Pond Boss
Posted By: Black Bass What should I do next? - 04/13/09 02:24 AM
We bought a house last year with a .75 acre spring fed pond. I'm new to PM but as a biology major I at least knew to survey the resident population. I found BG and some RES were stocked when the pond was built three years ago. There was no sign of any predators aside from a heron and monster snapping turtle. Last year I stocked 60 (5-7" LMB) and 25 CC. The BG spawned and thrived last summer, but my bass didn't grow much despite plenty of YOY BG. There are a lot of bigger BG in the pond, but I am concerned about appropriate sized food for my bass and CC.

Two weeks ago I put in 200 FHM, but after seeing how little fish that actually was I am thinking I need more of something. Should I add more small BG, more FHM, something else or let the scenario play out? Considering the BG were unchecked for several years the bass should be bigger, right?

Pond is healthy and we plan on switching over to feed in a couple weeks here for the CC and BG to help the LMB grow. I did some fishing/sampling today and did catch a hungry, but skinny 8.5" LMB, so they did survive the winter and did more growing than I thought.

Thanks in advance, I am very impressed with PB and it's well informed members.
Posted By: Theo Gallus Re: What should I do next? - 04/13/09 02:46 AM
Hello, BB, welcome to PB.

That limited amount of growth does seem curiously small if there were plenty of small BG and if the bass have been in for a whole year. 60 does not sound like way too many bass.

1. When did you add the bass?
2. Were they bought commercially or transferred from another BOW?
3. What kind of growth did the CC have?
4. Can you tell us more about the BG population? Maybe they spawned but did not produce many offspring.

Feeding should help the CC directly and the LMB indirectly (by promoting better BG spawning). It would be very hard/expensive to establish a breeding population of FHM at this time; let's figure out how to tweak your permanent forage base if needed.
Posted By: CJBS2003 Re: What should I do next? - 04/13/09 03:32 AM
I agree that 60 LMB of 5"-7" is not too many for a .75 acre pond. In fact I would say it is just about right, maybe a tad on the light side...

I too am baffled why the growth of your LMB is so slow. As Theo said, adding more FHM is just a VERY expensive feeding regime. It's hard enough to establish FHM before stocking bass and about impossible after you have stocked them.

A couple other questions for you:

Is there aquatic vegetation in the pond? Species, % of pond covered?

Substrate the pond is made out of? Mud, clay, sand etc?

Have you done a seine survey of your pond, if so what were the results?
Posted By: Black Bass Re: What should I do next? - 04/13/09 04:34 AM
I added the LMB around this time last year. They were bought from a commercial fish dealer in OH. On a few occasions I did see the bass actively harass the BG, but they spent most of their time slurping on the surface (possibly feed raised?).

I have never seen the catfish in the pond. I have a 10' hole that is roughly 20 x 30. I would bet the catifsh are spending most of their time in this hole, but I have never been able to catch one. My bait is instantly gobbled up by the aggressive BG. I plan on starting the feeding program this week and will hopefully start seeing the elusive CC.

I know that I have BG and RES in the pond, but from what I have seen I have a suspicion that my BG are hybrids. I have not spent sufficient time to analyze the BG to determine what exactly I have. The fish are generally 3-6".

The BG did spawn and during that time there were fry all over the pond and we saw BG of all sizes for awhile. However I did notice that the nest sites were concentrated to a small portion of the pond although most of the pond would make good spawning habitat. For the amount of fish in the pond the nest sites seemed off. They weren't a lot of them and the spawning seemed some what shortlived. This leads me to think I may have hybrids, hence less females and nesting sites (I could be wrong). Post spawn the water became very clear. It was the clearest I have ever seen it and I think it may have been a less than ideal situation for the BG fry's survival.(The pond was managed by a company last summer that killed the growth once or twice a month. Could be the reason for the poor water quality).

CJB...

There is a good amount of vegetation in the pond during late spring-summer. At its peak I would say 40%. The vegetation is predominantly a thin filamentous plant that currently is in clumps with columns rising just below the surface.

I did not build the pond and honestly I do not know. The pond has a muddy/silty bottom, but there are several sand/gravel pits in the area. Generally the pond has a dark green color with a good amount of eutraphication. The pond is spring fed and it is technically part of a watershed that includes several farms.

Finally I have not yet done a seine survey. My knowledge of the fish population is based off of both fishing sampling and visual confirmations. I do plan on casting nets once the fish become more active. Current water temps are 50F.




