, and I suppose dogs are the same way.

I'll see if I can get Anna to check in here. She's been a bit busy lately.

When I was corresponding with her about switching my dog to a raw diet, she sent me this link that has a lot of good information about raw food for dogs, which might not technically qualify for cooked pork, but it will have a lot of information for you.

While waiting for Anna"s response; I seldom give nor have given any of my dogs pork or pork bones; BUT, it seems like every time I do, they get ill. Whether it is cooked port, bones or broth, it affects them the same. I avoid it altogether now. Just doesnt seem to set well with dogs. I have just finished boiling some beef rib bones(leftovers from human bbq) and put a little broth on their food at times. They love that stuff.

Pork meat is not bad for dogs if cooked, but raw meet of any type from the store can be a killer. We had a dog get samonella from a soup bone. Spices and processed meat like ham can cause problems also. If you kill and process venison in a sanitary manner, here in the upper Midwest, there is little chance of any problems. We lost 4 dogs (2 German Shepards and 2 Norwegian Elk Hounds) of old age at 14 to 15 years old after a long life of eating uncooked venison carcasses and scrap meat and bones. Our current dogs (1 German Shepard and 1 Great Pyrenees) are over 10 and doing fantastic on the same diet. Livestock fed antibiotics are less likely to cause harm than those which are not rid of pathogens killed by these drugs. If you think "all-natural" is safer, good luck! I like my expected life span better than those eating an "all-natural" diet even 100 years ago. Neopaganism is your perogative though since we all have freedom of religion in the the free world.

esshup and burger, thanks. I would also like to hear what Anna has to say, plus as I said earlier, her doctor will be contacted.

I just want Luna, in my care, to have a happy, healthy, and long life. She is my best friend.

RAH, thanks for your response.

Before I begin lets think about commercial pet food. How long has it been around? 60 years or so? How long have dogs lived with us? 15,000 or more years. What did they eat up until 60 years ago?

Dogs are classified as carnivores and in the last few years have been moved to the same classification as wolves. Dogs and wolves only differ in .2% of their DNA and they have the exact same digestive tract. So, to see what's the "Natural" diet for our dogs all we have to do is look at what wolves eat.

From birth dogs and wolves eat raw. Mothers milk is not pasteurized. It's raw. As they grow they eat meat, bones, organs, fallen fruit, berries, nuts, & some grasses.

RAW bones are generally safe to feed. Cooked bone on the other hand is a killer. Raw bone is fully digestible whereas cooked bone is brittle and splinters without breaking down.

In a healthy dog raw food in any form is the healthiest thing to feed. Pork itself does not cause pancreatitis. Fat causes it. Years ago pork was much fattier than it is today. I feed raw pork several times a month without problems. Dogs have a very short, straight, highly acidic digestive tract. The ph of a healthy dog's stomach is typically 1. As the tract is short and straight food is in and out of the system pretty quickly. Dogs are rarely prone to food borne illness. However, in dogs with low gastric motility or other heath issues, raw is not best.

That said, any form of feeding can have it's pitfalls and yes they can choke on bones just as they can choke on dry dog food or tennis balls. There is no absolute safe method of feeding.

If you are going to give your dog a raw diet always start with chicken for the first two weeks to give their system time to develop the enzymes to digest meat. Then gradually move into red meats.

As for that balanced diet thing. It's a myth.

Here's what Randy Wysong, DVM has to say about a "complete and balanced diet":

"A 100% complete processed diet requires:
1. 100% complete knowledge of food.
2. 100% complete knowledge of nutrition.
3. 100% complete knowledge of #1 & #2 requires 100% complete knowledge of every science.
4. Since #1,2 & 3 are not possible, the 100% complete processed diet is a myth." (7)

Balance in our pets diet is achieved the same as in ours. By feeding a variety of many foods over time. Not with each meal. Relax. It's just the pet food companies that want you to think you are not smart enough to feed your dog without them.

I Love my dogs and take plenty of time to cut off all extra deer meat. I fed some raw but we think gas is less if we boil it first. I also have given them goose duck and wild boar. I do nto give them the shoudl der bone but always give them the hip bone as I qtr my meat. They will dig out the marrow for weeks. Never had an issue but like hearing the advice from our resident expert.

Thanks Anna, your comments clarified this issue.

I have heard, that if a dog eat's grasses that they are sick. Luna munches on some tall green grasses on a regular basis, but she is totally fine.

I am going to block everyone from giving her fat and cooked bones.

Thanks again Anna.

Good to have expert's advice. No more cooked bones.
As far as salmonella in processed, handled meats and fowl, do as I always do with any raw meat. Straight from the package to the sink with water and a teaspoon or 2 of bleach. It will kill any of the pathogens. I leave it 10 or so minutes. Same recipe to make water drinkable. No more than 1 teaspoon per gallon, or 1 tablespoon per 5 gal.

Burger, I like your idea but we are talking about animals who can lick their butt and not die from it. Most commercial meat is cleaner than... Well you know! LOL! With a stomach ph of close to 1 bacteria typically doesn't stand a chance of survival and if it does, from nose to tail a raw meal takes 6-8 hours in dogs. Unlike the 12-24 in us. That is why we are much more susceptible to food born pathogens.

