Pond Boss Forums POND CONSTRUCTION Creating habitat To leave or not

I am still in my planning/prep stages...currently removing trees.

I have an option of creating a shallow area to about 6 - 8 feet deep between the shore and an island that would drop off pretty quickly to 15-20 feet on the other side of the island. Anyway, on the island, my option is to leave a large loblolly pine or remove it and replace with maybe a cypress. Do you guys think the pine would drown or rot? The trunk would be out of the water by 1 - 2 feet, but the roots, well you know. I'd like to leave it if it will survive, but would rather take it out now if it will not.

Thanks for your advise.

Gunny

I think this primarily depends on the size of the island as well. If the roots of the tree aren't constantly submerged, you could have a decent chance. Maybe bowl the clay up the sides of the island to keep the island itself dry? I would be partial to a knobby cyprus myself, but if it ain't broke...

Went here: http://www.ncsu.edu/project/dendrology/i...blollypine.html

...and then clicked on "Range and Habitat" and read:

The term "loblolly" literally means "mudhole" which can be used to describe the wet soil conditions on which this tree occurs naturally. Their best growth is on moderately acid soils in areas of poor surface drainage which consists of a thick, medium-textured surface layer and fine-textured subsoil. They do not grow well, however, on very wet or water-logged sites, or in areas with shallow or eroded soils.

Gunny:
I have been involved in lots of island building and my experience is that the tree will not live. Best to take it out now.
Otto

I agree with Otto. Perhaps a willow or cypress would do fine, but a pine just seems doomed. A shallow rooted shrub would probably be fine also.

Big time bummer...it would have been gorgeous!!! I will probably go bald cyprus...like them alot as well.

Thanks for the bad news

Gunny

I don't know anything about trees or building ponds, so naturally I'm going to chime in.

I live in an area with a lot of Loblolly pine and a lot of ponds. Many of the ponds here have been built incorrectly I'm sure. I often see examples of what appear to be very well established pines on small islands and very near the shorelines. To my untrained eye the trees look perfectly healthy.

I guess I would just ask what is the worst case scenario if the tree eventually dies. I should add that I'm the type of person who would leave a fallen tree in their pond, so take anything I say with a block of salt.

Here's my neighbor's 7 acre pond. The pond was built about 12 years ago and a few of the trees have died, while most look healthy. The ground around the trees in this video is very close to the water level which is consistent even during drought. (There are two major springs feeding it.)


Here's the same pond again. The barren trees in the foreground are on a small low island. This was taken in the winter and the in summer the trees look healthy. I'm not sure what type they are. The grade actually drops down as you move toward these pines and in wet weather there is usually standing water near to their bases.

click to enlarge

I just want to repeat that I'm not going against the experts who have years of first hand experience. I'm only suggesting that the possibility exists that your tree will do fine, and I'm asking how much risk are you willing to take by leaving it?

When I dug my small 3/4 acre pond, I piles up some dirt to create a small island. It's probably 15 by 30 ft in size. My goal was to give the ducks a place to spend the night and be safe from preditors.

About two years later, loblolly pines started to grow on it. One it way ahead of the others, but in all, I have 7 pines growing on that little island. I'm going to let them do their thing as they started from seed on their own. My guess is that they will do fine and have already added allot of beauty to my island.

Mature trees have a way of being fickle. I've had them die for very minor distubances, and I've had others live that I've taken off half the bark and a bunch of roots.

The problem you have is that if it dies, you might not know it for two years. Sometimes that's how long it takes these things to show up.

Another consideration with bigger trees is if you've removed all the surrounding trees from around it. Those trees all help each other withstand the winds. If it grew by itself, it's root system is very strong, but when it grows in a group of trees, it's not as strong when left by itself. A good wind, we soils and maybe some dirt being removed from the area it's in will all add up to an increased risk of it falling over.

If it was me, I'd take it out just because it would be a real pain to deal with when the pond is full. Some trees are worth gambling on, but in this case, it's not.

Eddie

I guess I could leave it in, and if it dies and falls it will create structure throughout the depth of the tank...that just puts any other trees behind a couple years. In talking with the dozer guy, it may be up to 4 feet out of the water...it might be worth the risk, and if not...hello reef.

I'm also going to talk with my biologist to see what she thinks.

Thanks guys.

Gunny

Gunny - From everything I've read, Loblollies like very moist soil, but they don't like constantly "wet feet".

My honest guess is that it will likely provide you several years of service, but in time it'll be reef structure as you said. As it grows larger, there is more risk of it damaging your island should it fall on its own. I would suggest cutting it down if/when it dies off. You could direct it to fall where you want it to serve as your pond structure that way too.

Gunny
Leave the trees, like it has beed said the worse that can happen is you create a good place to fish.

OTTO