Posted By: CJBS2003 Re: What should I do next? - 04/13/09 05:18 AM
Hybrid BG may explain low reproduction rates...

pure BG:



hybrid BG:



Depending on how the cross was made, male BG x female GSF or vice versa males can outnumber females by more than 9 to 1... This leads to low reproduction. As you said your pond had no bass in it, which may be why hybrids were used, if in fact they were. See if you can hook a few and take some pictures if you are unsure. Or as the weather warms and you want to do a seine survey take photos and we'll try to identify what you have. Hybrids will back cross to parental species but this is not ideal. You may need to stock pure blooded BG. In a couple years they should out compete your hybrids which will eventually die off.

The bass slurping on the surface is interesting and may indicate feed trained fish. It has now been a year since they were fed, but they may pick up on it if you begin a new feeding program. I am not the guy to talk about feeding though. Theo and others have far more knowledge in that area.

As far as the CC go, you didn't mention how large they were at stocking but as long as they were 6" plus I doubt they were eaten unless you have an otter issue. Once you start feeding you should see them. .75 acres isn't that vast an area for them to hide in...

Once we learn a little more about your fish population, we can start to figure out how to help your bass out more.
Posted By: 2catmom Re: What should I do next? - 04/13/09 11:52 AM
BLACK BASS:
Welcome to the Pond Boss Family of like-minded folk. With your biology talents you will be a great contributor to this great site!
Posted By: jeffhasapond Re: What should I do next? - 04/13/09 02:41 PM
 Originally Posted By: CJBS2003
The bass slurping on the surface is interesting and may indicate feed trained fish. It has now been a year since they were fed, but they may pick up on it if you begin a new feeding program. I am not the guy to talk about feeding though. Theo and others have far more knowledge in that area.


Couldn't this "slurping" also be the bass "piping" as in low DO in the pond? Have you checked the pond's DO during the observance of this "slurping"? I don't know, I'm no expert, more like one of the village idiots, but I seem to recall reading that fishing piping, slurping, gulping, or singing Barry Manilow songs while at the surface of water is not a good sign.
Posted By: ewest Re: What should I do next? - 04/13/09 02:53 PM
Welcome Black Bass. Here is a link to Bruce's archive on Common pond fish primer (sunfish edition) which should help with id. Also look at the second link on various HBG pics.

http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=92482#Post92482


HBG pic/question - http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=1341&Number=14459#Post14459

Can you provide info on the size and numbers of BG/HBG - population status ( do you see lots of 2-3 inch BG ?). If you saw tons of BG yoy then then you have some regular BG in #s. In most HBG studies where LMB are present very , very few to 0 HBG offspring survive to 1 year. It is a combo of what CJ said wrt male % and #s and predation by LMB.
Posted By: Black Bass Re: What should I do next? - 04/13/09 09:19 PM
Alright tons of good info and insights. I plan on doing some more fishing today (w/ nightcrawlers) to get pictures and sizes. The water is still cold here in Northern Ohio and very dark so I am not seeing a lot of fish right now.

The late spring/summer behavior of the bass was similar to rising trout right before the quick "hit and run action", they were in the open at the surface waiting for something. I really have never seen this behavior before, but I've never raised bass either. I do not know the DO content, but I plan on testing it. The pond is spring fed and the water is always moving down the drainage pipe, but it is possible the DO could be low especially in the summer.

The HBG vs BG identification is tricky so I will post pictures tonight or tomorrow of what I see.
Posted By: Black Bass Re: What should I do next? - 04/14/09 02:55 AM
Alright I have taken several pictures of the fish I caught tonight. The fish ranged from 3" - 6". I think I have two or three kinds of fish here.

#1
[img]http://www2.snapfish.com/slideshow/AlbumID=354314008/PictureID=9272118008/a=28825360_28825360/t_=28825360[/img]

#2
[img]http://www2.snapfish.com/slideshow/AlbumID=354314008/PictureID=9272118008/a=28825360_28825360/t_=28825360[/img]

#3
[img]http://www2.snapfish.com/slideshow/AlbumID=354314008/PictureID=9272118008/a=28825360_28825360/t_=28825360[/img]

#4
[img]http://www2.snapfish.com/slideshow/AlbumID=354314008/PictureID=9272118008/a=28825360_28825360/t_=28825360[/img]

The fish were very active despite cold water. I also realized that I am having issues seeing the fish. There must of been 60 fish in 2' of water just off the shore, but I really couldn't see them until I brought them in close. I did catch a LMB he was 6" but looked as if he was getting a belly on him (maybe my FHM did the trick). I caught fish everywhere in the lake and it took no longer then 8 seconds to get a hit. Also I did see a few smaller fish nibbling in the shallows at my bait, maybe 2-2.5".

