Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations Why a these little guys dying?

1/2 acre pond, very few weeds, Vertex Air 1 Plus aeration, water is 2' low, didn't take temp but it's been a cool summer. I haven't applied any chemicals in 5 weeks. I've only used low doses of Cutrine plus and about 1/4 gallon of Aquashade.

I found 60 of these little guys floating tonight. I think they're LMB. I also found two 5" BG but they were likely C&R mortalities. All other fish are eating well (mix of AM 400, 500, and LM). The water looks good, no unusual weather except it's been a fairly cool summer.

What would cause this? I'll have to check with Dad to see if the beans in the adjacent field were sprayed recently to eliminate pesticides.

I also find it strange that these tasty little critters weren't eaten since they're only about 2 1/2" long.

Do they have anything themselves to eat?

Ryan:

Are there any Yellow Perch in the pond?

The dye isn't helping any. It kills plankton, which are the base of the foodchain in any pond, and which would normally be the main food of bass that size.

I could be wrong but those actually look like YOY YP...

As far as why they are dying, that could be a large number of things...

My thoughts exactly! They don't look that thin, but with this warm spell, and low rainfall (although I don't know how Ohio is doing), water temps are changing rapidly. Too warm for itsy bitsy yellow perch?

YOY YP are usually the most hardy when it comes to warm waters. It is the big ones, say over 12" that seem to struggle in warmer waters. The faint striping and smaller mouth as well as the black edging to the dorsal fins are what makes me believe they are YP and not bass. This has been a weird weather summer, water condition maybe changing more rapidly than young fish can handle and this could be a factor?

They definitely look like YP to me.

I thought they looked like YP too but I've only put 4 in the pond and two have ended up in the fryer. Could they just be inbreds?

Oh yeah, they're really isn't any spawning structure for them unless Chip Rowlands Sputnik fish attractors count.

It's been record cool in Ohio the past couple of months too. 60 degrees this morning 83 this afternoon. Bluebird skys for the past few days with a light breeze.

All were in the same condition. Did have some rain early this week though.

Why the heck didn't the other fish eat them?

Walt, no offense but 2.5" bass fry aren't eating planktonic algae. Bass fry eat zoo plankton but these guys have moved to insects by now. Mouths were about 3/16". 1/4 gallon of Aquashade isn't doing much but give my water a slight blueish tint. It's nowhere near their port-o-potty blue recommended rate.

They look like YP to me too. And like CJ says warm water is not a problem with perch that size. That should not be a factor.

Did you add any wild fish from another body of water?

Now if they were fatheads, which they are not, I'd tell you why they would be dying. A lot of fathead die after spawning. I'm seeing some female fatheads floating right now.

I had a fathead spawn die off in 2003 that looked the same but I can't immagine these are fatheads since I haven't stocked any since. I added two yellow perch in 2006 and two in 2008. Two were also removed in 2008. Outside of one 12 incher the rest were like 6". I figured the other two ended up as bass food. Just seems like a miracle they could have spawned and this many fry survived without encountering more adults.

Come to think of it I did think the dorsal fin looked a bit odd and the vertical stripes a bit strange but I haven't handled many bass this size and never closely observed dead ones this small either.

Maybe those weren't toad eggs in the cattails.

Either way, why the heck are they dying and only them?

I really wish I knew the answer. All it takes is two fish to spawn! Try fishing the bottom with a small FHM or GSH near some structure. If you have more than a handful of YP, you should be able to catch a few.

I couldn't tell what size they were from the pic; I'm aware that LMB of 2.5" wouldn't be still eating plankton. At any rate, I hope you figure it out.

I added those few perch just to see how they'd do. I envisioned them growing great having little competition from other perch but that really wasn't the case and since they're not a priority no more were added. I guess there was a 50% shot of leaving a pair. It's amazing all 4 survived, and the two left could find each other and successfully spawn.

Still doesn't really explain why they're the only ones dying. I don't mind but am more concerned about it happening to my other fish.

If your other fish are eating just fine I wouldn't worry about it. I know a guy that used to work for a fish supplier in Texas. When he asked the owner why some fish died the response was, "Sometimes son fish just daaaaa!"

So did you add any fish from a wild source recently? If so you may have added a pathogen they had not come in contact with. Worst case scenario if that is the case, those that will die will die and the rest will be resistant.

We got our pond back in '98/'99. It was about four years before we even knew we had Yellow Perch in their.

Now, you can catch them a lot. I did add more maybe 5 years ago, I think about (40) of them.

Cecil,

I did add two nice very round 5" bluegills a couple of weeks ago.

I fish for big bluegill by dragging a tiny jig tipped with a 1" piece of worm on the bottom, if there were many perch I surely would have picked one up by now or I would see at least a couple at feeding time.

I'm going to drop in the minnow trap tonight and see what I come up with.

Ryan,

Small perch are notorious for pecking on a bait or for not being hooked. You could be getting hits but not know it.

That said one perch can produce a lot of eggs. Like CJ said it only takes two.

Any largemouth in the pond?

Ryan -

From my experience with Yellow Perch; if 60 died then there are 6,000 that didn't die. They are one of the main forage fish in our pond. LMB think they are candy!

I witnessed a big LMB move up slowly to a school of YOY YP and with one giant suck take out several hundred of them. So many were inhaled that the LMB couldn't handle them all and spit a bunch of them back out. Most of the spitees were in distress and probably died or were eaten by someone else. This could be what happened to your 60 dead ones.

YP have a tough life, but some do survive and grow to adulthood. Well fed LMB will ignore them after 9 inches or so. They are never safe from a large Northern Pike!

Tough life, tough skin, break out the chainsaw at cleaning time!!

All I caught in my minnow trap was Bluegill and one bass about the same size as the fish in the picture but I'm convinced the ones in the picture are perch too. Maybe I got lucky and were all killed off.

No such luck with yellow perch. Too prolific. They are considered a serious exotic in the brook trout country of Maine. The native brookies can't compete with them. Once established you can't get rid of them short of rotenone, but I've even seen where that did not even get rid of them all in a local reservoir.

I've heard of largemouths wiping them out in a pond with no hiding cover but I'm not totally convinced of that.

There are largemouth, HSB and two or three of CC present too. So far, no more floaters.

Here's one of the perch we removed. It was actually my daughers first solo cast, hook, and pull out of the water. As you can see this isn't exactly a record breaker and Wr is pretty low.



The LMB and HSB seem to be fine though.



Could that little patch of cattails been the structure they used for spawning?

I wouldn't exactly say that YP has a low Wr yet.

Good thing is you have a reproducting YP population now!