Pond Boss Forums MANAGING AN EXISTING POND Evaluating and adjusting fish populations looking for advise on feeding CC and growing LMB

My pond is about one acre, 8' at the deepest point clean/clear H2O with run off from wooded area,lots of fesh water muscles, no algae or weed issues and adequate structure.

The pond was not managed for years resulting in an overpopulation of stunted sun fish and thin LMB 8"-10".

Added 25 LMB 8'-10' and 50 CC three years ago and installed a diffuser aeration system. Culled out lots of sunfish and continue to do so. The goal is to grow larger LMB.

Now the LMB are 12'-14'plus and healthy and the CC are growing very well.

So here are my questions.

+How should I go about culling the sun fish yet maintain a good forage base and continue to grow healthy bass? What size/sex/quanity should be culled?

+Should I be culling any LMB? So far LMB have been strictly catch and release.

+At what point will CC start eating the forage base and should this be a concern in growing bigger LMB?

+I want to start keeping some of the CC...yum...yum... and replace them (I understand that they will not reproduce without proper structure).

+I am thinking about installing a feeder for the CC in an attempt to get them bigger,quicker. Will these CC take to fish chow? I'm not interested in feeding the sun fish so should I use larger floating chow? Is this workable without somehow screwing up my goal for LMB?

+What additional questions or concernes should be considered?

+Your feedback would be great!

Many thanks.














CC

First off, welcome to the Pond Boss Forum! You'll quickly find out there are lots of guys on here who know their stuff and guys like me who think they do... HAHA Anyways, hold on tightly and the experts will be here to answer your questions...

If your primary goal is quality size largemouth bass(LMB) then I would not worry too much about culling the sunfish. They are your pond's forage base for the LMB.

You need to find out the relative weight of your LMB to determine if they are over populated. If they are, then you will need to start thinning out some to give them more food to eat. Normally ponds that go unmanaged have many small LMB and some very nice sized sunfish. Your pond didn't seem to have either... Now it appears you have helped the LMB out but you may still need to thin some out. Do you have pictures of some of the bass caught from your pond? Sometimes one can see just how healthy the bass are by pictures alone. Culling the sunfish out is not helping your LMB. You want as many of the little buggers as possible for a forage base for your LMB so don't cull anymore if your sole interest is larger LMB.

When channel cats(CC) get to about 16" or about 2 lbs is when they start to directly compete with the LMB for food in my experience. If you start a feeding program, the CC will definitely take advantage of this and will not compete as much with your LMB. I am not aware of any specific food that will be eaten by CC but not by sunfish. Feeding the sunfish may not be a bad thing. They will reproduce better and will give more forage for your LMB. I would recommend you start a feeding program. Most guys on here seem to be fans of Aquamax, so if you have a source of that in your area you may wanna go with it.

You are correct that CC will not reproduce in your pond without the correct structure. For a beginner pond owner, this is a good thing as you can directly control the number of CC in your pond through put and take.

I am sure many other guys will give you their advice as well. Trust me, you have found the right place to have your questions answered correctly! Best of luck and again, welcome to Pond Boss!

Howdy, lovetofish, and welcome to the forum!

Our number of central Ohio members expands again. I was darn near in Worthington tonight (71 & 270 on the way to/from Clintonville).

Good advice above. I would like to give my $0.02 worth point by point.


As noted, removing a lot of BG from a big bass pond is taking food out of your bass' mouths. Taking reasonable numbers out for the table is more allowable if you learn to sex your BG and try to leave females and remove males. True trophy bass managers give me the impression that they don't really want many if any BG at all removed.


You should be removing the thinnest LMB from the size group(s) that are the most numerous. Measuring the RW of the fish you catch is the best way to determine which ones are doing poorly and which are the fattest (and hence may be presumed to be growing best).


CC start becoming good piscivores at 1-2 lbs and, IMHO, get much better as there size increases. If big bass are more important to you than having a whole bunch of CC, hold the size and numbers of CC down. They are pretty easy to find in larger sizes to allow safe restocking in a pond with larger bass, so you can keep numbers fairly low and restock every 1-2 years to replace losses.


CC take to pelleted fish food as easy as any species normally found in ponds. Mine were eating very well within just a few days of when I began feeding. I like eating them when they are between 2 and 4 pounds; any bigger and they fillets require subdividing to cook properly.

I feed a few hundred pounds of Aquamax each year, but it really has higher protein than is needed for CC growth. If I were you I would go with Purina Game Fish Chow or another good feed in the 30-32% protein range. As CJBS stated, any fish food your BG eat will increase the forage base for the bass - that's really a good thing. You can maximize the % the CC get for themselves by manupulating how, when, and how much you feed. IME CC will push BG out of a small area to hog the feed, and they will eat more at one sitting than BG can. So if you feed once a day in a small area, the cats should get the lion's share.


For one, aeration.

what do you mean by measuring the RW of the bass that i catch?

can you give me some guidelines to determine relative weight and what i should be shooting for?

lovetofish,

Length vs. weight calculations will tell you relative weight. A relative weight of 100 is the "standard" or ideal bass weight. You weigh and measure each fish and then use a RW chart to determine where your bass fit.

Greg Grimes's website has a RW chart, but he is in the south (GA). I recall RW calculations being different for northern vs. southern fish.

Here is a link to a RW table on Greg's site: http://www.lakework.com/articles.php

great advice not much else to add. cjbs I would say you are an expert after reading that. Davasta thanks for link. The Wr chart I feel applies anywhere you just need to see what you want. If you want 75% Wr on lmb (for growing bigger BG) you can use the chart, if you want 125% like quality bass clients works as well. It is an index so fine to look at once but best if used over time to track if you are on way to acheving goals or not.

Love to fish you will see a chart on bluegill as well. I will echo the thoughts of others. First thing you need to do is clearly define your pond goals, what species do you want to maximize, or do you want good of each, etc. Post these and folks can better define a harvest plan, feeding plan, etc. Glad to have you on here and great first list of questions.

many thanks!

Also Lovetofish I would recommend that you buy some of Bob Lusk's books. There are three in particular that I keep as reference guides and have read them over and over and they are "Basic Pond Management", "Raising Trophy Bass" and "Water Weeds and Algae." These are excellent primers to teach a novice such as myself the basics of pond & fish managment. I have't yet purchased "Perfect Pond" yet because I'm stupid.

This feedback is great but has increased cabin feaver to new heights! Now a new qestion. Will the LMB take fish chow...and if so what should I expect as a result?

opps..question

Unless you buy them feedtrained (or feedtrain them yourself before putting them in the pond), probably not.

A few of us here have LMB that self-feedtrained (myself, DD1, and Catmandoo, off the top of my head), but it does not happen in most ponds.

As for results, pellet eating bass usually get first priority on the food (over BG & CC) once they reach a pound or two, so feeding over a larger area might be a good idea to give other fish a better chance to eat. Your pond would support more pounds of bass than if they don't eat pellets - whether that means more small, fat bass or a few large fat bass will depend on LMB number management. Bass fed exclusively on pellets are reported to "peak out" at a certain weight range (5-6 pounds, IIRC) but I suspect bass that get plenty of forage in addition to pellets avoid this or some other potential health problems.

thanks. why would a pond support more pounds of bass if they don't eat pellets?

The more you feed the bluegill the more weight and reporduciton cpacity they have to then feed the bass.

thanks. I'll feed those critters