Finally I heard what sounded like a bass ambushing forage. I heard a big splash then looked over and saw water flying and big ripples, this was no 6" LMB. Maybe there is a big one in there after all (Still very skeptical). We recently did stock white amur w/ the FHM and I was told that they do break water sometimes, but do they make loud splashing sounds?

First time posting pics, hope it works
Posted By: Black Bass Re: What should I do next? - 04/14/09 03:31 AM
Sorry the images didn't upload...Here is my second attempt.

So this is what I am thinking after reading through the HBG thread...Please let me know what you think.

Hybrid #1



Red Ear Sunfish x GSF



Smaller fish maybe a BG x HBG #1



Another Hybrid #1 that looks like it is a HBG x GSF



There is a whole mess of panfish species in my pond right now. Little to no predation lets nature run wild. Now what the heck do I do to get my bass going in this genetic cess pool?
Posted By: burgermeister Re: What should I do next? - 04/14/09 04:13 AM
I think there's been hanky panky with a greenie in all the pics.
Posted By: CJBS2003 Re: What should I do next? - 04/14/09 08:28 AM
Wow! You weren't kidding when you said you had a sunfish hybrid mix of a pond! When dealing with hybrid sunfish, its really hard to have completely accurate ID's without looking at the gill rakers, but I'll give it my best.


 Originally Posted By: Black Bass


I am guessing a BGxBGxGSF as in a sunfish that is 3/4 BG, 1/4 GSF. Although it maybe a rare female BGxGSF hybrid.


It maybe a RESxGSF as you said, but I am thinking it is more likely just a BGXGSF. The red or orange on the opercle is often times seen in a pure GSF and may just be particularly strong in this fish.


Looks like a pure BG to me.



Like the first pic, I am guessing a BGxBGxGSF as in a sunfish that is 3/4 BG, 1/4 GSF. Although it maybe a rare female BGxGSF hybrid but since their are two of them now, more likely the BGxBGxGSF theory...


I am still a bit baffled as to why the bass growth was so slow. Granted there is a substantial amount of hybrids in your pond but you mentioned seeing numerous YOY sunfish last year and there does seem to be some pure BG in your pond. I think a seine survey may help break down the percentages of each hybrid and pure bred. Also, what is your end goal? Large trophy bass, balanced fishery or trophy sunfish?
Posted By: Black Bass Re: What should I do next? - 04/14/09 01:10 PM
CJB I definitely think a seine survey is in order. I need to know how much food is available for my bass.

Ultimately I would like to have a trophy bass type fishery, but wouldn't mind a balanced fishery with a focus on larger bass.I understand ecosystems do not change overnight, but I am willing to put the work into it to achieve my goals.

There very well could be a few bass that are developing nicely, but yesterday was the first sign I've seen.

I will find out the distribution and size of the sunfish species before doing anything else.

Thanks for your help. I will talk to you guys a bit later after my survey.
Posted By: bobad Re: What should I do next? - 04/14/09 01:51 PM
If the seine survey of your sunfish lollapalooza shows a good population, it's possible that excessive cover is keeping the LMB skinny. A long shot could be the CC are intimidating and chasing the LMB, making them stay in hiding instead of foraging aggressively. A very long shot would be disease or water quality issues.
Posted By: esshup Re: What should I do next? - 04/14/09 02:27 PM
CJ:
I'm betting that the 2nd pic is a Greenie/pumpkinseed hybrid. Thoughts?

That pond IS a melting pot of sunfish!
Posted By: CJBS2003 Re: What should I do next? - 04/15/09 03:05 AM
Alright Black Bass, when you've done a seine survey let us know what you end up with. I would wait until early June or so to make sure your bass have had a chance to spawn. That will give you the best results. For a good guide check this Link out. Lots of good info in it...

It might be esshup... There was no mention of PS being stocked, but you never know what was snuck in! In small managed ponds, you usually know what species of sunfish are in there, so its easier to identify hybrids. In larger lakes where there can be a half dozen or more different sunfish species, it can get more challenging! Here is a known PSxGSF hybrid.



