Pond Boss Forums AQUATIC VEGETATION Controlling unwanted plants Black Locust

Hello all. I am new to this site and to ponds. We purchased a farm 2 years ago that has a 1/2 acre pond on it. The East side is all grass (watershed) sloping into pond, South is pine trees, West and North side are inundated with Black Locust. So Tall that if I were to cut them down and they fell on the pond you could walk across them! Oh, the North, south and West sides are banked of course. My dilemma, how do I get rid of the black locust without putting holes in my dam! The root system on these trees is very extensive. I can use the trees themselves for fence posts and firewood but I would like to get rid of the root system since these trees grow like weeds! I cut most of the ones on the South side down but then I have to deal with the stumps and I wanted to be able to mow around the pond. Also, If you don't get rid of the roots they grow back worse than before. The ones I cut down last year have sprouted new growth that is now a wall that you cannot walk through on that side. If I pull the stumps out with my tractor the whole bank will cave I just know it! HELP!

Horseball. Welcome to the site.

I am not the expert that I am sure will come up with better answers very soon. I do know there is a chemical which you can spray on the locust stumps right after you cut them down. It goes a long way toward keeping them from sprouting. I don't know the name of that particular herbicide, but I bet someone here does. I hired a couple of guys to cut some of my black locusts a few years ago and it did a great job.

Bing

Hi horseball, and welcome.

I wouldn't worry too much about the black locust roots. Locust is known for being termite and rot resistant in damp ground.

If you can cut the stumps low enough, you can bush hog over them 3-4 times a year, they will finally die in a year or 2. If not, you can apply a very strong solution of 2,4-D to the fresh cut stumps, and they won't re-grow.

Treat the cut stump with Tordon RTU. Its made for that use. Kills the roots so the tree will not resprout from the stump.

24d will slow the growth at the stump but the root system will generate a hundred shoots...thatss a major difference between black locust and honey locust is the spreading of new plants by the root system.

horseball:

If the trees are on the dam itself and over 4" or so in diameter, it is generally recommended to trim them (to reduce their sail area and lower the risk of them blowing over) and leave them in place, unless the dam is goin gto be reworked (dirt-wise) to completely remove the stumps.

I had to deal with Black Locust at my In-Laws' place. You didn't mention those fun thorns, IIRC.

Thank you all for your time and input! I am going to look into those two chemicals mentioned 2,4-D and Tordon RTU to purchase and treat the stumps with. I'm guessing that if I cut the stumps that are already cut down lower and treat it should work the same as if they were freshly cut down. We shall see. As far as the ones I haven't cut down yet....if they are over 4" in diameter why is it not recommended to cut them down? They are too tall for me to trim anything. If you have dealt with them you know how they shoot for the stars! And yes, those lovely thorns that eat lawnmower tires and arms and legs, etc:) And all the crap that falls in my pond from them, which is why I want to cut them down:) My pond has other issues besides the black locust but not sure if this is the place to bring them up. Have murky water and can't see my fish but know they are in there because we fished some bass and blue gill and sunny from a friends pond and dumped them in and have no floaters. The bass were about f10-12" and I have noticed a decrease in the frog population. Also, I have NO growth which leads me to believe that my water is acidic and will have to have it tested. I am thinking that I will need to add lime and that will settle it and sweeten it up. I have tall grasses around the East side where the sun hits all the time but not in the shaded areas. There is brush and trees all the way to edge of pond on those 3 sides where the trees are. Should I let more sun get to the pond or what? I have sooo many questions and issues with my pond. Also, the water has a faint smell to it sometimes when my dogs are swimming near the edge. Also, have killed 3 snapping turtles in the road but have not seen any in, near, or around my pond but they must be there? There are quite a few ponds nearby. Whew. I could go on and on.

horseball:

With larger trees, we worry about the large roots producing voids through the dam (and hence paths for water to seep through and degrade the dam) if the trees are killed.

I know Black Locust is a known rot-resistant wood - My ILs had all BL fence posts, and I have a few on my place - but I would still worry stumps & roots may rot worse than trunk wood. My Osage Orange fence posts, for example, will last for many decades, but the sapwood in the stumps disppaears much faster than the heartwood from either the stumps or the trunks.

I would suggest separate threads for your other concerns; it greatly increases their value as reference material for the next PM with that problem.

Thank you Theo Gallus. That's what I thought. Looks like I'm stuck with the big ones. They are so prolific though that having just one assures a new crop every year. Sounds like alot of maintenance to keep them at bay! Oh well. I will definitely post other questions in appropriate places. Thanks again!

Another way to get rid of the ones you want to use for firewood is to girdle them. Run the chainsaw around the trunk in 2 circles 1-2" deep, and if you want to be real sure also douse the girdles in herbicide. For some reason girdling usually keeps black locust from root and stump sprouting. If any of them are 12" diameter (not around) or more, cut them at least 8' long and get them to a sawmill. Black locust is beautiful wood, and they also make great dimensional lumber for exposure to moisture and the ground.

I've never heard of girdling but I'm sure going to try it! Thanks. Anything to get rid of those pesky thorns! What do you mean by dimensional lumber?

Dimensional lumber is for construction: 2x4, 2x6, 4x4, etc. Black locust makes great deck(or dock) construction wood. Now if you wanted some great outdoor furniture you would not cut it to dimensional sizes. You would ask to have it cut into the thickness you wanted and sawyer would try to maximize the board width for that thickness. These sizes are 4/4, 6/4, etc. and represent the inches by the 1/4". 4/4 is one inch, 6/4 is 1-1/2". You end up with more wood, but would need to rip them down to the sizes you need when use them. My local sawyer charges $90 and hour(a bit high) and cut 2 of my trees in 45 minutes. The same wood would have cost me about $250 at the big box stores. I attached an image of a proper girdle. I may be new to ponds, but I know wood.

Are you sure you are dealing with Black Locust ? Honey Locust has the killer spikes and thorns. (thorn pic) The only thorns on Black Locust are short spikes at the base of the leaf.

If you girdle a black locust you will create a firestorm of new sprouts...not a few dozen...hundreds!! Honey locust you can get away with but not black locust

"If you girdle a black locust you will create a firestorm of new sprouts...not a few dozen...hundreds!! Honey locust you can get away with but not black locust "

Yes, I forgot to add that right after girdling apply herbicide to the cut area. I used Garlon 3a on a fence row(garlon 4 may also work), you must use one that works on cut surfaces and not just foliar. The girdle kills the tree and the herbicide should stop most of the sprouts from the roots out. Since the tree is girdled it is still alive enough to distribute the herbicide. If you just cut it down you will need to mow the sprouts constantly for a couple of years or apply foliar herbicide over a wide area. If it has lots of thorns and they each have 3 points, then it is probably honey locust. Easier to kill, but the wood is not as rot resistant. It may not make good posts.

FYI...Garlon 4 is same thing as Remedy. Some farm stores dont carry Garlon but they will have Remedy.

Have killed hundreds of Locust on our property in Montague County & here on our farm in Oak Point and will offer my opinion as to how to get rid of them. Had some that were 60-80' tall growing right next to Red oaks, so trunk sprayed them with Remedy/diesel at 25%Remedy with pump-up sprayer. I was very very careful not to get any on desirable trees. With this method there was some root sprouting the next year that required respraying.I found the Remedy/Reclaim leaf application for smaller Locust to be unreliable. Surmount is a fairly new product that has worked really well as a leaf application with essentially no regrowth(2 years). It needs to be used with a particular surfactant(Inergy). Locust are a lot like Mesquite in that you really never get done spraying, but the job gets easier every year..