All of you feeding wild fish or game PLEASE freeze it for 30 days first. There are some nasty buggers that can make your dog pretty sick. Freezing kills them.

Remind me you to tell the story of my friend Wendy, the free deer, and the red tapeworms. That free deer ended up costing her about $1500.

JKB, Fat is very important for carnivores. Moderation is good but don't try that lowfat stuff on your dog. They don't get cholesterol problems like we do, their systems are completely different and fat does not make your dog fat. Carbohydrates make them chunky.

Also your vet more than likely will be completely against raw feeding. It's sad, but vets, like our doctors are not taught anything about nutrition. Only what Hills puts on for a couple of weeks. Holistic vets are the best resource for nutritional counseling. If you have one in your area they are usually well worth the trip.

BTW, while I'm on fat, everyone please, please remember to increase calories in your outside or indoor outdoor pets during this extreme cold. They need the calories to keep warm. Fat is one of the best ways to do that and actually helps to increase body temperature.

Very nice to have an expert. I trust Anna.

Thanks Burger, I will be pasting all of this info on my puter. I use to have a commercial freezer that went -30F, that would kill most of the nasty's.

All good info. Luna will be 5yo on Feb. 25, and as I said, she is my best friend.

Just don't pull in here with a FedEx truck. Ever see that cartoon with the dog and all the teeth going? USPS and UPS, nary a bark, but interested. FedEx pulls in, she could reinvent the mowhawk.

Thanks all,

Burger,

I had the same experience with the last dog I had. For some reason pork chops made her throw it back up. The present dog I have, we don't feed from the table but I do add tuna fish juice from the can, and broths over her dry dog food from time to time. I absolutely don't feed her any manufactured dog food or treats that are made in China, or if it says "distributed in the U.S." which is another way of saying Made in China. We can't even trust China to sell us safe fish and human food, how can we trust them with our dog food?

One other point: I used to be a meat cutter. If anyone thinks our meat is perfectly safe because it's inspected they are naive. All our meat cannot be inspected. There's just no way. Additionally I've see fecal material on a side of beef more than once when it came to us from the meat packer. We just washed it off.

Oh and one more thing: The CDC says no worries about BSE as long as a meat saw doesn't cut into the spinal column. Huh? How in the heck can you quarter a beef without the cutting through the spinal column? What amazes me is how they got away with this stupid statement in a press conference. No one questioned them on it!

Sorry I guess I got off topic again.

So right Cecil. I've made a point of only carrying US and Canadian products. NOTHING from China in my store or online. I don't trust them and there are several domestic companies that I don't trust either.

I really appreciate your comments, and I know you are busy. But, give this a read: http://www.businessweek.com/ap/financialnews/D9CSGMM80.htm

This is where I connected the dots from pork, antibiotics, and pancreantitis.

I really appreciate the experts view on this subject.

Thanks,
J.

Read the article but could not find a reference to pancreatitis. Did I miss it? Here's a link to a good article on it though. Pancreatitis

HI Anna, the article was more related to the increased use of Antibiotics and how unchecked they are. Another piece of info that I have read related the use, and linked the use of antibiotics in meat animals for dog food, that contributed to the direct cause and inflamed pancreatitis in dog's. But, that was solely based on the amount of antibiotics, that were administered to the food animals that food is created from, and actually cause or inflame the Pancreas In our best friends.

Cecil:

If you are giving the dog commercial broth, keep an eye on the salt content. If not, I'll shut my yap and keep on reading.

Does she go ballistic with any FedEx Truck or just FedEx Home Delivery?

For some reason, Luna has no use for FedEx, whatever flavor it is. It is kinda interesting, but puzzling at the same time. I can't explain it, just don't show up if you smell of FedEx, and that is all I can say, can't explain it.

I'm not sure my Akita does. She has one heck of a fur coat that has lots of downy fur and she's gained some weight on those treats I give her.

She's out there having a good ol' time romping in the snow while her master is freezing his buns off. She's gotten to the point where she comes up to me with those sad brown eyes and looks at me like, "I really need to go potty. Please take me out." Then we go out and she just wants to root around in the snow for mice. Faked me out again!

But I always take her out if she wants to. Never know if it's the real bomb dropper and it's good for me.

Cecil you crack me up! ROFL! "The real bomb dropper!"

quote Anna, "Burger, I like your idea but we are talking about animals who can lick their .... and not die from it."

Point well taken, Anna. I was really meaning mainly for human consumption, I do the bleach soak with all meat, and veggies, fruits, especially those that you pop right into your mouth, cherries, grapes, etc. Even the packaged lettuce and such, has been found to be contaminated. Cant be too careful now days for you and family.

Most of the cats and dogs in my neighborhood eat more rice than meat. They get the left overs and those are usually rice and a few vegetable scraps, fish bones if they are lucky.

Most of them forage, mice, rats, snakes, lizards and any bug they can catch.

The dogs, like most of the people are rail thin.

But, I believe that the dogs like the people build up immunities to a lot the harmful bacteria that they encounter, plus their systems become adjusted to their diet.

If Luna want's to go out, she can. I don't need a leash, or ever have to get cold. 'cept when she want's her cookies' then I have to open the door. She knows when it is time to come in. Plus the squirrels and chipmunks would not keep warm without her chasing them. See, It all works