But like I said, without seeing gill rakers, most of the ID's are just guestimations...
Posted By: Black Bass Re: What should I do next? - 04/15/09 03:41 AM
Thanks for all the advice guys, btw CJB the link above was helpful. I'll check back in after I get a better understanding of my fish population.
Posted By: CJBS2003 Re: What should I do next? - 04/15/09 12:37 PM
Sounds good, best of luck... We'll be here to help!
Posted By: Black Bass Re: What should I do next? - 05/01/09 02:47 AM
Alright people it's been awhile since I've posted and I thought I would check in as I have more questions as the scene at the pond gets weirder.

Alright the last two weeks I have started feeding my fish and today in a light drizzle saw my first action. Fish in NE corner of the pond were very active once the food made it to the covered edge.

I've been fishing at least 4 days a week and I have seen more of the same with the sunfish. It looks like I have three different species in there. Most of what I catch looks like either the pumpkinseed x GSF or what we thought were pure BG from above. When the water cleared on Monday I saw tons of small YOY fish, but what I'm catching are these larger sunfish or BG(60% 5"+).

I have also found the bass and what I'm seeing is not encouraging. The bass are still in the 5-7" range and the heads are large compared to the bodies. Maybe this is common at this size, but they just don't look right. I've been catching quite a few and not one has been over 8". The bass need another couple inches to thrive in this pond, but I have a feeling they are really struggling getting there.

I also have caught a couple crappie. Recently I have removed all the barbs on my hooks as I inadvertently had a bass swallow a rooster-tail (As I grabbed the dogs toy out of the water). It was sad as he was a larger one, may of made it but it didn't look good. Anyway I didn't get a pic of the crappie as it fell off as I went to grab it, but this thing was HUGE (at least 12" possibly 14"). The presence of this guy along with two other nice ones I caught are telling me that my LMB aren't the kings of pond.

OK my question is what can I do to favor my LMB? Also I think I need to start harvesting some of these larger sunfish and crappies, but do not want to hurt the reproduction of the sunfish. What size forage fish do I take and what rate of harvest is safe? (Definitely open to all suggestions.)
Posted By: CJBS2003 Re: What should I do next? - 05/01/09 04:02 AM
Well, the word that crappie are in your pond is not a good one if your goal is leaning towards a trophy bass pond... It's not the end of the world though!

First, I would keep every single crappie you catch, from a little 2 incher to the biggest one. They are quite tasty so enjoy the fish fries. Your BG and other mixed sunfish should be spawning within the next month or so. All those new YOY fish will be excellent food for those 7" to 8" LMB. It should help their growth rate. All those YOY fish may actually be baby crappie born this year and not baby sunfish from last year, depending on the size. See if you can get a seine around them or toss a cast net over them to find out what they are for sure.

As your sunfish population grows, most of the hybrids should die out of population and you should end up with mostly BG. This will help increase your forage base.
Posted By: Black Bass Re: What should I do next? - 05/02/09 06:28 AM
I pulled this fatty out tonight. This makes three big crappie this week. This time I kept the guy.

Crappie

(Yeah if something seems off it's my dyslexic ruler)

It's all out war on the crappie for the next couple weeks. I've never specifically targeted crappie before, anyone have any suggestions on lure/bait choices?

I caught tonight's fish on a Spoon (1.5" long) and the other two large ones on a 3" Chartreuse Grub. The little ones seem to enjoy the Grubs too.
Posted By: CJBS2003 Re: What should I do next? - 05/02/09 07:12 AM
Wow! What a pretty and nice crappie...

Maybe your pond is unique and will support a great crappie fishery? Who knows... Lots of guys would be happy to consistently catch crappie like that!

If you're trying to hammer crappie, 1.5"-2" shiner on a size 4-6 hook about 3 feet under a float. A small split shot in between the float and shiner and that rig is deadly this time of year!

If you are going artificial, my old time favorite were the Rebel Ghost minnows that would suspend. I don't think they make them anymore sadly. I also like any other tiny crankbait you can get to stay about 2 to 3 feet deep. You can also use little hair jigs under a float as well with a wax worm on it...
Posted By: Dave Davidson1 Re: What should I do next? - 05/02/09 10:30 AM
I think I would also keep the stunted bass. They are serving no purpose and will never reach their potential.
Posted By: Black Bass Re: What should I do next? - 05/14/09 04:57 PM
Since my last update the water has warmed and things are looking up for my pond. First off I have been targeting the Crappie for removal. So far I have removed 30 5-7" fish and two slabs like the one pictured above. They are becoming harder to catch and to be honest I don't think they are dominating the pond.

Also during the crappie harvesting I have noticed that I have a lot more pure BG then I thought. Once the water hit the upper 50s my BG catches have been 75% pure BG to 25% HBG. Also I caught several large females ripe with eggs, probably ready to spawn in a few weeks.

The fish have taken to the pellets and over all I'm definitely making progress. My bass appear to putting on some weight as well. There is a small drainage pond by my work filled with fingerling BG. I have been putting in 30-40 a week to supplement the bass until the spawn starts. No CC's caught yet, but I've seen a couple while feeding.

Thanks for all the help and I will keep you guys updated.
Posted By: CJBS2003 Re: What should I do next? - 05/14/09 05:02 PM
Sounds good... Looks like things are better off than initially thought.
Posted By: Black Bass Re: What should I do next? - 08/03/09 05:08 AM
Alright this weekend two of my nieces and my future brother-in-law fished the pond pretty heavily and I am learning a lot about the pond. Although it seems that more information only leads to more questions not answers.

Here's a pic of one of the pumpkinseeds we caught. The cell phone does not do the bright orange/red fins justice.



Anyway the majority of the fish caught were sunfish (mix of PS, BG and a few HBG) in the 3-5" range. Only a few were bigger then 5" and a few were a little smaller then 3". We have been fishing with a variety of lures targeting all species and sizes. Here's my estimation per 100 fish caught:

60 PS (2"-5")
15 BG/HBG (3-6")
10 Crappie (6")
5 CC (10-14" 2 pounds)
5 GSF (4-7")
4 LMB (6-9")
1 LMB (14"+)

I am beginning to think that the sunfish are becoming overpopulated. They are not stunted as I feed 5-6 days a week. There are fish everywhere and the bass are growing extremely well this summer as are the CC. The sunfish are multiplying and I feel they are putting a strain on resources and will make recruitment/spawning hell for my LMB next year.

With that said my overall goal for the pond is a productive LMB fishery (Northern Style) with a few trophy here and there. So I have a few questions:

What kind of size distibution and population percentages do I want for my forage fish?

Also what ratio of predators to prey is ideal for my particular management strategy?

I know there are no definitive answers, but I would like some guesstimates from the wise experienced pondmeisters out there. Then we can figure out how to get it to where it needs to be.
Posted By: Dave Davidson1 Re: What should I do next? - 08/03/09 10:52 AM
Recruitment/spawning hell is not a bad thing for LMB in a 3/4 acre pond. If you want larger and healthier bass, I think you had better encourage it. They do a great job of eating themselves out of house and home. Add crappie to the mix and your forage base could wind up in trouble.
Posted By: CJBS2003 Re: What should I do next? - 08/05/09 02:35 AM
That's doesn't look like a PS to me... Looks like a hybrid, perhaps a PSxGSF... Definitely not a pure PS though.
Posted By: Black Bass Re: What should I do next? - 08/05/09 04:01 AM
CJ I've decided to call the fish picture above in my pond PS.


PS occur naturally in our area and I've added over 100 to my pond. The ones I've put in there myself are PS I'm positive of that. They were added as fingerlings and I have a positive ID based off the pic in the last issue of Pond Boss.

I did not do the initial stocking on my pond, but the same BOW that holds the PS can and will join the pond during the early spring when the weeds are gone and the water is high.

My guess is that the original BG/HBG/GSF mix was inundated with a population of PS sometime ago. Keep in mind this BOW's top predators were crappie. Most likely stocked as fingerlings the same time as everything else. So a lot of mingling occurred so to speak. There are a lot of variations on each of the species.


Here are some examples of PS I found on the net, so they may too be hybrids:

Now I believe this is the classic "full color" PS, probably raised in a crystal clear aquarium.



This is what several of my PS look like. Which I would expect for a eutrophic NE Ohio Pond:



Here's another




So CJ I may be wrong but morphologically speaking these fish resemble PS more so then any other species. I guess you'll just need to come up to OH and catch fish with me to see for yourself.

Wait I have a better idea. I can create my own species called Altmann's Hybrid Pumpkinseed...or AHPS for short.
Posted By: Walt Foreman Re: What should I do next? - 08/05/09 04:15 AM
The first fish above almost certainly has some GSF in it; the mouth is too big for a PS, and the fins are colored more like a GSF. The bottom fish looks to be mostly redear to me. Just my $.02.
Posted By: esshup Re: What should I do next? - 08/05/09 01:47 PM
I'll throw my $.02 in the ring. (Where did the cent figure go on the keyboard?)

In the bottom 3 pic sequence, top one is a PSK, middle one is GSF/PSK cross (dorsal, anal and tail edge coloring, unbroken orange on cheek plate, larger mouth, anal fin different shape than PSK in top pic) and the bottom one is a RES/PSK cross.
Posted By: jimmydee Re: What should I do next? - 08/05/09 02:56 PM
I'm obviously not a good identifier (sp?) of the species, except to say they look like real healthy jfish - which I know to be a sign of good water. As these guys say, manage your water and the fish will take car of them selves. Looks like that is what you have goin on there. I'd say "Nice job" in that regrd.
Posted By: Black Bass Re: What should I do next? - 06/23/10 04:37 AM
Well I have waited patiently to see my grass carp and bass roaming the shores after the long hard winter.

Today I have come to the conclusion that a massive fish kill occurred.

Exhibit A: The pond was completely frozen over for 6-8 weeks except for one area. This was a small area where a stream enters the mainly spring fed pond. During this time I saw several of my hybrid sunfish congregating in this area presumably for air

Exhibit B: After ice out the pond reached full pool eclipsing the dam and merged with the wetlands stream that the outflow normally feeds (Which later becomes a river supplying a large local reservoir) that runs behind the dam.

Exhibit C: Pondweed has returned in all its glory with 50-60% coveragewhereas three months after the introduction of the grass carp coverage was 10-15%.

Exhibit D: Small fish are abound in the pond and the only larger fish I have seen are a small group of 20 SMB and some 4-5" BG presumably the fish I had seen congregating by stream inlet. At no other time have some many small fish been available and visible in the pond. It looks like their stalkers are gone.


The problem is I only saw one dead fish and it was an intermediate size BG in April which I thought could of been a GBH casualty.

The fact that the pond reached flood stage after ice out leads me to believe that any floaters were sent over the dam and into the stream.

It pains me that two years of work have been undone, but at the same time I am very optimistic as I stocked the pond before joining Pond Boss.

My LMB did not have an adequate forage base and there was really no way those fish were going to thrive. Tomorrow Rainman will arrive with 10lbs of FHM and GSH which will be split between my two forage ponds. I am now thinking I need to pick up some Northern strain BG as well this fall.

Most importantly I need to add aeration to prevent winter fish kill. How can I do this in an affordable manner for a .66-.75 acre pond? The deepest section of the pond is 8-10 feet.

I'm now thinking that perhaps I should setup a SMB and YP pond instead which the FHM and GSH should help. I have access to three excellent LMB/BG ponds within 10 minutes of my house perhaps I should embrace the fish kill and creat a SMB fishery. CHOICES, CHOICES, CHOICES...
Posted By: Black Bass Re: What should I do next? - 06/29/10 01:20 PM
Yesterday I bought a bag of Game Fish Chow for the pond. I figured in order to determine the current population density I needed to see what was feeding.

After about two or three minutes the water starting "boiling". At first I thought it was oil coming off the food kind of like what you see with Aquamax. Once I looked closer I realized it was small fish surrounding all the pellets. Fish size varied from 0.5"-3" although the distribution was heavily favoring the 0.5" fish.

After fifteen minutes I heard some splashing and saw some larger HBG/BG hitting the feed, but for every large BG there were 500 tiny ones. I waited patiently for the CC to surface if any still remained. After half an hour I decided to take off. I did not spot a single CC or Bullhead which normally hog most if not all of the feed.

My GSH and FHM fell through so sometime this week I will need to call my local bait shop and get three to four lbs of FHM. I am sure of the fish kill now so it's time to start filling the pond with food.

If I do decide to go with YP/SMB what size fish should I purchase to stock and when should they be added?
Posted By: ewest Re: What should I do next? - 06/29/10 02:20 PM
My guess is adult SMB and YP and FH.

I say guess because in order to know what to stock you need to know what is really there. Have you fished for BG , LMB or SMB? Seine survey would be good. The more info the better.
Posted By: esshup Re: What should I do next? - 06/29/10 05:11 PM
Have you tried Jones for the fish? They are in Ohio and deliver.
Posted By: Black Bass Re: What should I do next? - 06/30/10 02:03 AM
I have fished and have been walking the shores everyday. Last year the LMB would follow me around this year nothing anywhere.

That doesn't necessarily mean that they are not there, but agreed if they are there period they will hammer the new fish. I have fished a little bit, but I think after last summer the only way I can take a couple will be with live bait. They know everything in the tackle box.

I have the nieces and nephews in town this week so I think I'll increase my odds and have them help.

I guess I am going to have to start over and find out what's in the pond, again...

Yes I will most likely use Jones in the future. They have been good in the past.

Thanks guys...
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